Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 

Go Back   Thor Forums > Thor Tech Forums > Maintenance and Repair
Click Here to Login
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 11-27-2017, 03:33 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 30.3 Sold
State: Arkansas
Posts: 439
THOR #8012
Leveler low voltage light -- checked it is low voltage but why

ACE 30.3

Ok, this weekend my LCI control panel (the one without LCD's) flashed low voltage. It still worked in manual mode, which is all I use now for leveling (I usually use auto for raising, however).

So, I called the tech support line of the extended warranty I have and talked to a tech. He told me to check the voltage going into the control box to see if it was really low. If it was normal, then it was most likely a problem with the controller.

This isn't a high amp breaker that I know some have experienced, where the pump wouldn't run at all, because in my case it will run on manual.

The controller seems to get it's power from the chassis battery, and the pump from a high amp line from the coach batteries.

So, I checked the power going into the control panel and it was around 11.7 the two times it was showing low voltage on the control pad. Including after three days hooked to 50 amp service at a park, this was when I arrived on Friday after a two hour drive, and then when I left Sunday after being hooked to 50 amp service in between. Both times with engine running.

However, when I was trouble shooting things on Saturday, it didn't give me the low voltage and when I checked the power going into the control box, it was around 13 or so (don't remember exactly).

So, any thoughts on why I'm sometimes getting low voltage? Does this sound like a bad battery? Bad ground? Bad alternator? It's something related to the chassis, but not sure which. There is no battery/volt gauge on the F53, but the battery warning light has not come on.

__________________
tnedator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2017, 03:48 PM   #2
Site Team
 
16ACE27's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 27.1
State: Florida
Posts: 14,116
THOR #7035
Doesn't make much sense for the power for the pump to come from the house batteries and the "Low Voltage" detection to come from the chassis battery, but I wouldn't put it past Thor to have it wired that way.

If it really is coming from the house batteries, and you were plugged in, then your voltage should have been over 13 volts.
If you had unplugged you still should have had 12.6 volts.

But this is academic since by procedure, you have to start the coach, and the alternator/BIRD should put 14.5 volts on the batteries, both chassis and house.

Next time you get the low voltage light check the voltage at both the chassis and house batteries to make sure the "source" is good.
__________________
Ted & Melinda
2016 ACE 27.1
2016 Chevy Sonic Toad - Selling
2020 Chevy Colorado Z71 Trail Runner Toad
2024 Chevrolet Trax 2RS - Soon 2B TOAD
16ACE27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2017, 04:37 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 30.3 Sold
State: Arkansas
Posts: 439
THOR #8012
There is a high amp breaker in the coach battery compartment that the tech said was for pump, and I checked wiring label and it was. I need to double check and make sure it's not just located there, but essentially getting power from chassis battery.

We did check voltage at the terminals of one coach battery and chassis battery, but I think the coach was off at this time, but hooked to shore power. Both were around 13.6.

I didn't check with the coach running, which I should have to confirm alternator is working correctly.

On coach vs. House. To be clear, the way I think it's wired is that the control module (brains), which includes the auto leveling sensor, is fed by the chassis battery, and is powered with ignition switched to on.

From that module, there is a bundle of about eight wires that goes to the pump to trigger it and the appropriate valve/cylinder, but then the pump power comes from a thick, high amp wire running to breaker in coach battery compartment.
__________________
tnedator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2017, 06:17 PM   #4
Site Team
 
16ACE27's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 27.1
State: Florida
Posts: 14,116
THOR #7035
On my ACE the panel comes on regardless of ignition switch position but will display the low voltage light if I try to do anything that involves running the pump, even if I am connected to shore power. My control module is in the same compartment as the house batteries and high current disconnect for the pump. I haven't traced out the wiring to see where the control panel is powered from.
__________________
Ted & Melinda
2016 ACE 27.1
2016 Chevy Sonic Toad - Selling
2020 Chevy Colorado Z71 Trail Runner Toad
2024 Chevrolet Trax 2RS - Soon 2B TOAD
16ACE27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2017, 08:15 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
schreinertms's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Challenger 37TB
State: Pennsylvania
Posts: 412
THOR #4486
I have had the low voltage error on my LCI leveler panel since coach was new. LCI told me to add more batteries to the house bank. The low voltage goes away if I either run the generator or plug the coach into shore before putting down the jacks.
__________________
Tom and Lisa
Pennsylvania
2015 Challenger 37TB
2015 Ford Taurus toad
schreinertms is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2017, 08:49 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Gemini 24TX (Formerly)
State: California
Posts: 1,459
THOR #5821
I would think since the panel will only work with the ignition on, the panel would be powered from the chassis battery, probably through the ignition switch, as that panel is a pretty low power draw. The hydraulic motor, on the other hand draws a lot, and it would make sense to power it from the house batteries. On mine, if I level when not plugged in, I see a pretty drastic voltage drop while that pump is running.
__________________
Laco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2017, 08:59 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Druff's Avatar
 
Brand: Still Looking
Model: 2019 Coachman Catalina
State: Wisconsin
Posts: 216
THOR #5432
On my Chateau the sticker says the engine is supposed to be running when operating the leveling system
__________________
Druff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2017, 09:45 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
schreinertms's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Challenger 37TB
State: Pennsylvania
Posts: 412
THOR #4486
Forgot to mention that I always run the engine during jack operation. Even with the engine running and alternator supplying 14 volts to the chassis battery, the low voltage error on the LCI panel is present. Once I hook up to shore power or run the gen, low voltage error goes away and jacks operator fine in auto or manual mode.
__________________
Tom and Lisa
Pennsylvania
2015 Challenger 37TB
2015 Ford Taurus toad
schreinertms is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2017, 10:22 PM   #9
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Hurricane 35C
State: Maryland
Posts: 252
THOR #3227
Tendator - I had the same issue with my 2016 Hurricane 35C since new. I called the
levelor company (name escapes me right now and MH is in storage). The tech walked me through the procedure to reset the system through a series of pushing buttons on the keypad. I have not had an issue since. As I said the MH is I storage and the procedure I wrote down is with it. Give them a call.
__________________
Jim K - Avenue, Maryland
2016 Thor Hurricane 35C
2015 Ford F-150 King Ranch
2013 Chrysler 300 "S", 1936 Chrysler C-8
2012 Jeep Liberty Limited Edition
Brakeman48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2017, 10:36 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Gemini 24TX (Formerly)
State: California
Posts: 1,459
THOR #5821
Quote:
Originally Posted by schreinertms View Post
Forgot to mention that I always run the engine during jack operation. Even with the engine running and alternator supplying 14 volts to the chassis battery, the low voltage error on the LCI panel is present. Once I hook up to shore power or run the gen, low voltage error goes away and jacks operator fine in auto or manual mode.
Wondering if you have a marginal house battery. Would be worth load testing them, just to know one way or the other.
__________________
Laco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-28-2017, 03:46 AM   #11
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 30.3 Sold
State: Arkansas
Posts: 439
THOR #8012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brakeman48 View Post
Tendator - I had the same issue with my 2016 Hurricane 35C since new. I called the
levelor company (name escapes me right now and MH is in storage). The tech walked me through the procedure to reset the system through a series of pushing buttons on the keypad. I have not had an issue since. As I said the MH is I storage and the procedure I wrote down is with it. Give them a call.
I'll check it out and give Lippert a call.

What's strange in this case, and the reason I didn't think it was a reset issue (I did a lot of searching and read about that over the weekend) was that the on call tech I talked to walked me through checking the voltage prior to the control box and it was in fact low.

So, I don't think that it's just a confused leveler controller, which I read can happen if the jacks are overextended and the like, but in fact a true low voltage situation.

I'm going to give Lippert a call, but also will try and make it out to where it's stored in the next couple days and check the coach battery with the engine running to see if I get the 14.2, or if I might have an alternator problem.

I know hooked to shore power I'm seeing 13.2 or 13.4 or in that area at both the chassis and house batteries, but I didn't check with coach running, which is what happens when the leveler is run.
__________________
tnedator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-28-2017, 12:00 PM   #12
gmc
Senior Member
 
gmc's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Hurricane 32A
State: Florida
Posts: 1,873
THOR #2829
Quote:
Originally Posted by schreinertms View Post
Forgot to mention that I always run the engine during jack operation. Even with the engine running and alternator supplying 14 volts to the chassis battery, the low voltage error on the LCI panel is present. Once I hook up to shore power or run the gen, low voltage error goes away and jacks operator fine in auto or manual mode.
In this case sounds like the BIRD is not connecting your coach/chassis batteries while engine is running.... Which would send alternator current to coach batteries.

Plugging in or running Genny powers the converter to charge the house batteries... The BIRD in this case would allow shore/Genny power to charge chassis.

I'd do some voltage readings at both battery banks in different states of engine/shore/Genny to see what is happening.

Above assumes use/store switch is in USE....
__________________
Greg
Not yet retired...
Florida (Michigan transplant)
2014 Hurricane 32A
2000 Infinity (previous)
gmc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-28-2017, 12:57 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
schreinertms's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Challenger 37TB
State: Pennsylvania
Posts: 412
THOR #4486
gmc and Laco: Thanks for the tips. I will certainly perform the diagnostics recommended when time permits and post the outcome.
__________________
Tom and Lisa
Pennsylvania
2015 Challenger 37TB
2015 Ford Taurus toad
schreinertms is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-28-2017, 01:00 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: Georgia
Posts: 2,585
THOR #4735
what you'll find is this:

- the 12v 'Leveler Panel is operated and powered thru the CHASSIS battery(s), since it is run thru the IGNITION switch - the ignition must be either ON, or the engine running, to operate. The system WILL work with only the ignition 'ON', but most folks normally have the engine already running when they arrive and are ready to level.

- the Hydraulic LEGS, though, run off the HOUSE batteries, thru a high-amp bus fuse, since they draw a lot of amps to move the legs, especially when the weight of the coach is on them. The 'Low Voltage' alert is referring to these HOUSE batteries, NOT the chassis battery(s). But, even with this 'low voltage' alert, it does NOT mean that your levelers will not work - they just won't in 'Auto' mode, but WILL in 'Manual' mode.

... since it's the HOUSE batteries that drive the movement of the legs, having the engine running has little effect on this, but having either SHORE POWER, or the Generator, CHARGING the batteries WILL. Eventually, of course, the 'low voltage' alert will go away as the re-charging of the batteries bring them up to an acceptable level.


Many times, after parked for a while, our coach may need to be re-leveled. I don't CRANK the engine, but only turn 'ON' the ignition - then turn ON the leveler pad, go into Manual mode, and push whichever arrow that needs attention. The only thing that happens during this time is that the steps retract, which is also one of those 12v items that are on the CHASSIS batteries, and controlled by the ignition.
__________________
the Turners...
two Campers, two Electric cars
former diesel pusher traveler
TurnerFam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-28-2017, 03:00 PM   #15
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 30.3 Sold
State: Arkansas
Posts: 439
THOR #8012
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurnerFam View Post
what you'll find is this:

- the 12v 'Leveler Panel is operated and powered thru the CHASSIS battery(s), since it is run thru the IGNITION switch - the ignition must be either ON, or the engine running, to operate. The system WILL work with only the ignition 'ON', but most folks normally have the engine already running when they arrive and are ready to level.

- the Hydraulic LEGS, though, run off the HOUSE batteries, thru a high-amp bus fuse, since they draw a lot of amps to move the legs, especially when the weight of the coach is on them. The 'Low Voltage' alert is referring to these HOUSE batteries, NOT the chassis battery(s). But, even with this 'low voltage' alert, it does NOT mean that your levelers will not work - they just won't in 'Auto' mode, but WILL in 'Manual' mode.

... since it's the HOUSE batteries that drive the movement of the legs, having the engine running has little effect on this, but having either SHORE POWER, or the Generator, CHARGING the batteries WILL. Eventually, of course, the 'low voltage' alert will go away as the re-charging of the batteries bring them up to an acceptable level.


Many times, after parked for a while, our coach may need to be re-leveled. I don't CRANK the engine, but only turn 'ON' the ignition - then turn ON the leveler pad, go into Manual mode, and push whichever arrow that needs attention. The only thing that happens during this time is that the steps retract, which is also one of those 12v items that are on the CHASSIS batteries, and controlled by the ignition.
Thanks for the breakdown.

Question. What am I missing here?

Plugged into 50 amp shorepower for about two hours, I turned ignition to either accessory or ran engine (can't remember which, because I did multiple tests).

I disconnected the power going into the control box in a passenger side compartment and measured the voltage at 11.7. I then checked both the house batteries (checking at the terminals) and chassis and both were reading around 13.4.

If I was getting a 13.4 reading at the terminals, shouldn't I be getting the same reading on the LCI control box power input?
__________________
tnedator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-28-2017, 03:37 PM   #16
Site Team
 
16ACE27's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 27.1
State: Florida
Posts: 14,116
THOR #7035
Is this where you are checking your voltages? Pin 1 to pin 7? Pin 1 to chassis ground? + on the battery to pin 7?

__________________
Ted & Melinda
2016 ACE 27.1
2016 Chevy Sonic Toad - Selling
2020 Chevy Colorado Z71 Trail Runner Toad
2024 Chevrolet Trax 2RS - Soon 2B TOAD
16ACE27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-28-2017, 03:40 PM   #17
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 30.3 Sold
State: Arkansas
Posts: 439
THOR #8012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tfryman View Post
Is this where you are checking your voltages? Pin 1 to pin 7? Pin 1 to chassis ground? + on the battery to pin 7?

No, that looks like the wire harness that runs from the control box in my middle, passenger side compartment, to the pump. On that control box (I'm assuming that's where the sensor for detecting is also measured) there is a connector with only two wires connected to it (the connector is actually a six or eight pin connector, but only two wires running to it).

This is the power into the control box that is not located in the same place as the pump.
__________________
tnedator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-28-2017, 03:50 PM   #18
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 30.3 Sold
State: Arkansas
Posts: 439
THOR #8012
Ok, I just found this doing a google search on LCI wiring. It was posted over on a forest river forum.

Where I'm reading it is the upper left, where they've written in red 12v coming from ignition. I'm reading the voltage on those red/white wires.

Now, I wonder if it could be as simple as parking brake not being fully engaged and not providing a solid ground, since this LCI diagram indicates that the ground is coming from the parking brake. I'm not sure exactly how that ground via the parking brake is initiated, but I wonder if there are times I'm pushing the parking far enough to just barely make contact and I have a bad ground at times.

Sometimes my voltage is great, sometimes not, which is why I'm wondering about an iffy ground.

I still need to do the tests mentioned above to confirm there is no BIRD issue, but I also need to experiment with the parking brake and also see if there is a possibility of a lose ground wire somewhere along the path.

__________________
tnedator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-28-2017, 04:38 PM   #19
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Gemini 24TX (Formerly)
State: California
Posts: 1,459
THOR #5821
Turner,
Once leveled your coach should stay leveled, unless there is a hydraulic leak somewhere in the system. If its not leaking out, you could be leaking hydraulic fluid from the jacks back into the reservoir.
__________________
Laco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-28-2017, 04:52 PM   #20
Site Team
 
16ACE27's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 27.1
State: Florida
Posts: 14,116
THOR #7035
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laco View Post
Turner,
Once leveled your coach should stay leveled, unless there is a hydraulic leak somewhere in the system. If its not leaking out, you could be leaking hydraulic fluid from the jacks back into the reservoir.
Or the ground compresses......
__________________
Ted & Melinda
2016 ACE 27.1
2016 Chevy Sonic Toad - Selling
2020 Chevy Colorado Z71 Trail Runner Toad
2024 Chevrolet Trax 2RS - Soon 2B TOAD
16ACE27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Thor Industries or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.




All times are GMT. The time now is 11:34 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2