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Old 06-15-2018, 06:39 PM   #61
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Agree. I’m sure larger units require more steel and aluminum, but as a percentage of retail costs, I’m not sure the difference is that great. If anything, I’d expect higher-end RVs carry a higher labor percentage.

Some of this may be spin to make analyst think they are working on correcting the problem, which sounds a lot better than saying that higher-end products, which normally have highest margin and contribute more to earnings, are declining for other reasons.


P.S. — If they want a suggestion to lower steel and aluminum costs, build an Axis 24.1 w/o slide as an option, and use E-350 chassis due to lower weight. I’d gladly pocket the $5,000 plus in savings.

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Old 06-15-2018, 06:43 PM   #62
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. — If they want a suggestion to lower steel and aluminum costs, build an Axis 24.1 w/o slide as an option, and use E-350 chassis due to lower weight. I’d gladly pocket the $5,000 plus in savings.
If they DID do that: you can bet that they'd make it 29 feet long...
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Old 06-15-2018, 07:10 PM   #63
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Slides indeed add a lot of weight. Thor has made a Chateau 28A Class C that is nearly 30-ft long on both E-350 and E-450 chassis if I recall correctly. I’ve rented it and like it a lot, but is much larger than we need. Regardless, it shows that E-350 is very capable chassis if RV weight is limited.
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Old 06-15-2018, 07:26 PM   #64
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my 450 based rig shows a GVW of 14,500 pounds.
Where does the max GVW of a 350 based rig usually fall?
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Old 06-15-2018, 07:51 PM   #65
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E-350 is commonly 12,500 pounds. I personally think that that rating is a bit more conservative than 14,500 of E-450.

E-350 allso comes in 11,500 DRW and 10,050 SRW.
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Old 06-16-2018, 08:39 PM   #66
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Question: Where does the toilet paper sit; when you've got a wet bath?

The day I buy a B or ANYTHING with a wet bath, I know I have lost my battle with insanity or been overtaken by that Old-Timers disease. They're just creepy.
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Old 06-16-2018, 09:14 PM   #67
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The day I buy a B or ANYTHING with a wet bath, I know I have lost my battle with insanity or been overtaken by that Old-Timers disease. They're just creepy.
LOL I agree totally. When we were looking at RVs the DW said don’t even think about it. I said don’t worry I wasn’t.
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Old 06-16-2018, 09:56 PM   #68
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E-350 is commonly 12,500 pounds. I personally think that that rating is a bit more conservative than 14,500 of E-450.

E-350 allso comes in 11,500 DRW and 10,050 SRW.
From what I've been able to figure out: the rear axles on the 450s are actually rated in a rather timid fashion...
I believe that they're good for 9600 pounds (according to Ford); yet the manufacturer of them seems to think that they're good for well over 5 tons...
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Old 06-16-2018, 10:02 PM   #69
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After the 40' DP I looked at a Roadtrec. Figured it was about the size of the coffin they will stuff me in one day. Very happy we went with the 43' 5er instead. But I'm only 70 and prefer comfort. No place for a separate washer and dryer in that either.
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Old 06-16-2018, 10:43 PM   #70
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Well gentlemen and ladies my wife and I have a 29 foot class A type RV that she so desired. I can say It's nice however she wants to upgrade to a Fleetwood 36 foot beautiful it is however she rarely drives, if I had a chance to get into a class C believe me I would just for a more relaxed driving experience.
Yes I know we lose storage however like others stated the kids and grandchildren are have moved on and just the wife myself and the dog.
I believe 1st thing should always be the comfort of driving second the interior comfort and last storage.
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Old 06-16-2018, 11:07 PM   #71
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Well gentlemen and ladies my wife and I have a 29 foot class A type RV that she so desired. I can say It's nice however she wants to upgrade to a Fleetwood 36 foot beautiful it is however she rarely drives, if I had a chance to get into a class C believe me I would just for a more relaxed driving experience.
Yes I know we lose storage however like others stated the kids and grandchildren are have moved on and just the wife myself and the dog.
I believe 1st thing should always be the comfort of driving second the interior comfort and last storage.


That’s interesting. We traded our 2017 26ft class C for a 2017 29ft Class A and I find the driving to be easier and more relaxed in the new coach. I miss the safety and serviceability of the C sometimes but the storage, space, drivability and view from the A are wonderful. I can’t see owning a B. Just too many compromises. But to each his own.
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Old 06-16-2018, 11:19 PM   #72
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We started looking for a replacement for our Suburban, it reached 10 years old. I did look at large vans, class B type units etc. Wife was away to a herding clinic and one of her pals showed up in a Navion. Dshe came home and said a small RV might make an effective replacement. We ended up with the Vegas 24.1 and still have Suburban that just turned 12.

The class B units just did not have towing capacity. All of the smaller class c units seemed a little cramped for me. The Vegas had right combination of utility and GCVW. I tow a 5500 lb open racecar trailer.
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Old 06-16-2018, 11:51 PM   #73
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Good thing....now pick out a good one...with a real toilet and shower.....in separate place.
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Old 06-17-2018, 02:39 PM   #74
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A separate shower and toilet can be done on larger vans, but most designers must feel that the extra room that is used up can be better used in other ways. The Class B forum discussed it here if interested.


Searching Class B with independant toilet/shower - Class B Forums


I don’t recall ever seeing a true Class B (van camper) with a dry bathroom in person, but have to say the Coach House Arriva looks very roomy and nicely done to me — given we are small and can fit in small shower. The rest of bathroom looks as large as what you may have in some smaller A or C motorhomes.
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Old 06-17-2018, 02:40 PM   #75
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And yes, it also keeps toilet paper dry.
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Old 06-17-2018, 03:21 PM   #76
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Smile Why we downsized

Our first motorhome was a 32’ Newmar Dutch Star. Yep, started high and worked our way down. We loved that Class A and it was great when we had a kid and a dog to travel with, but the kid is grown and the dog is gone. Now we are approaching retirement and recently bought a 24’ B Plus - a Citation model on a Sprinter chassis. We wanted to get a B but the lack of storage was the fatal blow to that plan.

I had always thought we’d want to get bigger models as we got into the retirement years, but ten years of maneuvering around a 32’ motorhome made me really happy with how easy it is to have a smaller unit. When we would move house, we always had to have RV parking as a criterion for the new place - now it’s much easier to park and store. We toured the Canadian Rockies in the Class A many years ago and I remember driving on by places we would have liked to have camped, because the campgrounds didn’t accommodate big rigs. Same down the California coast - I recall one nightmarish evening when we had to just keep on driving - endlessly it seemed - trying to find a place to stop for the night. I learned that life in a long RV requires preplanning and reservations.

Last summer we returned to the Rockies in our B+ and we spent two weeks meandering around the beautiful little areas, camping anyplace that anyone with a smaller unit could go. No more towing to be able to buy groceries in a town. The driving is a bit easier, but the ability to stop wherever gives us so much more freedom!

Yup, space is smaller and we’ve had the odd stretch of time in bad weather where we are both indoors for days. Honestly don’t see any difference in how that feels compared to having the extra 8 feet of length. The bathroom is cosier for sure. The shower is narrow and we only have an “airplane” sink with minimal counter space, so that’s a compromise over our former life. But the freedom of camping wherever there’s a spot - instead of wherever there’s a spot that fits - is totally worth it!
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Old 06-17-2018, 06:38 PM   #77
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A great point that was made in Class B forum is that van campers usually don’t have enough fresh or grey water capacity for a couple to take normal showers, so if needing hook-ups (water and sewer) at a campground anyway, then why not use the CG showers? Many custom Bs don’t have showers at all.

It’d be nice to have a separate shower even if it takes up an extra 4 to 6 square feet, but only if it got regular use. At a very minimum it would make boondocking a few days at a time between campground stays more practical/enjoyable.

I’m curious how much water you guys estimate you use per shower on average? Maybe 5 gallons? Class Bs often don’t even have 20 gallons of fresh or grey, so would a shower (wet or dry) get much use regardless of spaciousness?
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Old 06-17-2018, 06:40 PM   #78
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In all the years we have had motorhomes, we have not gone larger than 25' ..We came to appreciate, many years ago, the convenience of a
'short' motorhome when it comes to parking ANYWHERE !! Sure, we give up the spaciousness of a long unit...but, we enjoy our Axis and recently, found that we definitely do not want to go any smaller...Camper Van is not for us. We took a look and it made us realize what we had !
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Old 06-17-2018, 06:51 PM   #79
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Amen!
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Old 06-17-2018, 08:01 PM   #80
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In all the years we have had motorhomes, we have not gone larger than 25' ..We came to appreciate, many years ago, the convenience of a
'short' motorhome when it comes to parking ANYWHERE !! Sure, we give up the spaciousness of a long unit...but, we enjoy our Axis and recently, found that we definitely do not want to go any smaller...Camper Van is not for us. We took a look and it made us realize what we had !

Comparing specs, a Travato has 13 or 15 gallons gray capacity, whereas your Axis is ~ 40 gallons. In practical terms it means that if a couple takes showers at 5 gallons each (not sure that’s the right number) the tank would be so full you’d have little space for washing hands, ditches, or brushing teeth. You’d be looking for a place to dump each time you shower. That’s why I think most owners don’t use shower in Bs.
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