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Old 03-30-2019, 09:47 PM   #1
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THOR #557
2018 Windsport weird electrical problem

Like I said this is a weird problem but I will try to explain as best I can.
All three TVs (main, bedroom, and outside) turn off after 30 minutes.
I unplugged the Main TV and plugged it into another A/C outlet and it stays on.
I disconnected from shore power and used the inverter - the TV stayed on.
I turned off the inverter and started the generator and the TVs again turned off after 30 minutes.
The time is a consistent 30 minutes.
Has anyone had this problem? The Thor customer service has been great but haven't an answer.
Randal
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Old 03-30-2019, 10:25 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by Rhamilton001 View Post
Like I said this is a weird problem but I will try to explain as best I can.
All three TVs (main, bedroom, and outside) turn off after 30 minutes.
I unplugged the Main TV and plugged it into another A/C outlet and it stays on.
I disconnected from shore power and used the inverter - the TV stayed on.
I turned off the inverter and started the generator and the TVs again turned off after 30 minutes.
The time is a consistent 30 minutes.
Has anyone had this problem? The Thor customer service has been great but haven't an answer.
Randal
You have probably got the sleep timer set on the TV to 30 minutes. Just go into the TV's menu and delete the time or set it to zero.
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Old 03-30-2019, 10:28 PM   #3
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Sorry

I should have added that. All three TVs have the sleep timer set to OFF.
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Old 03-30-2019, 11:55 PM   #4
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If you have two on, do they both go off at same time?
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Old 03-31-2019, 12:42 AM   #5
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Well a head scratcher to keep the grey matter churning. Are you sure the DW doesn’t have a master remote hidden and is turning all TVs off on you? April 1st is coming up fast.




The original post says all three appliances turn off after 30 minutes.....fair to assume at exactly the same time? Sleep timers are not set on any of them. Can we assume all three TVs are on an inverter fed circuit(s), but they only shut off by themselves when running on normal AC power sources from shore or generator (which should normally just pass through the inverter transfer switch) to the TVs. The TVs don’t have any problems shutting down in 30 minutes when shore or gen are off. So inverter running off batteries runs all TVs fine with no shut offs. So if its not the DW......then it is something cutting off the shore/gen AC feed to/through the inverter. The inverter AC output should kick on when the normal sources are shut off. I doubt it is the coach shore/gen AC transfer switch, but is there any device like a permanently installed Progressive Industries (or other vendor) AC power line monitor between the AC transfer switch output and the converter AC input? I think the progressive boxes do have delay timers but typically a couple minutes delay cutover only for generator startup delay. So basically you have to keep the DW in the same room as you with hands showing when the TVs shutoff again.



A good one for sure but maybe there is some info missing or incomplete?
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Old 03-31-2019, 01:35 PM   #6
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Thank you very much for the replies.
I should add another tidbit.
All TVs are made by Exxera and all run off of 120vac. The inverter is an Xantrex xm1000 factory installed.
And yes all of TVs shut down at the exact same time.
The microwave clock stays set so the power interruption must be very quick or maybe a slight drop in voltage.
BTW. I will lock the DW in the house during my next test. ��
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Old 03-31-2019, 02:30 PM   #7
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Well that is something new…….if the microwave is also on the inverter circuit that feeds all three TVs? If yes, then maybe a short time duration power line spike/drop affects the Axxera tvs, while the microwave remains unaffected. A 1000 watt inverter seems small to run a microwave and three TVs though. The question is why the 30 minute hit on power line only when running on shore or generator? There would be a hit on AC power when transferring from inverter to shore or generator power and back to inverter power again that would do it, but why the regular 30 minute cycle? Did this problem just start after something else electrical was changed in the coach or has it always been an issue?
Just for fun and giggles I would be tempted to ensure the inverter AC line which feeds the TVs and microwave wiring connections (H, N, G) are all tight, both at the inverter output and at the AC breaker panel. Take care to shut off all power sources when doing that of course. I would also turn off the two largest TVs and just run one small Axxera by itself and see if the 30 minute shut off cycle continues.
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Old 03-31-2019, 03:05 PM   #8
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Thanks Javelin for your reply.
I actually jus bought the 2018 Windsport and it only has Ferry miles. So everything is factory stock. I will ensure tight connections if and when I find the inverter. :-)
It is the 30minutes that is the stumper.
I will try your suggestion and only run the smallest TV and post the results.
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Old 03-31-2019, 03:06 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhamilton001 View Post
Thank you very much for the replies.
I should add another tidbit.
All TVs are made by Exxera and all run off of 120vac. The inverter is an Xantrex xm1000 factory installed.
And yes all of TVs shut down at the exact same time.
The microwave clock stays set so the power interruption must be very quick or maybe a slight drop in voltage.
BTW. I will lock the DW in the house during my next test. ��
That indicates a loose or poor power connection
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Old 03-31-2019, 03:35 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhamilton001 View Post
Thank you very much for the replies.
I should add another tidbit.
All TVs are made by Exxera and all run off of 120vac. The inverter is an Xantrex xm1000 factory installed.
And yes all of TVs shut down at the exact same time.
The microwave clock stays set so the power interruption must be very quick or maybe a slight drop in voltage.
BTW. I will lock the DW in the house during my next test. ��
I'm thinking some type of self test in the inverter that is quickly switching to inverter power then back to gen/SP 30 minutes after it senses AC load?
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Old 03-31-2019, 05:15 PM   #11
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THOR #557
Looked through the inverter's manual for a self test feature and didn't find any reference to one.
Ran the bedroom TV and it turned off at 26 minutes.
Ran again and it turned off at 29 minutes.

Found the inverter under the bed. Would like to show a picture of the rat's nest but don't know how to send a pic.

I appreciate everyone's responses. I will continue trying to isolate the problem but am thinking I will take it back to the dealer (200mi) and make it their problem.

If we find a fix or if I find additional clues I will let you all know
Thanks everyone
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Old 03-31-2019, 05:57 PM   #12
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Update:

For this test I left the inverter on but still using shore power.
The TV has now stayed on for almost an hour. Everything leads me to think something is wrong with the inverter.
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Old 03-31-2019, 08:08 PM   #13
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I am pretty sure that regardless of if your inverter is switched on or off, the gen or shore AC will pass through the inverter transfer relay unaffected. If the inverter is switched on, and shore or gen voltage fails or drops to around 90 VAC the inverter will switchover to inverter power (fed from your coach batteries). You mentioned in your first post that with inverter off and shore or gen on would cause the tvs to turn off every 30 minutes or so.......so I am not sure how the inverter transfer relay could switch over even momentarily to inverter power, which would break the shore/gen feed. That inverter transfer relay must be opening up the normal (shore/gen) AC path even when turned off. It would be interesting to kill the DC feed to the inverter and see what happens to your test......just to see if the inverter transfer relay is the problem.
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Old 04-01-2019, 12:53 AM   #14
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I free that having the inverter on or off shouldn't make any difference while connected to shore power.
I disconnected to negative lead on the house batteries but the inverter control panel still read 13.7vdc. ??? The only DC should be from the engine battery or the converter.

I then hit the battery disconnect switch and the panel went blank. I then tried to reconnect the battery but the panel stayed blank.

Silly stuff
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Old 04-01-2019, 01:31 AM   #15
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Talking

Hi, I just wondered if the inverter transfer relay was somehow momentarily being operated even though the inverter was shut off (and also had no DC either). There is not much else that can be causing this problem, so it has to be the inverter or its transfer relay causing a short spike fail open of AC that causes the TVs to turn off; but short enough that the microwave is not affected. Very strange. Usually inverters just have their own DC fuse wired off the coach batteries by the way. Just restore your battery connection and turn use store back on and make sure you are all working again. Since you have a new coach you might have to ask your Dealer to resolve this one. They can substitute a new inverter and see if that makes a difference. The regular 30 second failure is the real head scratcher. Sorry for your hassle.
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Old 04-01-2019, 12:46 PM   #16
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Javelin,
I appreciate your efforts in trying to help me figure this out.
I will take it back to the dealer and let them test and replace as necessary.
I will post again once the issue is resolved.
Thanks to all who replied
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Old 04-02-2019, 05:07 PM   #17
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I wonder if plugging a multi-meter into an outlet and then set a video recorder to see what happens to the power when the TV goes off would help?
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Old 04-02-2019, 06:04 PM   #18
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Hi, I suspect that the power hit to the TV AC feed (if that is what is happening) would be so fast that a regular voltmeter would probably either not show it or would be just too slow to react to it. Remember if it is a momentary power dip/spike caused by the inverter (we don't know that for sure but suspect it), the microwave display survives it while the TVs do not.....they shut off. Perhaps another brand of TV would not see it either? I suspect an oscilloscope across the line with suitable protections would be able to capture a pulse or at least help track down the culprit. Probably the easiest approach is just replace the inverter temporarily (under warrantee) and see if the problem goes away. Maybe the dealer has seen this one before too? For all we know at the moment it could just be a bad transfer relay in the inverter (contacts or something strange). The 30 minute interval is still the real head scratcher part.
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Old 04-02-2019, 06:08 PM   #19
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apr67,
That is a great idea. However, I now have another problem.
I was standing outside and reached inside to turn off the batt disconnect and accidently extended the awning. No big deal, right? Well when I retracted it it came in to the stops and then extended out about 1 1/2 feet.
I have made an appointment with the dealer next week. It is now their problem to resolve.
Thank you veryone for the inputs.
If solved I will post the results
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Old 04-02-2019, 06:21 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Rhamilton001 View Post
apr67,
That is a great idea. However, I now have another problem.
I was standing outside and reached inside to turn off the batt disconnect and accidently extended the awning. No big deal, right? Well when I retracted it it came in to the stops and then extended out about 1 1/2 feet.
I have made an appointment with the dealer next week. It is now their problem to resolve.
Thank you veryone for the inputs.
If solved I will post the results
I wonder if this might be related to the Xantrex being a non pure sine wave inverter as I've read that some electronics can be sensitive to such inverters.
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