Generator won't start unless engine is running!

[charlie_kay]

My 2017 Axis has been operating fine on this 7000 mile road trip and we are on the final leg. I changed the generator oil and then about an hour later, the generator will only start when the Coach engine is running (but there is more). So when you turn the engine on, I have to Wait about 2 minutes and then I hear a "click" coming from the front end of the coach. The same sound you hear when you push the "emergency start" button on the dash. After that "click" happens, the generator will start as well as the dash stereo (no power to radio when engine is off). The generator starts and will continue to run until I turn the coach engine off. I am not an electrician or mechanic by any means and am looking for some help! Everything else electric works like normal, except for the generator and dash stereo. Thanks all.

-Charles

[JamieGeek]

Sounds to me that your use/store switch is on Store thus your house battery is disconnected.

That click you are hearing is the BIRD switching over to charge the house battery after the engine has been running for two minutes.

[charlie_kay]

Originally Posted by JamieGeek

Sounds to me that your use/store switch is on Store thus your house battery is disconnected.

That click you are hearing is the BIRD switching over to charge the house battery after the engine has been running for two minutes.

That was the first thing I checked, the use/store switch is on use.

[mcars302]

Are you house batteries charged? I would also check the water in each cell along with connections.

[charlie_kay]

They are charged full. I'll check the water..I tried pushing the "emergency start" button while engine and generator were on just as a test and it immediately turned the generator off. The only way to turn it back on was to turn the engine off and restart it and then wait the two minutes again. Before when this emergency start button was accidentally pushed while the engine and generator were running, nothing would happen except you hear the click sound and then it would continue running like normal.

[JamieGeek]

Look for a breaker in the house battery compartment. If the flag is showing the breaker has tripped. Press the flag back in to reset it.

[charlie_kay]

Checked that one and the one in the engine compartment. Both flags were normal but reset them anyway to try. Still happening [emoji848] I suppose I'll just deal with it and take it in when I get home for service.

[blw2]

well.... in my thinking things were really pointing to a dead house battery.....until that last post.
The clunk you hear is your relay that ties together the two battery systems. The BIRD delay relay controls that delay. Mine is by Intellitec. I got familiar with mine recently when I discovered my continuous duty relay was bad and replaced it.

I'll copy below from the manual, explaining how the thing works....
but the bit about using the E-Start button to tie the two systems together killing the running generator doesn't add up for me. My gut tells me it's voltage drop.... I understand the genny needs 12V for control circuits and such.
but maybe the bird is dropping out and isolating the house battery because it's dead and pushing the e-start drops the voltage too much for the genny..... I don't know, just thinking out loud....
or maybe it's something funny happening with both the alternator charging + the converter trying to charge

Anyway, my bet is a bad house battery


excerpts from the Intellitec manual for the unit I have..... scratch that, I'll just attach the manual for reference on how the thing works (of course yours may be a different brand or model)

[charlie_kay]

Originally Posted by blw2

well.... in my thinking things were really pointing to a dead house battery.....until that last post.

The clunk you hear is your relay that ties together the two battery systems. The BIRD delay relay controls that delay. Mine is by Intellitec. I got familiar with mine recently when I discovered my continuous duty relay was bad and replaced it.



I'll copy below from the manual, explaining how the thing works....

but the bit about using the E-Start button to tie the two systems together killing the running generator doesn't add up for me. My gut tells me it's voltage drop.... I understand the genny needs 12V for control circuits and such.

but maybe the bird is dropping out and isolating the house battery because it's dead and pushing the e-start drops the voltage too much for the genny..... I don't know, just thinking out loud....

or maybe it's something funny happening with both the alternator charging + the converter trying to charge



Anyway, my bet is a bad house battery





excerpts from the Intellitec manual for the unit I have..... scratch that, I'll just attach the manual for reference on how the thing works (of course yours may be a different brand or model)

Thank you! That does make some sense. For the past week when I was starting the generator with the engine off, it really seemed to struggle to turn over. So now that it won't start at all with the engine off does make sense for a completely bad battery. I'll check that manual out as well. If it is a bad battery, they will have to replace it because the dang thing is only 3 months old.

[SuperD]

If you have the original Harris batteries there is a good chance one or more could be bad. Harris is not exactly know for producing good batteries from what I have read on this forum. You need to make sure your water level is up and have the batteries load tested to be sure.

[blw2]

I have learned the hard and expensive way that these batteries are touchy.
They do not like deep discharges (many folks say don't take them past 50% discharge which is around 12.1 volts). This is for the typical RV/Marine hybrid battery (or automotive starting battery). Golf cart batteries can go much lower
Anyway....when they get below this, even once, harm is done and their total capacity is reduced. Doesn't take too many times for them to be killed completely.

The other thing is that they will self discharge
meaning that a full battery, completely disconnected from everything, will still drop charge.... I have read around 5% per month, which seems to be about right in my experience..... so a full 100% battery sitting will be at 95% in a month. If the battery was at 60%, in a couple months of storage, maybe less, it can be damaged.
It's because of this one of the first thing many of us do is to install a physical switch to disconnect the battery completely, and not rely on that relay the RV manufacturers put in. There still might be something connected, or even just a stray current. i have a disconnect on my chassis battery too, and disconnect both whenever i park and store it.

My theory is that these things sit on a dealer lot, the salesman might leave a light on when showing the unit and it sits all night out there with the light on....Battery down to near zero. Several weeks later they recharge it, but already it won't hold a full amp-hour capacity charge. A couple cycles and you really have a damaged unit.

[charlie_kay]

Great advice..thanks all. I'll look into all that.

[danger716]

We had the same issue. Solved by pushing in reset button to the left of the house batteries. There was a yellow flag/button sticking out.