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Old 09-08-2019, 07:14 PM   #1
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THOR #16665
thor ace motorhome 2012 battery problem

Can the chassis battery be tripled charged ? Would like to know where the battery isolator controller is.? Think that may be the problem. We have tried charging it - triple charge. And its dead. Any advice appreciated.
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Old 09-08-2019, 07:44 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by bethanne View Post
Can the chassis battery be tripled charged ? Would like to know where the battery isolator controller is.? Think that may be the problem. We have tried charging it - triple charge. And its dead. Any advice appreciated.
If you are referring to a three stage charger - yes the coach's three stage charger can charge a low battery. Whether it will charge a dead battery depends on why it is dead. A bad cell or low water battery cannot be charged. Your coach probably has a bi-directional relay delay (BIRD) located near the house battery compartment. The BIRD is controlled by a Trombetta controller. With the coach on shore or generator power, you can check for proper BIRD operation by measuring the voltage at the chassis battery with a voltmeter. A voltage above 12.8 volts indicated the BIRD is working properly.
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Old 09-08-2019, 08:19 PM   #3
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Model: 2013 ACE 30.1
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THOR #2631
Welcome to the forum. Do you have a chassis battery disconnect switch and a coach battery disconnect switch near the entrance door?

On the older ACE coaches there is a BCC (battery control cabinet/center) made by RV Custom Products mounted in the engine bay, driver side (picture is attached). The BCC contains both latching relays (coach and chassis) as well as the 50 amp re-settable mini breaker connecting the converter (battery charger) output to the coach battery disconnect. The BCC also contains the interconnect relay (emergency start relay) and a circuit board with the smarts to connect battery strings together under certain charging conditions. If you are on shore power and converter is working, but voltage across the coach batteries is not at least (as Beau advised), 12.8 or above, you have an open cct between converter and coach batteries somewhere (assuming good batteries). It could be many things.


I would first check the voltage (with a voltmeter) across the coach batteries. If they are quite low they will not operate the coach latching relay and might need to be charged by a separate car charger (one that can charge a fully discharged battery). It could be simply the 50 amp re-settable mini breaker inside the BCC that has tripped open (little grey square device in lower left corner of 2nd picture attached). Reset it by pressing the small black button on the mini breaker inside the BCC.......but be very very careful opening that critter. The BCC contains and connects many power systems for your coach and it is best to disconnect all power (batteries and shore) before opening the BCC.
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Old 09-08-2019, 08:24 PM   #4
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THOR #16665
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Originally Posted by Beau388 View Post
If you are referring to a three stage charger - yes the coach's three stage charger can charge a low battery. Whether it will charge a dead battery depends on why it is dead. A bad cell or low water battery cannot be charged. Your coach probably has a bi-directional relay delay (BIRD) located near the house battery compartment. The BIRD is controlled by a Trombetta controller. With the coach on shore or generator power, you can check for proper BIRD operation by measuring the voltage at the chassis battery with a voltmeter. A voltage above 12.8 volts indicated the BIRD is working properly.
Thank you . Checked and battery voltage is good 12+ volts. The battery storage control for chassis (the panel by the door) will not illuminate in the connect or disconnect position. No power to chassis. Coach is fine and iluminates../ Could the battery storage control panel need to be replaced?
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Old 09-08-2019, 08:43 PM   #5
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THOR #2631
I missed the fact you were asking about the chassis battery specifically. What is the voltage across the chassis battery? If it is the original Ford battery it is likely over due for replacement. There was a BCC cabling recall in 2014 which ties the chassis battery to the Ford engine ignition directly (as opposed to through the BCC)......so you should be able to start your engine without the chassis battery disconnect being turned on (assumes the recall was done on your coach and the chassis battery is charged OK).

If the chassis latching relay inside the BCC (assuming you have a BCC) has failed open then you will not be able to connect and power many devices that run off chassis battery. Also if charging is good/normal to the coach batteries when on shore power, the BCC should automatically connect the two battery strings together (coach and chassis) under certain conditions and charge them both. But as Beau advised....a shorted cell/damaged chassis battery won't take a charge properly.

Attaching a schematic of the typical RV Custom BCC cct board which will help you see how things connect inside. There are documents on line that describe operation etc too.
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Old 09-08-2019, 08:47 PM   #6
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Thank you for info and pic. Battery shows 12+ volts. But the Battery storage control for chassis does not illuminate in the connect or disconnect mode . Coach lights works fine and no problem with power to coach. Will try reset button.
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Old 09-08-2019, 09:05 PM   #7
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THOR #2631
Hi, well that mini breaker reset would only affect the coach battery so if the coach battery is charging OK on shore power then it is OK.



Can you start your V10 engine OK (should not matter if the chassis disconnect switch at the door is on or off if the recall Thor issued was done in 2014 I think)? If the engine starts OK and then the chassis battery is OK/charged is 12.6 vdc;.......the light at the door and chassis battery disconnect switch control may have blown the 3Amp fuse F43 in the BCC shown top of page middle of the schematic I submitted previously. That fuse ties directly between the chassis battery and the chassis battery disconnect switch/light at the door I believe. Again going into the BCC....disconnect all batteries and shore etc to be safe.
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Old 09-08-2019, 09:38 PM   #8
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THOR #16665
Can not start engine - no power to engine, radio, the door step also does not work etc. Coach part fine. I dont think we ever got a recall notice. Is there a second fuse box by driver seat. We have only checked fuses by bed. Maybe i will contact Thor about the recall - really cant remember getting recall notice.
THANK YOU!!
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Old 09-08-2019, 09:41 PM   #9
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One other item to note from the schematic.....when the engine is running it operates a lockout relay located in the BCC which disconnects power through fuse F43 that feeds the chassis battery disconnect switch and its lamp at the door. Before the 2014 recall this lockout was used to prevent accidentally turning off the chassis battery while under way. Since the recall directly connects the chassis battery to the ignition the engine will always have battery connection......but other chassis battery items would quit working without the lockout....like your coach steps. The point I want to make is if the engine is running you wont be able to operate the chassis disconnect switch at the door and its light would likely also be out (not sure as my coach is not close at hand at the moment to verify). So the F43 fuse might actually also be OK. F43 is located physically just above the 50 amp mini cct breaker mentioned in previous posts.
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Old 09-08-2019, 09:58 PM   #10
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THOR #2631
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Originally Posted by bethanne View Post
Can not start engine - no power to engine, radio, the door step also does not work etc. Coach part fine. I dont think we ever got a recall notice. Is there a second fuse box by driver seat. We have only checked fuses by bed. Maybe i will contact Thor about the recall - really cant remember getting recall notice.
THANK YOU!!

OK so chassis battery fully charged should measure 12.6 volts unloaded; fully discharged wet cell battery is about 11.9 volts or less. If the recall was "not done" then it is possible that your chassis battery latching relay has failed open.....so chassis battery does not connect to anything. You should check for the recall having been completed on your coach first. I am attaching the pdf info.....but you might also confirm with Thor. That fuse F43 might also be worth checking in the BCC with mentioned precautions.
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File Type: pdf 13V-265 FW2050 BCC Rev. A.pdf (326.4 KB, 26 views)
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Old 09-08-2019, 11:05 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by javelin View Post
OK so chassis battery fully charged should measure 12.6 volts unloaded; fully discharged wet cell battery is about 11.9 volts or less. If the recall was "not done" then it is possible that your chassis battery latching relay has failed open.....so chassis battery does not connect to anything. You should check for the recall having been completed on your coach first. I am attaching the pdf info.....but you might also confirm with Thor. That fuse F43 might also be worth checking in the BCC with mentioned precautions.
Thank you again!! the repair instructions should be done by dealer or mechanic right? Still need to check fuse F43. will contact Thor tomorrow.
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Old 09-09-2019, 12:04 AM   #12
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THOR #2631
Hi, well if the recall has not been done Thor should pay a Dealer to complete the task per their recall.......make sure you contact Thor first as they should have a record of it being completed if it was done by an authorized Dealer. If you are the original owner then you should have received a notice if your coach is affected.

You can also visually check the "chassis switched" terminal post on the BCC to see if that ignition power cable has been physically moved off that terminal per the recall notice. If it has not been moved then recall "probably" has not been completed. If the cable has been moved then the recall is probably done.

Doing the recall yourself depends on your experience and comfort working around battery high current power systems. If you have any reservations go through Thor and a Dealer, if the recall has not been done.....it is the safest approach.....but probably slow getting into a Dealer.
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Old 09-09-2019, 10:12 AM   #13
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THOR #16665
there is one slot on the left side that does not have a wire in the port. all the rest have wires. maybe it was done. will call to check. thank you so much for your help.
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Old 09-09-2019, 12:29 PM   #14
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THOR #2631
So if the recall has been completed (picture from recall showing the cable change is attached), you should have no issue starting your engine if the chassis (engine) battery is charged and working/connected correctly; because this BCC recall moves the engine ignition cable to directly terminate on the chassis battery terminal of the BCC. This ensures that the engine is always physically connected to the battery and is not dependent on the chassis latching relay inside the BCC to be on and working.

Since you currently cannot start your engine, it might be a better/safer option to have a mobile RV tech come and help you determine what is wrong. I suspect your chassis battery needs replacement (especially if it is original), or soon will.
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Old 09-09-2019, 04:18 PM   #15
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THOR #16665
i checked and the recall work was done in 2014. i called thor and person thinks its the ignition switch and needs replacement of checking at Ford whpo. Also levelers wont go up but those are powered by house battery. so have to check that as well. Thor advised to get leverlers up and have it towed to Ford repair shop / dealer.
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Old 09-09-2019, 04:37 PM   #16
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THOR #2631
Good.....a confirmation that recall was done and possible problem diagnosis by Thor. If jacks are not working (and coach batteries are fully charged) check in the coach battery cubby.....there may be a 100 amp re-settable breaker mounted on the cubby wall near the coach batteries (typical breaker picture attached). Make sure the breaker has not tripped (might be a yellow flag arm showing). Also, can you start (or at least crank) your generator? If not, this 100 amp breaker is a likely suspect for that too. If the yellow flag is out just push it back in to reset.


I would really suggest a reputable mobile RV tech to help confirm things.....might cost you the same as a tow (unless you have coverage for free tows).
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Old 09-09-2019, 07:09 PM   #17
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THOR #16665
thank you! generator wont start. family member thought it was because low on gas but now thinking it may be because the 100 amp breaker tripped. Will check when get home. Thor did mention checking that also. Said the jacks should work when this is reset if tripped. Will let you know what we find out. !! Thank you again!!!
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Old 09-09-2019, 08:06 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bethanne View Post
thank you! generator wont start. family member thought it was because low on gas but now thinking it may be because the 100 amp breaker tripped. Will check when get home. Thor did mention checking that also. Said the jacks should work when this is reset if tripped. Will let you know what we find out. !! Thank you again!!!
The jacks and the generator should be on the same 100 amp circuit breaker in the battery compartment. They are on my coach.
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Old 09-09-2019, 10:21 PM   #19
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
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THOR #16665
thank you. Going to check coach battery now. hopefully this is as simple as resetting the 100 amp breaker. Will the generator run if only have 1/4 tnk of gas?
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Old 09-09-2019, 10:28 PM   #20
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Model: Citation
State: Nevada
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THOR #7332
Sprinter RV

I just found out today that my Citation Sprinter has a third battery located under the driver's seat. It cost me $350 to learn that. 2016 RV would not start.
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