Go Back   Thor Forums > Thor Brands and Products > Thor Motor Coach | Class A, Class B+ & Class C Motorhomes
Click Here to Login
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 06-09-2016, 07:13 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 3,929
THOR #2121
Sprinter vs Ford Compact Class Cs?

Anyone else wonder why Thor and most other manufacturers don't make smaller Class Cs equivalent to the ones they make on Sprinter cutaway chassis, except on Fords?

A few days ago while looking at Chateau 19G model specs I noticed a close similarity in size and shape to the Sprinter-based Siesta and Synergy. They are all narrow body -- around 90-inches wide -- and share the aero front cap with integrated hump over front bed. The main difference I can see, other than length, which is simple to vary, is that the overhead bed area seems much roomier on the Ford. They made the bed wider, and large enough for two adults, which was probably only possible because it is taller on the Ford.

Then comparing van specs it made sense since Ford Cutaway vans are over a foot lower (+/- 80") at the cab than Sprinters (+/- 94"). This also explains why Ford-based Chateau 19G is much lower overall than similar Sprinter-based Class Cs. Advantages seem to favor Ford.

So if Sprinter Class Cs are relatively popular, why wouldn't manufacturers follow the same design theme but based on Ford E-Series Cutaway? Why not make longer versions of the 19G which is what these Sprinters are for the most part? What am I missing?
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	image.jpg
Views:	344
Size:	144.1 KB
ID:	2210  
__________________

__________________
Chance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2016, 07:15 PM   #2
Senior Member
 
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 3,929
THOR #2121
Can only post one picture at a time. For visual comparison.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	image.jpg
Views:	240
Size:	78.4 KB
ID:	2212  
__________________

__________________
Chance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2016, 02:25 AM   #3
Axis/Vegas Enthusiast
 
JamieGeek's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1
State: Michigan
Posts: 8,125
THOR #1150
Have you looked at Leisure Travel Vans: Leisure Travel Vans - Freedom to Explore
(There is an article on them in the Motorhome Magazine I got today about their newest on the Ford Transit diesel chassis.)
__________________
2014 Thor Axis 24.1
2018 Chevy Bolt
blog - https://spareelectrons.wordpress.com/
JamieGeek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2016, 06:42 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 3,929
THOR #2121
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamieGeek View Post
Have you looked at Leisure Travel Vans: Leisure Travel Vans - Freedom to Explore
(There is an article on them in the Motorhome Magazine I got today about their newest on the Ford Transit diesel chassis.)
Thanks Jamie.

I wasn't thinking about any particular motorhome, but rather looking for insight on how RVs are marketed, and how that affects their design. Products seem to be developed for a certain niche market with well-defined boundaries.

While it's easy to see that larger Class Cs can't be built on Sprinters, which presently have a maximum GVWR of only 11,030 pounds, it's not as obvious to see what's keeping Thor, Winnebago, Coachmen, etc. from building compact Class Cs (similar to Siesta and Synergy) on lower GVWR range of Ford E-Series Cutaway.
__________________
Chance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2016, 07:05 PM   #5
vkb
Senior Member
 
vkb's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1 KC's Big Box
State: Kansas
Posts: 1,993
THOR #3510
In continuing this discussion....on another thread, I told of our first Class B motorhome...21' Coachmen Starflyte...on the F350 Chassis...We are trying to remember the year..we think a 1999. It had a corner bed, toilet/shower enclousure (which many smaller Class C/B's have..a small 'gaucho' couch and in the modified cabover was the tv/stereo system.
It certainly served the purpose until we decided we needed more room. If it had a slide, we would have kept it longer than the 5 yrs we had it. Ron pulled out the carpet and installed tile. We loved that motorhome. Each RV we have had, was unique in its own way and we enjoyed every minute in each.

Now, we LOVE our Axis.

I think you all will agree...we have all searched and looked at many RV's...
I know, after owning several units, we knew what we did not want..when we saw the Axis, we had come full circle. It has everything we want..in a relatively, short size. It gets down the road well, and can be parked just about anywhere !

K
__________________
Ron & Kay n KC too !
2016 Axis 24.1 E-450 6 spd.
'KC's Big Box'
Jeep Wrangler TJ
or 6x10 enclosed motorcycle trailer
vkb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2016, 11:33 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 3,929
THOR #2121
Quote:
Originally Posted by vkb View Post
In continuing this discussion....on another thread, I told of our first Class B motorhome...21' Coachmen Starflyte...on the F350 Chassis...We are trying to remember the year..we think a 1999. It had a corner bed, toilet/shower enclousure (which many smaller Class C/B's have..a small 'gaucho' couch and in the modified cabover was the tv/stereo system.

....cut...
K
Kay, was it like this one? If so, I had to look it up because I was not familiar with that model.

I found one MotorHome review stating that Coachmen sold the design to Dynamax sometime around 2000.

Starflyte 21'

Apparently it may have started out as an 84-inch-wide coach and later made wider to 90 inches by Dynamax, and came in 21- to 24-feet lengths. Very nice size for a couple who travels light.

Too bad we don't have more choices like these today. I would prefer an overcab bed instead of TV -- made much easier today by LED TVs -- but otherwise pretty much what I was questioning above. Compact, low-profile, and narrow Class C on Ford E-Series chassis.

Thanks for mentioning the Starflyte.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	image.jpg
Views:	421
Size:	173.5 KB
ID:	2217  
__________________
Chance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2016, 02:30 AM   #7
Senior Member
 
Mr Sunshine's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2016 Vegas 25.2
State: Florida
Posts: 1,954
THOR #1589
Chance, did you check out Born Free? They offer models with no slide. Woo built and compact, but similar $$$ you could get so much more in an Axis/Vegas.
__________________
Not all who wander are lost!
Mr Sunshine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2016, 03:03 AM   #8
vkb
Senior Member
 
vkb's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1 KC's Big Box
State: Kansas
Posts: 1,993
THOR #3510
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chance View Post
Kay, was it like this one? If so, I had to look it up because I was not familiar with that model.

I found one MotorHome review stating that Coachmen sold the design to Dynamax sometime around 2000.

Starflyte 21'

Apparently it may have started out as an 84-inch-wide coach and later made wider to 90 inches by Dynamax, and came in 21- to 24-feet lengths. Very nice size for a couple who travels light.

Too bad we don't have more choices like these today. I would prefer an overcab bed instead of TV -- made much easier today by LED TVs -- but otherwise pretty much what I was questioning above. Compact, low-profile, and narrow Class C on Ford E-Series chassis.

Thanks for mentioning the Starflyte.
Hi Chance ! Similar ... I will dig out an old photo of it..the cabover was not quite as large. You are correct...Coachmen did sell design to Dynamax .
That 21' was a sweet little motorhome.
__________________
Ron & Kay n KC too !
2016 Axis 24.1 E-450 6 spd.
'KC's Big Box'
Jeep Wrangler TJ
or 6x10 enclosed motorcycle trailer
vkb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2016, 04:25 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 3,929
THOR #2121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Sunshine View Post
Chance, did you check out Born Free? They offer models with no slide. Woo built and compact, but similar $$$ you could get so much more in an Axis/Vegas.
Actually I did. I saw an ad for their smallest motorhome, the Jewel, which sounded the perfect size. I wrote them and got information back promptly.

You are correct, they are pricey. When I added a few options the cost was roughly that of two Axis.

At 22-feet long it provides a little more width than a Class B van, but the added interior space and outside storage isn't worth the difference to us. Additionally, the floorplan appears optimized for a couple, making travel with others difficult.

Born Free are probably very well built, but I'd take a custom built extended van over a Jewel any day, particularly at about half the cost.
__________________
Chance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2016, 05:19 AM   #10
vkb
Senior Member
 
vkb's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1 KC's Big Box
State: Kansas
Posts: 1,993
THOR #3510
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chance View Post
Actually I did. I saw an ad for their smallest motorhome, the Jewel, which sounded the perfect size. I wrote them and got information back promptly.

You are correct, they are pricey. When I added a few options the cost was roughly that of two Axis.

At 22-feet long it provides a little more width than a Class B van, but the added interior space and outside storage isn't worth the difference to us. Additionally, the floorplan appears optimized for a couple, making travel with others difficult.

Born Free are probably very well built, but I'd take a custom built extended van over a Jewel any day, particularly at about half the cost.
Chance...regarding the Starflyte..my memory did not serve me well ! the cabover was the same..side windows were different..there were 2 floorplans..ours had the corner bed...the other had the corner dinette which made into a bed.
attached photos of the Starflyte we enjoyed.
Click image for larger version

Name:	Starflyte July 2007 Colorado trip_33.jpg
Views:	240
Size:	255.5 KB
ID:	2218
Click image for larger version

Name:	Starflyte.jpg
Views:	465
Size:	125.0 KB
ID:	2219
__________________
Ron & Kay n KC too !
2016 Axis 24.1 E-450 6 spd.
'KC's Big Box'
Jeep Wrangler TJ
or 6x10 enclosed motorcycle trailer
vkb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2016, 05:30 AM   #11
Junior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Sprinter Citation 24ST
State: New Mexico
Posts: 16
THOR #2420
Sprinter vs. Ford Compact Class C's

I had a Coachman 29QB with the Ford E450 and downsized to the Citation Sprinter 26ST. The Sprinter is much easier to drive and the engine is less noisy. With the outside storage bays, total storage space is about the same only more of it is on the outside which my wife doesn't like and it means I have to go outside to get things. The cab over on the Sprinter is better aero-dynamically designed and there is less drag. While an adult could sleep over the cab, we reserve that for a grandchild and it works well. I'm glad I downsized and I really like the Mercedes Diesel on the Sprinter chassis.
__________________
Gary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2016, 12:38 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 3,929
THOR #2121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary View Post
I had a Coachman 29QB with the Ford E450 and downsized to the Citation Sprinter 26ST. The Sprinter is much easier to drive and the engine is less noisy. With the outside storage bays, total storage space is about the same only more of it is on the outside which my wife doesn't like and it means I have to go outside to get things. The cab over on the Sprinter is better aero-dynamically designed and there is less drag. While an adult could sleep over the cab, we reserve that for a grandchild and it works well. I'm glad I downsized and I really like the Mercedes Diesel on the Sprinter chassis.
Gary, had the Citation also been offered on an E-350 chassis as an option with greater payload and towing than the Sprinter, would you have considered it? Obviously that would mean giving up Diesel engine and much higher fuel economy, although initial cost would likely be lower to help pay for added fuel.

I'm interested in knowing if motorhomes like yours are purchased because of the Sprinter chassis or because of their smaller size.
__________________
Chance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2016, 12:50 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 3,929
THOR #2121
Quote:
Originally Posted by vkb View Post
Chance...regarding the Starflyte..my memory did not serve me well ! the cabover was the same..side windows were different..there were 2 floorplans..ours had the corner bed...the other had the corner dinette which made into a bed.
attached photos of the Starflyte we enjoyed.
Attachment 2218
Attachment 2219
Nice looking MH. Thanks for posting pictures.

In looking at interior pictures of that model on the internet, it became obvious that 2 extra feet of length between your RV and the shorter Chateau 19G makes a huge difference.

Had Thor made slightly longer versions of the 19G (specially now that chassis is rated for higher loads), I would invest the added space for larger bath. Wet baths limit too many motorhome buyers in my opinion.
__________________
Chance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2016, 05:04 PM   #14
Junior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Sprinter Citation 24ST
State: New Mexico
Posts: 16
THOR #2420
Sprinter vs. Ford Compact Class C's

I went with the Sprinter diesel because of the way the RV handled. I do all the driving so drivability was the key factor. I would have considered gas as long as the RV handled as well. I figure the diesel cost $10K more so it will take a long time to payoff over gas. However, the Sprinter diesel is only slightly more difficult to drive than my Town and Country van. The Coachmen drove like a fully loaded truck and was difficult particularly in crosswinds. As for MPG, the Sprinter gets 15 pulling a Chevy Cruze.

No RV design will be what you want. In addition to the inside storage, my wife misses not having a dinette. If I can find something that will fit, I'll probably swap out the sofa; however, there is only 57 inches to fit one in and it doubtful anything is available (at least not in Albuquerque).

My suggestion is to look at several models and pick what you think will be best for you.
__________________
Gary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2016, 05:50 PM   #15
Senior Member
 
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 3,929
THOR #2121
Gary, I agree drivability is very important, particularly if you are more of a traveler than camper and end up putting lots of miles on your motorhome.

I've taken different trips from Southeast Texas to Yellowstone, Yosemite, Badlands, etc. in rented +/- 30-foot Class Cs, and while I could drive them just fine, I wouldn't want to buy them. By comparison my 23~24 foot Class C was much easier to drive and maneuver in tight places. And a 20-foot van is much easier than that. The funny thing is that all were E-350 or E-450 Fords. When it comes to handling, size does matter.

Personally, I like the size of most Sprinter Class C motorhomes, but prefer the Ford E-Series chassis over the Mercedes. And like you say, it takes a long time to recover M-B diesel initial cost premium.
__________________
Chance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2016, 12:43 AM   #16
vkb
Senior Member
 
vkb's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1 KC's Big Box
State: Kansas
Posts: 1,993
THOR #3510
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chance View Post
Gary, I agree drivability is very important, particularly if you are more of a traveler than camper and end up putting lots of miles on your motorhome.

I've taken different trips from Southeast Texas to Yellowstone, Yosemite, Badlands, etc. in rented +/- 30-foot Class Cs, and while I could drive them just fine, I wouldn't want to buy them. By comparison my 23~24 foot Class C was much easier to drive and maneuver in tight places. And a 20-foot van is much easier than that. The funny thing is that all were E-350 or E-450 Fords. When it comes to handling, size does matter.

Personally, I like the size of most Sprinter Class C motorhomes, but prefer the Ford E-Series chassis over the Mercedes. And like you say, it takes a long time to recover M-B diesel initial cost premium.
I like reading your banter regarding motorhome style and sizes. It reminds me of entertainment, etc. If everyone liked the same thing, this would be a boring world....sports, films, electronics...we have so many options, sooner or later the right thing will come along !!

Enjoy the search !
__________________
Ron & Kay n KC too !
2016 Axis 24.1 E-450 6 spd.
'KC's Big Box'
Jeep Wrangler TJ
or 6x10 enclosed motorcycle trailer
vkb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2016, 09:05 PM   #17
Junior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Four Winds
State: Missouri
Posts: 4
THOR #4617
I am in the process of trading in our 2011 Itaska Reyo in for a Four Winds 24c a very similar floor plan. The sprinter has for the last two years been trying to put me in the poorhouse. I love how the Sprinter drives and the gas mileage is good but $10,000 in repairs in 10,000 miles is just too much. The last problem was the real killer, we had both intake shutoff valves go bad, the rv had to be towed from St.Louis to Kansas City because no dealer is St.Louis could fix it.
__________________
Mikef4e is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2016, 09:22 PM   #18
vkb
Senior Member
 
vkb's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1 KC's Big Box
State: Kansas
Posts: 1,993
THOR #3510
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikef4e View Post
I am in the process of trading in our 2011 Itaska Reyo in for a Four Winds 24c a very similar floor plan. The sprinter has for the last two years been trying to put me in the poorhouse. I love how the Sprinter drives and the gas mileage is good but $10,000 in repairs in 10,000 miles is just too much. The last problem was the real killer, we had both intake shutoff valves go bad, the rv had to be towed from St.Louis to Kansas City because no dealer is St.Louis could fix it.
Who did the repairs in KC ? We deal with CW in Grain Valley .. CW gets a bad rap in a number of areas, however, the KC CW has been good to us..perhaps because it has a long standing reputation prior to being purchased by CW.
__________________
Ron & Kay n KC too !
2016 Axis 24.1 E-450 6 spd.
'KC's Big Box'
Jeep Wrangler TJ
or 6x10 enclosed motorcycle trailer
vkb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2016, 09:35 PM   #19
Junior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Four Winds
State: Missouri
Posts: 4
THOR #4617
The Freightliner boys in Northeast East KC were great had it fixed in two days.
__________________
Mikef4e is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2016, 10:07 PM   #20
vkb
Senior Member
 
vkb's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1 KC's Big Box
State: Kansas
Posts: 1,993
THOR #3510
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikef4e View Post
The Freightliner boys in Northeast East KC were great had it fixed in two days.
Good ! happy to hear...we have visited their facility.
__________________

__________________
Ron & Kay n KC too !
2016 Axis 24.1 E-450 6 spd.
'KC's Big Box'
Jeep Wrangler TJ
or 6x10 enclosed motorcycle trailer
vkb is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Thor Industries or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.




All times are GMT. The time now is 12:07 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
×