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02-19-2018, 07:29 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 6,187
THOR #2121
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Update on 7.xL engine
Had not seen any updates on the V10 replacement until news reports came out a few days ago. The new 7.xL engine plant is under construction and is expected to have engines ready for testing by end of this year. Full production is mentioned in video as May 2019. That should make first engines for 2020 model year vehicles.
https://windsor.ctvnews.ca/work-unde...gine-1.3806712
Other information suggest this "state-of-the-art" new Truck V8 will be a 7.3L based on a Ford oil engine requirement chart (attached).
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02-25-2018, 03:16 AM
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#3
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Senior Member
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 6,187
THOR #2121
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Cummins bashing Ford V10 ????
Rather than start a new thread, I thought I'd post here since it's related to Ford V10.
Cummins has a new series of short videos addressing the advantages of Diesel Pushers over Gas Motorhomes, but to me they come across as pretty critical of the Ford V10.
I'd be interested in your take. Is this honest advertising or excessive bashing? Timing seems odd too since V10 is nearing its replacement.
Mileage and Range:
Hill Climbing:
Engine Braking:
Noise:
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02-25-2018, 03:33 AM
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#4
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: S.O.B.
State: California
Posts: 1,368
THOR #3483
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Cummins
All well and good to compare the two, but, there has to be a huge price difference, no matter what they say. For some, it is a matter of being able to RV or not doing it at all.
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02-25-2018, 05:27 AM
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#5
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Senior Member
State: Alaska
Posts: 295
THOR #8813
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axis earl
All well and good to compare the two, but, there has to be a huge price difference, no matter what they say. For some, it is a matter of being able to RV or not doing it at all.
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55 Really! Traffic hazard!
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02-25-2018, 05:42 AM
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#6
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Senior Member
Brand: DRV
State: Texas
Posts: 678
THOR #3109
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Wish they would compare the two in a campground at 6AM when warming up to leave....
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2016 Tiffin 40QBH
2015 38RSSA--traded
2005 36TK3--retired, but it was a good one
2017 F450 KR
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02-25-2018, 05:46 AM
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#7
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Senior Member
State: Alaska
Posts: 295
THOR #8813
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wingnut60
Wish they would compare the two in a campground at 6AM when warming up to leave....
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Yep, they are some noisy suckers!
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02-25-2018, 05:47 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 22FE
State: Washington
Posts: 270
THOR #8606
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I would have loved to buy a diesel pusher like the one in the video but cost is way outa my ball park. As a retired old guy, I could just barely justify and afford my Class C. And, 55 mph, really?
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02-25-2018, 05:51 AM
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#9
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: S.O.B.
State: California
Posts: 1,368
THOR #3483
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carlgorski
55 Really! Traffic hazard!
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7 mph.... great if you have the money to get one. Not knocking a diesel but not all are in the market for pocketbook reasons. I don't knock those camping with a pop-up travel trailer and a Toyota truck for the same reason.
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02-25-2018, 01:18 PM
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#10
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Senior Member
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 6,187
THOR #2121
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I like Cummins engines a lot, but think the negative tone of the adds may backfire. The ads also make me wonder if Diesel sales are down while smaller rigs have done much better.
If they drove diesel at 55 MPH to get 8 MPG, at what speed did they drive V10 to get 5.6 MPG? Most Class A owners here report much higher fuel economy, and while driving much faster than 55 MPH. And many while pulling a toad.
Some comparisons are valid, like Diesel engine having greater torque and better braking, but I get the feeling comparison was exaggerated to favor the diesel. How often do you see 11% grades? And at what elevation was it tested since that favors any turbocharged engine? Comparing range with 80- versus 100-gallon fuel tank seems odd too.
Anyway, I just find it funny they say your RV is not a race car, but then make a big deal over saving a few seconds up a 1-mile unusually steep hill.
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02-25-2018, 01:29 PM
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#11
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Axis/Vegas Enthusiast
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.4
State: Michigan
Posts: 9,837
THOR #1150
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chance
If they drove diesel at 55 MPH to get 8 MPG, at what speed did they drive V10 to get 5.6 MPG? Most Class A owners here report much higher fuel economy, and while driving much faster than 55 MPH. And many while pulling a toad.
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They probably filled every tank to capacity, drove with the awning deployed, and pulled a toad
A higher compression ratio may be a thing of the past if Mazda has anything to say about it.
I agree with everyone here: Kind of disingenuous comparing the ranges when one coach carries 20 more gallons of fuel.
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02-25-2018, 02:05 PM
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#12
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I Think We're Lost!
Brand: Still Looking
Model: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
State: New York
Posts: 22,195
THOR #8860
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There's an old saying: "Figures don't lie; but liars can figure."
These rigs were never bought for their fantastic fuel economy. It's just good to know that the manufacturers are constantly working on the technology.
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"What: me worry?"
Good Sam Member 843599689
Current coach: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
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02-25-2018, 03:11 PM
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#13
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.2
State: Idaho
Posts: 533
THOR #1944
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Most motor choices in RVs today outlive the boxes they haul. The belief that diesels have more torque is only true when they do ... but very false when they don't. Example: V10 vs. MB in the Sprinter chassis. I've had a few CTD trucks and while I'm an old diesel lover, I got a gas truck this time around (the reason list is long).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Denman
There's an old saying: "Figures don't lie; but liars can figure." ...
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Alternate Facts are alive and well, especially in social media. Facts about MPG or power are rarely compared in equal context.
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Axis 24.2 "was" tug'n a JK
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02-25-2018, 03:17 PM
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#14
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I Think We're Lost!
Brand: Still Looking
Model: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
State: New York
Posts: 22,195
THOR #8860
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"Alternate facts": I think that I majored in them; in College!
...About a thousand years ago...
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"What: me worry?"
Good Sam Member 843599689
Current coach: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
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02-25-2018, 03:26 PM
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#15
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Senior Member
Brand: Still Looking
Model: Travato
State: Florida
Posts: 2,475
THOR #1765
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Talking about the V10, how about the new FORD 10 speed transmission coming out in their F-150. Supposed to be approx same size and weight as the 6 Speed with significantly improved gas mileage. Might be the next good reason to trade in my Axis for a new model. Although DW doesn’t particularly like the new interior.
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02-25-2018, 03:52 PM
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#16
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 22FE
State: Washington
Posts: 270
THOR #8606
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I do like the fact that diesels have in general more torque at lower rpm as compared to most gasoline engines. I've had several cars and pickup trucks with diesel engines and have all good to say about all of them but I own/Wife's car, Volvo 3.0 inline 6 cyl. engine with twin turbo and the larger turbo is engineered to provide low end power and torque also preventing any turbo lag. Very nicely engineered engine design. Volvo really did a great job at designing it IMO. Curious why Ford didn't offer turbo system on the V10. May not be a possible thing to do, but if it was, would possibly make a big difference in power band, more torque on lower rpm end and maybe better fuel mileage.
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02-25-2018, 03:53 PM
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#17
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I Think We're Lost!
Brand: Still Looking
Model: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
State: New York
Posts: 22,195
THOR #8860
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I LIKE the idea of more gears. It'll probably take some serious upgrading, to have it make the leap from a half-ton truck: to what we might put it through.
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"What: me worry?"
Good Sam Member 843599689
Current coach: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
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02-25-2018, 04:07 PM
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#18
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Senior Member
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 6,187
THOR #2121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamieGeek
They probably filled every tank to capacity, drove with the awning deployed, and pulled a toad
A higher compression ratio may be a thing of the past if Mazda has anything to say about it.
I agree with everyone here: Kind of disingenuous comparing the ranges when one coach carries 20 more gallons of fuel.
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Higher compression ratio can certainly improve fuel economy, which is why everyone has been trying to do that for so long. What I'm really curious about is how "state-of-the-art" the new V8 that replaces the V10 will be.
If we look at the very newest Ford naturally-aspirated engines tuned for pickups (the F-150s), they have 12:1 compression ratio, which is way higher than the 9.2:1 of the V10. They also have 4-valve DOHC, variable valve timing, direct injection plus port injection, and so on. All this yields 80 lb-ft of torque per liter, and a lot of HP per liter too.
Assuming the new V8 is indeed 7.3 liters as expected, if Ford uses the same technology, the engine could end up with over 550 lb-ft of torque, and 450~500 HP, depending on how conservative they want to play it for heavy truck use. I suppose Ford could tune it way down so it doesn't compete with their own Power Stroke diesels.
When introduced in SuperDuty pickups, the new V8 is also expected to have a 10-speed heavier-duty transmission (10R140), which should eventually help close the performance gap between diesel and gas RVs. I think Cummins may be a little worried.
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02-25-2018, 04:15 PM
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#19
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Senior Member
Brand: Still Looking
Model: Travato
State: Florida
Posts: 2,475
THOR #1765
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Denman
I LIKE the idea of more gears. It'll probably take some serious upgrading, to have it make the leap from a half-ton truck: to what we might put it through.
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It took several years for the 6 speed to move from the 5.7L V8 to the 6.8L V10. So it will probably be several years before we see it in the V10. You have to believe that FORD and Chevy (joint project) engineered it to eventually be used with their larger engines in their larger vehicles.
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02-25-2018, 04:47 PM
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#20
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: A.C.E 29.3
State: Ohio
Posts: 613
THOR #1620
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I had a Monacrapo DP had the ISB engine, was only a 32' and was lucky to get 8mpg.That diesel was $40k more than a comparable coach. Yes it did have good power but having more than you need is a waste. Maintenance is also another factor, the coolant was very specific to keep from doing damage to the engine. twice as may quarts of oil at a minimum. As said very loud when idling in the morning and I hated that if I knew we had to leave early in a morning. Repairs are limited to where you can get it worked on compared to the V10 which you could have serviced at any garage. I think they are grasping for business.
I would never buy another diesel just due to the cost over a gas coach.
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2015 Thor A.C.E. 29.3
2014 Honda CRV Toad
Ohio FMCA 317123
Camping World Indianapolis, worst dealer EVER experienced
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