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Old 01-09-2019, 12:18 PM   #1
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Help! difference between Triton V10 and V11 and the cost of center console upgrade

Help! I am about to make a down payment on a 2019 Thor 27.7 (Thor designation on a Jan 2018 chassis. I noticed that the other 27.7 model I have as alternative is a 2019 chassis and that the only written difference is that the $15k more expensive DEC 2019 chassis vehicle has a 6.8L 2-Valve SOHC Triton V11 engine and the 2018 has a 6.8L 2-Valve SOHC Triton V10 engine. The 2018 also is missing Sirius XM radio capability and WIFI extender capability. They seem otherwise to be the same. I read the 2018 or 2019 thread and understand that unless Ford changed something in performance or center console capability , the chassis assembly year doesn’t mean much. Does anyone know what the difference between them is?

We are older and this is my promise to my wife (77)…. that we would do this “bucket list” dream of a USA tour together, she has been so patient... So I would hate to screw it up and be kicking myself every time we went up a hill or something or found V11 fixed some long time complaint...

Further, does anyone know if the Sirius XM is just adding an antenna and tuner and plugging them into the console unit. That is all it takes on Sirius compatible Jeeps that don’t have it. If the console on a jeep is not WIFI or Sirius compatible it is also less than a thousand dollars to drop a new one in the jeep that can do everything, Sirius, WIFI, apple play etc. Does anyone know about the Thor center console as well?
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Old 01-09-2019, 12:31 PM   #2
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Must be a mis-print; no such thing as a V11 engine.

That is the same engine in both the 2018 and 2019 chassis.
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Old 01-09-2019, 12:55 PM   #3
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Yeah there is no such thing as a V11 and the V-10 hasn't changed in years. I have the exact same V-10 in my Axis as that (Axis/Vegas? 27.7).

Before signing on the dotted line go download and read Ed's excellent crowd sourced Axis/Vegas owner's manual found here:
Link to Ed Felker's Vegas/Axis Manual
(If you haven't already)

There really isn't much difference between the 2018 and 2019 Axis/Vegas units (you mentioned just about all of them--2019 probably has a solar controller that the 2018 doesn't.) Even the Ford chassis there isn't any difference--not sure about any center console as Axis/Vegas RUV's don't have a center console (center console = armrest+storage between driver and passenger seats)! LOL
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Old 01-09-2019, 01:11 PM   #4
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... And here I was gonna mention that extra cylinder...
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Old 01-09-2019, 03:52 PM   #5
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If it is a Thor designated 2019 - then I would expect (always dangerous) all the same features in the RV part - ie WIFI extender, Sirius... though they could be options that a dealer got on one unit and not another...
The chassis year wouldn't make the interior differences.

From my experience - 'Sirius ready' means you have a way to plug in the tuner and antenna - not already integrated in radio like many cars today.

As indicated already - no such thing as a V11... Balancing those odd cylinders is a challenge in a V configuration... and the doghouse won't hide a radial engine (the typical geometry for odd cylinders)!

If you get the 2018 chassis - be sure the papers being submitted to the state for title/registration state 2019. The final manufacturer (Thor) designates the title year - regardless of the year of the chassis.
Best to insure correct up front. PIA to change later.
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Old 01-09-2019, 05:45 PM   #6
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Yeah, a 90 degree V10 is bad enough, requiring a balance shaft to make it usable. Even then it gets rough and loud at higher RPMs. Odd number of cylinders have been used in “V” engines (like V5), but there is a reason most are not around. Overall, inline-6 and V8 are hard to beat — except maybe by a 60-degree V12.
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Old 01-09-2019, 06:26 PM   #7
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I gotta say this scares me. On several levels.

Where in California are you? What dealership is giving you this kind of false information and not correcting it or making it clear? I'd wonder about a dealership that advertises a V11 engine on a "DEC 2019" chassis.

Please, please don't take offense to this, I'm also honestly worried about a couple of almost 80 year olds hopping in a brand new Thor product and trying to drive around the country in it. You WILL have issues with the new RV. Will they be little and no big deal or will they be huge and life threatening? There were plenty of issues with my '18 27.7 Vegas that could have absolutely been life threatening.

The chassis is almost always a year behind the coach, not a big deal since they're all (Class C's and RUV's) almost identical since '16 on the Fords. There isn't anything that would "fix a long time complaint" on the late model Ford E350's and E450's, they'll do what you need them to do.

I talked to a Thor rep lately that told me they recently replaced a LARGE percentage of their assembly management staff. She said they were WELL aware of the horrific build issues in the last two years and said they are working very hard at turning that trend back around. As demand slows down that might actually help lower assembly issues too. That being said, I might try to find a Thor product that was built later as opposed to one built in '17 or early '18. Our's was built in December of '17 and I believe that might have been around the height of the demand/production pushed way too fast era. Our Vegas had issues that could have easily burned it to the ground when we were driving it.

I'm 57 and still ride motocross on a YZ450 and also jump wakes on an 85mph jetski. I MYSELF realize that driving a 28 foot vehicle is harder and takes more of my skills, strength and reaction time than I know I had when I was younger. When our 27 year old son is with us I have him drive a lot of the time just because I know his youth makes him safer than my experience does.

Just a few thoughts. Driving around the country is an amazing thing. I just wish more people didn't wait until they're retired to do it. Again, please don't take any of this personally. (All of the rest of you fine people included!) I just read your "promise" and "bucket list" comments and want them to come true in a hugely positive way. It can happen in a brand new Thor product, the odds are just a little scary. If you're in the SF Bay Area I'd be happy to help if I can.
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Old 01-10-2019, 05:10 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kmhappel View Post
Help! I am about to make a down payment on a 2019 Thor 27.7 (Thor designation on a Jan 2018 chassis. I noticed that the other 27.7 model I have as alternative is a 2019 chassis and that the only written difference is that the $15k more expensive DEC 2019 chassis vehicle has a 6.8L 2-Valve SOHC Triton V11 engine and the 2018 has a 6.8L 2-Valve SOHC Triton V10 engine. The 2018 also is missing Sirius XM radio capability and WIFI extender capability. They seem otherwise to be the same. I read the 2018 or 2019 thread and understand that unless Ford changed something in performance or center console capability , the chassis assembly year doesn’t mean much. Does anyone know what the difference between them is?

We are older and this is my promise to my wife (77)…. that we would do this “bucket list” dream of a USA tour together, she has been so patient... So I would hate to screw it up and be kicking myself every time we went up a hill or something or found V11 fixed some long time complaint...

Further, does anyone know if the Sirius XM is just adding an antenna and tuner and plugging them into the console unit. That is all it takes on Sirius compatible Jeeps that don’t have it. If the console on a jeep is not WIFI or Sirius compatible it is also less than a thousand dollars to drop a new one in the jeep that can do everything, Sirius, WIFI, apple play etc. Does anyone know about the Thor center console as well?


V11 really think about it
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Old 01-10-2019, 07:17 AM   #9
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Thank you all, what a community, we bought our 27.7

I wanted to thank you all for the help, I was able to find my way through the rather disturbing experience I had in dealer land.

I called the sales manager at Thor and talked to a lady (a marketing manager) and then a guy who was, I believe a regional sales manager. There is no V11 engine, but there is a version Vegas 27.2 item spec 19.5 that is an upgrade to the original 2019 spec of the unit I have now bought. The differences are a second house battery inverter and wiring, a Sirius ready dash console unit and a WIFI extender. Hardly $15K. Heck, that's not even a thousand if you are a careful buyer. They also helped me get to a short list of dealers that could accommodated my house-sale escrow balance pay-off and price the deal as a cash sale (since my local one wouldn't). Thor did right and I liked the simple “Reeeaaally! Followed by a direct referral to the regional sales guy who heard me out and then set things right.

The statements made by multiple dealers that warranty service would have to wait behind local customers if you didn’t buy from them is ridiculous and both the Thor guy and the dealer’s finance person both explained why. Having founded and run publicly traded companies, I have bought vehicle fleets. The sales group would sell at near wholesale to get the service contract that was worth gold. They confirmed that Thor Warranty work is paid by Thor at fully burdened rates. That means rates above discounts and other price lowering market forces. Dealers live from those warranty service jobs.

They also confirmed that there is some truth to dealers giving non-warranty service priority to locals and repeat customers but not enough to have that be a real concern as there are a large number of good independent repair and upgrade shops. I agree with those who suggested we should start a register of the great and good and the bad and ugly so we can all profit.

They also told me a strategy to defeat some of the problems of detecting new vehicle problems immediately. The dealer has a setup with a local rv stop. They do the run through then send you there to try everything yourself. The next day you do a run through of all the issues. After passing muster then we will drive about 500 miles in three days in a circuit that has dealerships from the same company in several of the towns on the circuit. We get through that and I wll guess that we have handed the first tier of stuff, much like commissioning a boat with a sea trial.

To the kindness and concern of gmtech, I did not take offense at 80 somethings. I am 70 and I married my cougar, we have lived on board boats and taken on heavy water. Boats are good training for every money destroying exercise except there is no dealer to fix the breakdown for the fist thousand miles or so. That is why this site is so important and your concerns so real. Without being forewarned, it is very hard to tell how to prepare to meet the unexpected.

JamieGeek, I had read the wonderful manual by our Air Force brother (in fact its how I found this forum) and I intend to make a kind of addition about the dash board console upgrades and how to wire them. Blush, yes I stand or, sit in this case, corrected about that center console…

My wife has been sick but is recovering well and now is the time. Later would be your vision indeed. The Vegas is about as heavy as we can safely control. We will immediately add sway bars front and rear and steering GMTECH, we are not going to even be visible in your rear view mirror, that is some car. I got to hand in a Patrick Racing indy-car racing pit crew one year and got to feel the 180 mph blow buy…

I am glad we have such a community and it's wonderful a be new member of a community that shares its ingenuity and the challenges they meet. Makes us all safer.

Thanks Ken and Lynne
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Old 01-10-2019, 04:18 PM   #10
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Wow. Just wow.

I've often said that internet forums are 99% BS and 1% amazing. Ken you are clearly the 1% part. (I don't mean to say you're a "One Percenter", that's something totally different. haha.) I actually try to stay away from forums in general because I'm one of those guys that's often misunderstood or the target of trolls. I think I even had that happen on here? But it's my obsession with sharing my knowledge that keeps me coming back. I truly believe knowledge is worthless if you keep it to yourself. So Ken, thank you SO MUCH for understanding what I was trying to convey and getting the proper feel of my post. It was sincere and I responded because I cared. I literally told my wife about your post and she said "I know you responded, because how could you NOT respond?". She knows me pretty well after 35 years.

Blah blah blah, yeah whatever. lol. Ok so don't worry, I'll give you all the help I can! After all, you are the ONLY other person I've ever heard of that can also say they worked on an Indy pit crew! WTH? I got to help out on one during the '78 and '79 500 races, I was the guy they'd throw wheels to and I'd get tools over the wall when they needed them on the car. It was an amazing experience, as you well know.

I'll put together a list of part numbers and sources (mostly Amazon) for the suspension stuff you'll need. I'm happy to hear you're going to do that stuff, it makes a HUGE difference in safety. What end of California are you in? I'm in the SF Bay Area between Facebook and Google. I have a feeling we'll be meeting face to face in the future whatever end of the state you live in.

Congrats on the purchase!!! It will be an amazing experience for both of you.

John
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Old 01-10-2019, 05:07 PM   #11
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Here's your parts list...

Front shocks...
https://www.amazon.com/Bilstein-33-1...ype=automotive

Rear shocks...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Steering stabilizer...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Mount kit for steering stabilizer...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Front sway bar...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Rear sway bar...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Front Sumo springs, not vital but help...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Tire pressure monitor, pricey but it's a safety thing...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...0?ie=UTF8&th=1

If you want to cook outside this grill kicks @ss and hooks right up to your Vegas outside propane connection...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

110vac inverter...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Remote switch for inverter...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

These are good to have...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I'm sure there's lots more but those are the big ones for safety. Hope that helps and let me know if any of those links don't work or the parts don't look right.
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Old 01-10-2019, 05:22 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmtech16450yz View Post
I gotta say this scares me. On several levels.

I'm 57 and still ride motocross on a YZ450 and also jump wakes on an 85mph jetski. I MYSELF realize that driving a 28 foot vehicle is harder and takes more of my skills, strength and reaction time than I know I had when I was younger. When our 27 year old son is with us I have him drive a lot of the time just because I know his youth makes him safer than my experience does.

You're still a kid at 57...there is a man at 92 that stills runs The Peachtree in Atlanta. The mom of my good friends in Michigan is working on her second run at the Great Loop in a Nordic Tug 34. She is 78 and holds a 100 Ton Captain's License. Her husband passes recently and she is continuing to live our their dream. She also just bought a small motorhome on the Sprinter chassis so she has something to do when she's not boating. Right now, she's on a snowmobile run up north somewhere with a bunch of younger women. Never underestimate the ability and wisdom of "The elderly" as some call them. People know their limits. Sitting behind the wheel of today's motorhome is quite the easy task. I had an older guy at a campground recently tell me..."if you can pick your nose, you can operate today's motorhomes". It's all push button.


Go for it, Pop!!! You've worked for it and earned it! See you at a campground somewhere soon!!
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Old 01-10-2019, 05:23 PM   #13
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the links don't work

Quote:
Originally Posted by gmtech16450yz View Post
Here's your parts list...

Front shocks...
https://www.amazon.com/Bilstein-33-1...ype=automotive

Rear shocks...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Steering stabilizer...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Mount kit for steering stabilizer...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Front sway bar...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Rear sway bar...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Front Sumo springs, not vital but help...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Tire pressure monitor, pricey but it's a safety thing...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...0?ie=UTF8&th=1

If you want to cook outside this grill kicks @ss and hooks right up to your Vegas outside propane connection...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

110vac inverter...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Remote switch for inverter...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

These are good to have...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I'm sure there's lots more but those are the big ones for safety. Hope that helps and let me know if any of those links don't work or the parts don't look right.
Can you repost the items the links don't work
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Old 01-10-2019, 05:24 PM   #14
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never mind the links are working

Quote:
Originally Posted by bry899 View Post
Can you repost the items the links don't work

never mind the links are working
I messed up somehow
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Old 01-10-2019, 05:37 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by The Gritz Carlton View Post
. People know their limits. Sitting behind the wheel of today's motorhome is quite the easy task. I had an older guy at a campground recently tell me..."if you can pick your nose, you can operate today's motorhomes". It's all push button.
Not to derail this thread or get into anything, but I have to say not only do I disagree with ALL of that, it also scares the cr@p out of me. ANY person thinking that driving a motorhome is no big deal is scary. And anyone thinking an 80 year old (or 70, or 60 or even 57 year old) has the same strength, reflexes, reaction time, awareness, cognitive skills and the ability to think quickly and clearly in a emergency situation as a younger person can doesn't understand the human brain and body.

And thinking people "know their limits" means somebody doesn't understand human nature. Just watch an episode or two of "Ridiculousness" and you'll see how much people know their limits. lol. Emergency rooms around the country are FULL of millions of people who thought they knew their limits. haha.
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Old 01-10-2019, 06:27 PM   #16
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That's hilarious!!!
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Old 01-10-2019, 07:41 PM   #17
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gmtech,

Well said. There is a high percentage of people who knew their limits buried in cemeteries. Too many people think they are special and safety regs/laws don’t pertain to them. Part of the nature of some humans.
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Old 01-10-2019, 08:22 PM   #18
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I agree with the facts of stupid people (not knowing or ignoring their limits) ending up in hospitals, but to compare a TV series "Ridiculousness" to the age demographics of driving is hilarious. Don't you realize that crap is staged? Most of those people on that show are young. Older (65+) drivers are not as high of a risk as implied as they manage the risk by not driving at night, driving less miles and not driving on the freeways as much as the other two classes and basically have much more experience driving. There's a lot of hard data available with a simple search of percentage of accidents by age groups and why. With age comes wisdom. If a 77 or 85 year old man wants to buy a motorhome and see America...I'm all for it. As long as he can qualify for a license...go for it. Testing is much more stringent the older you get. Go Pop Go.
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Old 01-10-2019, 11:15 PM   #19
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Geezers get to be geezers by being careful and having lots’a luck

This could also be titled, youth is wasted on the young. ah yes/… Consider this the first tale under the awning somewhere...

Before Lynne and I were going to take off in a 54 foot Hylas sloop and see the world, we bought a 21 foot Catalina and tore it all the way back to fiberglass. We rebuilt everything so we knew how it was constructed, installed, maintained and what we would need if we had to fix it. Then we spent a lot of time buying drinks for those sailing in from the blue (or gray as the case was). I had also learned to sail on the North Sea off the Dutch coast in some weather that I still can't believe I was stupid enough to go out in.

Even with all that, including being the only people the Coast Guard would allow out of the harbor entrance when the harbor was closed for weather (they had watched us refit "Amazing Grace" - not the Disney one), nature almost had the last laugh. One day there was a large south swell and the entrance was covered by both the large south swell and large waves reflecting back off the Camp Pendleton harbor wall as we went out.

We had friends with us and the sea outside the harbor had swells but was going to be fun... As we were motoring out with everyone including me at the wheel, sitting on deck, lifejacketed and tethered by lifelines into the rigging a huge roller hit us. As it approached, our guests said, "Do you every get wet?" As I answered, "Nah, just some spray." Just then a reflection swell hit the incoming roller we were now climbing and the two waves were now one, that was the sum of their individual heights (higher than our mast). We were completely underwater (sailboats are made to survive this) and we popped out the back of the wave and surfed down its back out the harbor entrance.

Had we left a cabin door open, not had everyone tethered and not been in a boat that had no maintenance issues at all, I might not be telling this story. I appreciate that God has decided to leave me some of the strength of my youth, but my real compensation is the caution I have gained in measure as my strength wains.

I live in Vista, CA. That’s north San Diego county. We are selling our house and downsizing into something much smaller and our new Vegas. We are going to call her the same name as our Hylas, “Tiowa” which is Hopi for, “You can see the Creator in His creation.” Lynne and I are looking forward to meeting all of you at some time.

BTW, thanks for the links. Am already studying them.

P.S. I read a link in the intro forum area from a much younger new to the rv-life member who is practicing his hook-ups in his rv parking place so he will be familiar enough to do them as routine on the road. He is smart. I have a nightmare of fighting a sewage hose in the dark and somehow not getting sloped downhill... You can guess the rest.
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:14 AM   #20
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Great story. We are all getting older and have to deal with its reality. Hope to meet you sometime in SoCal.
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