Bird testing?

[Greg84]

Just to close the loop on this thread.

Originally Posted by camperguy99

No, I don't think you are analyzing the data correctly. In every case the Bird was feeding the Trombetta with >12V, enough to actuate the relay. In every case you had from 0.6V to 1.5V across the should be closed Trombetta contacts. Your Trombetta is toast. Been there done that!

And you Sir are correct!

The Trombetta was toast. I think I'll start to carry a spare along with the spare BIRD that I now have.

Thanks all for the help.

[shspector]

Last January while plugged in at a SW Florida campground, our chassis battery went dead along with our radio, electric sunshade & emergency start switch.
We put a trickle charger on the battery & all returned to normal as long as we left it on.
AS all the Thor dealerships were overwhelmed with customers a few knowledgeable neighbors offered to try & help us out.
The first thing we tried was replacing the original battery with an upgraded new one. After 2 weeks the same issues returned.
After several conversations with Thor we replaced the bird. When that didn't solve anything we replaced the Trombetta and everything returned to normal........until now (6 months later).
The coach is parked on our property on Asheville NC & plugged into a regular garage outlet so I'm able to keep the batteries charged & run a 30 gal dehumidifier. The same problem returned.? I installed another new Trombetta & the original bird that we knew was still good but the issue still remains.
My voltmeter shows 13.6v on the house batteries & on the left side of the trombetta & the right side matches whatever the chassis battery is (if I unplug my battery tender). It appears the chassis battery is draining into the coach.
We're now baffled as to what to try next.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated?

Thanks,

Sam & Judy Spector

[Oneilkeys]

Your symptoms mean that the Trombetta is not opening when the voltage at the coach batteries reach 13.1v. You’ve identified the usual suspects - a bad Trombetta, a broken BIRD. As long as you have your Use/Store in the Use position and that switch is working as it should, I see two other possibilities (but not necessarily probabilities). First, there is a fuse on one of the input wires to my BIRD. I added a second when I rewired my BIRD. Check to see if you have one and replace it - just to be sure. Secondly, the wire coming out of the BIRD that reads “coach battery” must be hooked up to the coach battery and receiving more than 13.1v for the Trombetta to open. If you feel brave, you can cut this wire and attach it directly to the coach battery side of the Trombetta. Then you will be sure that the BIRD is actually receiving the correct voltage. If that is the case then it has to be the BIRD or the Trombetta or the connection between the two. If the BIRD and Trombetta are good, then it must be the connection between the BIRD and the coach battery or between the BIRD and the Trombetta.

[ducksface]

Well this is all a fine mess with every possible problem being had on every possible different coach.

I'll buy one of each component as a carried spare.
Thanks.

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by Oneilkeys

Your symptoms mean that the Trombetta is not opening when the voltage at the coach batteries reach 13.1v. You’ve identified the usual suspects - a bad Trombetta, a broken BIRD

Closing.

Electrical switches, breakers, etc CLOSE to allow electric flow and OPEN to prevent it.

The opposite of water and valves.

[ducksface]

I haven't read where the toggle
Emergency power switch
That is in the center switch console might come into play with all of this.

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by ducksface

I haven't read where the toggle
Emergency power switch
That is in the center switch console might come into play with all of this.

It signals the BIRD to close the Trombetta. It is one of the logic inputs to the BIRD.

[TurnerFam]

I'll add to this discussion that I had a 'similar', but maybe different, problem with my coach last year - I was suddenly losing Inverter power, as the Inverter would suddenly just kick OFF, with no reasoning or explanation, after 4 years of no issues whatsoever.

I first saw this happen while parked overnight at a HD lot. Everything was fine, and I was watching satellite TV, while having a fan next to my bed provide some air flow, and the usually 'device charging' for the phone and laptop, etc. Suddenly, the TV went off. Or, to be precise, the RECEIVER went off, and I saw the 'turn on your receiver' error message on screen.
Very strange, as the TV was still on. But, then I also realized that the fan had stopped, and my phone was no longer charging. Hmmmmmmm..... but the TV was still on!?
Oh, o.k., I said to myself, I remember now that the TV is a Jensen 12v model, and is still powered by the batteries... but, o.k., then, WHY are my other items no longer working? Is the Inverter no longer ON??

Yep, I went to the remote Magnum Inverter panel, and sure enough, there was nothing. No readout, no power, nothing. Never seen this before.
So, like any good person, I pushed the Inverter's ON button, and 'voila, the Inverter was again ON. Great. I think.

A while later, it all happened again! What???! What is the world is going on!?!?!?

I know my House batteries were good, they had water, were watered regularly, were holding a 12.8v charge, and had never any issues with charging them, whether with my solar, or generator, shore power, or the alternator while driving. So..... what could it be?

Later the next morning, when I awoke and before I could crank the engine to leave, I realized again that the inverter was again now OFF, even though I had actually went to sleep the night before while it was still working. Here we go again!....

As I drove to my next destination, I racked my brain about what it could be. The Inverter had always performed flawlessly, so I didn't think that it would now be the real issue. The batteries had always held up well, even the Alaska and back, over 13,000 miles with a lot or dry-camping and overnights without anything other than Inverter power, and the charging systems had not given me any pause.

Could it be the Bird? The Trombetta? A Solenoid? The Alternator?....

The alternator was always showing a good readout, and the Inverter panel was continuing to show a charging to the House batteries while traveling, so, no problems there.
Not knowing much about the other systems, or even much about 'what' they were there for, I investigated what was in my 'Inverter bay' - the Magnum inverter, of course, but also a whole list of devices that, truthfully, I had never bothered to get to know.

A Whiterogers Solenoid, a Trombetta solenoid, a CustomRVProducts device, etc.
At first, I though it was probably not any of these, but maybe a simple issue of my 12v disconnect 'Use/Store' switch somehow going 'bad'...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Long story, longer, I found that it was none of that....

it was, after all....

my batteries. Crazy, I know. ... or more specifically, several bad 'cells' in one of the 4 6v House batteries.

To cut this solution short - I simply removed the battery, drained it, filled it with distilled water, drained again, filled with new battery fluid, and took it through several full charge cycles, over several days.


In the end, the battery was the culprit. It's bad 'cells', although only TWO cells out of the total of 12 for the whole battery bank, was causing the battery bank's OUTPUT, when the Inverter called for power to a load, to fall, even just for an instance, below 12.0 volts, which the Inverter considered too low, and would 'fault', or turn itself OFF, thinking that it was without 12v power.

I found that while I 'thought' I was only enjoying watching TV when these things happened, the 'load' was the residential fridge's compressor kicking on, which requires a larger load on the Inverter, and the batteries.

The 'newly refurbished' battery solved the problem. Thank you. : ) a $10 'fix'.

[ducksface]

Originally Posted by 16ACE27

It signals the BIRD to close the Trombetta. It is one of the logic inputs to the BIRD.

I know it's a momentary switch but what if the contacts were to stick in the closed position?

Just trying to cover what's not been asked so far.

[Bob Denman]

It sounds as if it's time for a song...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Gc4QTqslN4

[slikNSX]

Old thread, great info my 2018 24fe alternator doesn't seem to be charging the house batteries, generator and shore power charges house batteries, going to use this info to troubleshoot, I just purchased the MH 3 weeks ago, after installing inverter I'm realizing the inverter runs out of power when microwave is run for then more 5 second, 2200w pure sine inverter, 2 lead acid marine batteries are for the house batteries, house batteries read 12.8v after shore power connection disconnected, engine running for more then 15min, chassis battery reading 14.3v.... house batteries still read 12.7v.

[rudyhehn]

I didn't pore through all the material on this post but know that the Trombetta relays often fail. If you get a new one buy the upgrade that has silver contacts. They only cost $15 more and last a longer.