Premium vs Regular?

[Chance]

I agree, and primarily use regular Exxon unless cost is out of line. After 191,000 miles on my present V10, I have not touched the fuel system (other than replace fuel pump a year or two ago). I’ve never used additives, or had injectors cleaned, or anything else. Just drive it regularly has been enough to keep everything working great. I still even get same fuel economy.

I hope I didn’t just jinx it.

[Miramar Owner]

Originally Posted by Chance

I agree, and primarily use regular Exxon unless cost is out of line. After 191,000 miles on my present V10, I have not touched the fuel system (other than replace fuel pump a year or two ago). I’ve never used additives, or had injectors cleaned, or anything else. Just drive it regularly has been enough to keep everything working great. I still even get same fuel economy.

I hope I didn’t just jinx it.

Chance, you are right on. If you stick with branded gasoline (Top Tier) you should NEVER have fuel injector issues. If you buy unbranded gasoline you should add a bottle of fuel injector cleaner every other tank...that gives you the same benefit you receive from the Top Tier gas.

I have traveled with my transport driver. No matter the brand they pull into the terminal and fill from the same point...they then pull forward and put in the additive based on the brand...non branded...no additive. That's the difference.

[Bob Denman]

It's kind of like computers...

"Garbage in..."

[Muggs]

Since this is my first Ford vehicle, I did not know they do not use a knock sensor. I usually do per Fish and Dear, change speed to get away from pinging. I will still add mid grade or premium as added insurance when loaded heavy and towing.

I also stick with name brand fuels unless lightly loaded in cool weather.

Been an interesting thread.

[Oneilkeys]

While all “branded Gasoline” has the additives mandated by the USG, those mandates have not changed since the 80s. The Top Tier gasses have additional additives which the other gasoline’s do not have. That is why it is important to add additional additives if you do not use top tier gas.

[Bob Denman]

Did you know that talking about fuel with RVers; is almost exactly like talking about oils with motorcyclists?

[gmtech16450yz]

Lol.

Looks like nothing's changed on this forum, still a wealth of misinformation from the resident "experts".

It's sad because the people reading this bs just end up passing the false information on to the next unsuspecting reader. Welcome to the internet.

[Oneilkeys]

Originally Posted by gmtech16450yz

Lol.

Looks like nothing's changed on this forum, still a wealth of misinformation from the resident "experts".

It's sad because the people reading this bs just end up passing the false information on to the next unsuspecting reader. Welcome to the internet.

If there’s misinformation, why don’t you correct it with links to the correct information? That’s what this forum is for. There are few, if any “experts” but a lot of people attempting to help others and provide assistance using their experience and knowledge.

[rynosback]

Originally Posted by Miramar Owner

Actually all branded gasolines are rated as "Top Tier" fuels and contain the additives to keep your fuel injectors clean. Non branded fuels generally meet the minimum standards as established by the federal government. Premium contains NO additional benefits other than being higher octane...usually 91 or 93.

Therefore, putting a tank of premium in periodically serves no benefits as far as cleaning your system.

Not so sure about that..... the octane rating is a minimum. The octane rating could be a point higher but they have to maintain atleast the stated ratings.

From Exxon/Mobil

Exxon and Mobil Synergy™ Regular Gasoline

Our regular grade unleaded gasoline was developed to meet the needs of most vehicles in America and is our most popular gasoline.

Gasoline Octane 89
Exxon and Mobil Synergy™ Extra Gasoline

Our midgrade unleaded gasoline was developed to meet the needs of vehicles that can benefit from a higher octane, such as some sport vehicles and high-performance cars.

Gasoline Octane 91
Exxon and Mobil Synergy SUPREME+™ Gasoline

Our premium grade unleaded gasoline was formulated with a higher octane level and additional detergent additives to meet the demands of some of today’s most advanced engines. It generally has an octane level of 93 but is blended with an octane level of 91 or 92 in certain areas of the U.S.

Here is a link to this information also, https://www.exxon.com/en/unleaded-gasoline

[Oneilkeys]

If you believe AAA, who has no ax to grind:

https://gasprices.aaa.com/fuel-quality/

Car fax also has a good article on it.

https://www.carfax.com/blog/top-tier...edicine-engine

Top Tier does make a difference and it’s not about octane. Major auto manufacturers with high performance engines highly recommend top tier gas because of the additional additives that help clean your engine. US standards have not changed since the mid 80s. You think auto engines have changed a bit in the last 35 years?

[PAtrailtrimmer]

My Ford E450 manual says:

Your vehicle is designed to operate on regular unleaded gasoline with a minimum pump (R+M)/2 octane rating of 87.

Some fuel stations, particularly those in high altitude areas, offer fuels posted as regular unleaded gasoline with an octane rating below 87.

For best overall vehicle and engine performance, premium fuel with an octane rating of 91 or higher is recommended. The performance gained by using premium fuel is most noticeable in hot weather as well as other conditions, for example when towing a trailer. See Towing (page 102).

Do not be concerned if the engine sometimes knocks lightly. However, if the engine knocks heavily while using fuel with the recommended octane rating, contact an authorized dealer to prevent any engine damage.

We recommend Top Tier detergent gasolines, where available to help minimize engine deposits and maintain optimal vehicle and engine performance. For additional information, refer to https://www.toptiergas.com/.

[Miramar Owner]

Originally Posted by rynosback

Not so sure about that..... the octane rating is a minimum. The octane rating could be a point higher but they have to maintain atleast the stated ratings.

From Exxon/Mobil

Exxon and Mobil Synergy™ Regular Gasoline

Our regular grade unleaded gasoline was developed to meet the needs of most vehicles in America and is our most popular gasoline.

Gasoline Octane 89
Exxon and Mobil Synergy™ Extra Gasoline

Our midgrade unleaded gasoline was developed to meet the needs of vehicles that can benefit from a higher octane, such as some sport vehicles and high-performance cars.

Gasoline Octane 91
Exxon and Mobil Synergy SUPREME+™ Gasoline

Our premium grade unleaded gasoline was formulated with a higher octane level and additional detergent additives to meet the demands of some of today’s most advanced engines. It generally has an octane level of 93 but is blended with an octane level of 91 or 92 in certain areas of the U.S.

Here is a link to this information also, https://www.exxon.com/en/unleaded-gasoline

As I previously stated, I am NOT and expert, but having been in the business for over 40 years I can speak to what I see. Part of what causes the confusion is the sales pitch from the various brands.

The various brands of fuel generally obtain their product from the SAME terminals. For example, in Iowa, all fuel comes from about 8 different fuel terminals throughout the state. Only BP has exclusive terminals and even they have exchange agreements with other terminals for the times they run out. I have been with my transport driver, lined up with all the different brands displayed on the side of the trailer. They all get the same gasoline, then add the proper additive for the brand.

The same is true for premium. Premium gasoline is simply refined further than regular 87 octane fuel. Gasoline octane can be enhanced by adding alcohol. For example 87 octane can be pure gasoline, refined to that grade or it can be 85 octane with 10% alcohol bringing it to 87 octane.. Some states require all fuels to be labeled if they contain 10% alcohol and some do not.

I provide all this information to say use the fuel your manual says for your specific application, don't buy the hype and stick with branded gasoline.

[Oneilkeys]

Originally Posted by PAtrailtrimmer

My Ford E450 manual says:

Your vehicle is designed to operate on regular unleaded gasoline with a minimum pump (R+M)/2 octane rating of 87.

Some fuel stations, particularly those in high altitude areas, offer fuels posted as regular unleaded gasoline with an octane rating below 87.

For best overall vehicle and engine performance, premium fuel with an octane rating of 91 or higher is recommended. The performance gained by using premium fuel is most noticeable in hot weather as well as other conditions, for example when towing a trailer. See Towing (page 102).

Do not be concerned if the engine sometimes knocks lightly. However, if the engine knocks heavily while using fuel with the recommended octane rating, contact an authorized dealer to prevent any engine damage.

We recommend Top Tier detergent gasolines, where available to help minimize engine deposits and maintain optimal vehicle and engine performance. For additional information, refer to https://www.toptiergas.com/.

Right. Some states out West have 85.5 octane gas and I put it in my Vegas without realizing it several years back. The engine ‘pinged” and was not happy. After half a tank of 90+ octane, it felt much better. I don’t tow, so I have not felt the need to routinely put higher octane in my Axis, except when I was in the Colorado mountains at 10,000 ft. There it definitely improved performance.

[Oneilkeys]

Originally Posted by Miramar Owner

As I previously stated, I am NOT and expert, but having been in the business for over 40 years I can speak to what I see. Part of what causes the confusion is the sales pitch from the various brands.

The various brands of fuel generally obtain their product from the SAME terminals. For example, in Iowa, all fuel comes from about 8 different fuel terminals throughout the state. Only BP has exclusive terminals and even they have exchange agreements with other terminals for the times they run out. I have been with my transport driver, lined up with all the different brands displayed on the side of the trailer. They all get the same gasoline, then add the proper additive for the brand.

The same is true for premium. Premium gasoline is simply refined further than regular 87 octane fuel. Gasoline octane can be enhanced by adding alcohol. For example 87 octane can be pure gasoline, refined to that grade or it can be 85 octane with 10% alcohol bringing it to 87 octane.. Some states require all fuels to be labeled if they contain 10% alcohol and some do not.

I provide all this information to say use the fuel your manual says for your specific application, don't buy the hype and stick with branded gasoline.

Since many major auto manufacturers recommend top tier gas for their cars, while I agree that much of the gas comes from the same supplier and the basic gas is the same, it is the additives that the top tier gas stations add to the basic gas that is the issue and makes the difference. That is where the major confusion comes in. I had an e-mail discussion with Pilot several years ago when I asked why they were not top tier gas. Their answer basically was because their customers did not demand it and it cost them money, so it was not worth their while. I am not manic about it, but I routinely put top tier gas in all four of my vehicles whenever I can.

[Bob Denman]

Originally Posted by gmtech16450yz

Lol.

Looks like nothing's changed on this forum, still a wealth of misinformation from the resident "experts".

It's sad because the people reading this bs just end up passing the false information on to the next unsuspecting reader. Welcome to the internet.

Okay: I'll bite...
(That is: Oneilkeys and I will bite...)
What was said that was incorrect, and why?
And what is the correct information?

[Fish and Dear]

Originally Posted by Bob Denman

Okay: I'll bite...
(That is: Oneilkeys and I will bite...)
What was said that was incorrect, and why?
And what is the correct information?

Don't get him started. Another Thor and Ford hater who thinks he knows more than the engineers. I've never seen him post a link to actual verifiable information.

[Bob Denman]

I know!

It's real easy to sit back and find fault with folks...
It's a lot tougher to actually be useful.

(I should know... )

[Judge]

To get the best mileage, it is not about Octane rating but about how much Ethanol is in the fuel.

The V10 can handle from 0 to 15% Ethanol.

The more ethanol, the cheaper the gas but the worse fuel economy you will get. The less ethanol, the more expensive the gas but the better fuel economy you will get.

I have a Chevy Silverado Flex Fuel so I can run E0, E10, E15 or E85. There is measurable differences in fuel economy based on the amount of ethanol in the fuel.


If you run E0 or what is sometimes call Recreational Fuel (Ethanol Free for boats, ATV's, Snowmobiles, etc.), it usually costs more than premium with 10% Ethanol so you have to determine if the fuel economy gains is worth the extra cost.

[Oneilkeys]

The Rec Fuel (no ethanol) in Florida is rated at 90 octane so that the higher performance outboard engines can run on it. I run it in my Miata (which requires 91 octane) (because it sits a lot and ethanol attracts water) and the Miata runs fine on it. With 87 octane, the Miata computer “dumbs down” engine performance (so it won’t knock) and you can really tell the difference.

[gmtech16450yz]

Thanks guys. I appreciate you participating in my test.

I was wondering if I should give this forum another chance but clearly the responses from my admittedly snarky post shows that the closed-minded attitude still runs strong here. My post was meant to expose some member's true colors, and it did exactly that. Wow.

This forum is obviously just for a few select people to be able to run up their post counts and hear themselves talk, without actually giving any valuable, factual information. And the hate talk is clearly still strong also. As I've said before, it's really unfortunate because people like me could share a lot of good info on here if it wasn't met with such opposition. Like how I'm safely up an additional 85ft/lbs of torque and almost 50hp over stock 2V V10 power. And how I just came back from a 430 mile trip and still have almost a half a tank of gas left in my E450 gas tank. Yep, I regularly get 550-600 miles out of a tank of gas, and I'm rarely under 70mph, we usually cruise at 75-80. Is it premium? Is it regular? Hmmmm. And how about you guys running 5 Star tunes, I could tell you EXACTLY what they change in their tunes because I have their calibration files. Hint, it does NOTHING for gas mileage and only gives the illusion of a power increase because they manipulate the driver demand tables which basically make the throttle go wide open when your pedal is only at 35%. Yikes. And whether the V10 "likes to rev" or not? Lol. That one made me laugh. So much wrong being spouted as gospel by people that have no idea what they're talking about. This was another good one...

put higher octane in my Axis, except when I was in the Colorado mountains at 10,000 ft. There it definitely improved performance.

Clearly your rv engine defies the laws of physics. lol.

Those are just a few little examples (that directly relate to this thread) of what I "could" share here, if this forum wasn't dominated by a few members that keep people like me away. Is it simply a matter of bitter, grumpy old men? IDK but these RV forums don't seem like they have an abundance of open minded people willing to learn. Interesting and kinda sad.