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Old 04-02-2020, 06:25 PM   #1
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THOR #18178
House batteries and chassis battery dead

We just picked up our new Challenger 35MQ three weeks ago. When we first went to look at it everything was dead and they had to jump start it. When we picked it up they stated they checked everything and everything was good but they said they replaced the chassis battery.
It's been in the driveway and I have it plugged into a 30 amp outlet. Unplugged it today to move it to the side yard and all batteries are dead. Everything thing in the coach has been off but the refrigerator which should be fine since its on shore power. Checked breakers and fuses all good. The fan on the converter is running so I would think the batteries should be charging. Not sure what to check next.
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Old 04-02-2020, 06:47 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by Jim&Dianna View Post
We just picked up our new Challenger 35MQ three weeks ago. When we first went to look at it everything was dead and they had to jump start it. When we picked it up they stated they checked everything and everything was good but they said they replaced the chassis battery.
It's been in the driveway and I have it plugged into a 30 amp outlet. Unplugged it today to move it to the side yard and all batteries are dead. Everything thing in the coach has been off but the refrigerator which should be fine since its on shore power. Checked breakers and fuses all good. The fan on the converter is running so I would think the batteries should be charging. Not sure what to check next.
Usually the problem is the Master Power is in the store position. If you have an inverter you can check the voltage to the batteries. If the master power is in the store position the battery voltage will be less the 12.8 volts if the master power switch is in the use position the the voltage will read 13.0 volts or more. The light in the switch only shows the switch has power but not the position of the latching relay located under the bed by the power center.
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Old 04-02-2020, 06:59 PM   #3
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THOR #18178
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Originally Posted by Beau388 View Post
Usually the problem is the Master Power is in the store position. If you have an inverter you can check the voltage to the batteries. If the master power is in the store position the battery voltage will be less the 12.8 volts if the master power switch is in the use position the the voltage will read 13.0 volts or more. The light in the switch only shows the switch has power but not the position of the latching relay located under the bed by the power center.
Not to sound stupid but is there a switch to put it is use or storage ?? If so i was never told aboit that. Right now the inverter is not even on.
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Old 04-02-2020, 07:11 PM   #4
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THOR #18178
Are you talking about the master battery disconnect ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim&Dianna View Post
Not to sound stupid but is there a switch to put it is use or storage ?? If so i was never told aboit that. Right now the inverter is not even on.
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Old 04-02-2020, 07:38 PM   #5
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Are you talking about the master battery disconnect ?
Yes he is, BUT: if the only DC load in the coach is the refrigerator then the fan on the converter should not be running. Have you looked at your batteries to see if any of them are new? I suspect the house batteries are toast and not taking a charge. They could also be dragging down the converter and chassis battery if the right conditions are met. Time to test your batteries and buy a multimeter, learn how to use it (a critical RV skill) if you don't already have one, and start some logical troubleshooting.
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Old 04-02-2020, 07:45 PM   #6
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Yes he is, BUT: if the only DC load in the coach is the refrigerator then the fan on the converter should not be running. Have you looked at your batteries to see if any of them are new? I suspect the house batteries are toast and not taking a charge. They could also be dragging down the converter and chassis battery if the right conditions are met. Time to test you batteries and buy a multimeter, learn how to use it (a critical RV skill) if you don't already have one, and start some logical troubleshooting.
It's a 2020 coach I was told they checked the batteries and they where good but they installed a new chassis battery. What I don't understand is why the chassis battery is dead also. Being plugged in I figured they would keep a charge.
The inverter will not even turn on.
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Old 04-02-2020, 08:06 PM   #7
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If you can take the batteries out check the date on them. its usually a round dot with month and year on them and the dot could be anywhere even on the bottom. If the date is over a year old the battery is probably toast but you should contact the dealer to have them replace all of them or at least give you money to buy new ones. This happened to me on my 2018 Compass 23 TB and the dealer got the money from Thor.
BTW I spoke to Harris who made the battery and their warranty is 1 year from manufacture and in my cast the batteries were already out of warranty when I took delivery .
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Old 04-02-2020, 08:15 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Coveman2 View Post
If you can take the batteries out check the date on them. its usually a round dot with month and year on them and the dot could be anywhere even on the bottom. If the date is over a year old the battery is probably toast but you should contact the dealer to have them replace all of them or at least give you money to buy new ones. This happened to me on my 2018 Compass 23 TB and the dealer got the money from Thor.
BTW I spoke to Harris who made the battery and their warranty is 1 year from manufacture and in my cast the batteries were already out of warranty when I took delivery .
Coveman2
I will take a look at the date. The chassis battery should of not died also, I don't understand that plus they said they installed a new one. I'm gonna check that one also.
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Old 04-02-2020, 09:16 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Jim&Dianna View Post
It's a 2020 coach I was told they checked the batteries and they where good but they installed a new chassis battery. What I don't understand is why the chassis battery is dead also. Being plugged in I figured they would keep a charge.
The inverter will not even turn on.
Do you have a separate inverter? Or an inverter/charger? If separate, it won't turn on due to the dead house batteries. Staying plugged in will keep batteries charged IF things are working as designed AND you don't have bad components (like batteries).

How can you tell when the delivery service tech is lying?????
If the chassis battery tested good why did they replace it?
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Old 04-02-2020, 10:35 PM   #10
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Thor MC plant 750 (ACE, Windsport, Freedom Traveler and Hurricane) usually puts master power switch the first thing as you come in the door. It is a house battery disconnect. It used to be labeled Use/Store then Master Power, but I suspect it still there. It works this way. Under the bed is a latching relay that connects the power center (the panel with the circuit breakers and 12 volt fuses) to the house battery(s). This relay is controlled by a momentary switch by the entrance door. Sometimes there is a red light associated with this switch. The light only indicates there is power to the switch and not the position of the relay.

If you have shore power there is no way to know the position of the relay unless you can monitor battery voltage. I use my inverter for the house batteries and a standalone voltmeter connected to the ignition switch for the chassis battery.
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Old 04-02-2020, 10:43 PM   #11
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...you should have a USE/STORE switch right inside your entry door, but with your newer model, it may now be a 'digital pad'...regardless, it let's you choose to 'USE'(up) the coach, meaning that you want to use all of the 12v lights, fans, etc., AND allow the coach to be CHARGING when it has shore power.

...if you have it in the down/STORE position, then it is disconnecting the 12v House batteries, and you'll have no lights, fans, etc., and NO charging, even if plugged in.

You INVERTER, on the other hand, may continue to provide 'pass thru' power from Shore to your FRIDGE, since it is certainly a 120v residential fridge, but it's CHARGER function may not be ON, since you have 'disconnected' the batteries with the switch in the 'STORE' position...

confusing yet??
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Old 04-02-2020, 11:09 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by TurnerFam View Post
...you should have a USE/STORE switch right inside your entry door, but with your newer model, it may now be a 'digital pad'...regardless, it let's you choose to 'USE'(up) the coach, meaning that you want to use all of the 12v lights, fans, etc., AND allow the coach to be CHARGING when it has shore power.

...if you have it in the down/STORE position, then it is disconnecting the 12v House batteries, and you'll have no lights, fans, etc., and NO charging, even if plugged in.

You INVERTER, on the other hand, may continue to provide 'pass thru' power from Shore to your FRIDGE, since it is certainly a 120v residential fridge, but it's CHARGER function may not be ON, since you have 'disconnected' the batteries with the switch in the 'STORE' position...

confusing yet??

Yes, because the bolded statement is incorrect as written:

If plugged in the converter/charger will supply 12 VDC to the DC buss and loads (lights, fans, furnace and thermostat, and fridge control power), but not charge the house batteries if in STORE.
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Old 04-02-2020, 11:24 PM   #13
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these coaches don't use the typical Converter, but an integrated Inverter/Charger - which allows 'pass thru' of 120v power when connected to Shore, but has no facility to provide 12v power if the switch is in the STORE mode... these 12v lights and fans are effectively disabled even if on Shore power if the switch is in Store mode.
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Old 04-02-2020, 11:52 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by TurnerFam View Post
these coaches don't use the typical Converter, but an integrated Inverter/Charger - which allows 'pass thru' of 120v power when connected to Shore, but has no facility to provide 12v power if the switch is in the STORE mode... these 12v lights and fans are effectively disabled even if on Shore power if the switch is in Store mode.
Really? Because the specs I'm looking at for a 2020 Challenger 35MQ say it has an 1800 watt inverter and 55 amp converter. No mention of a combination Inverter/Charger.
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Old 04-03-2020, 03:01 AM   #15
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THOR #18178
It has a 1800 watt inverter but Im not seeing anything about a charger.
My battery disconnect switch in my entry way. When not on shore power I can rurn it on and off but when on shore power it comes on and stays on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 16ACE27 View Post
Really? Because the specs I'm looking at for a 2020 Challenger 35MQ say it has an 1800 watt inverter and 55 amp converter. No mention of a combination Inverter/Charger.
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Old 04-03-2020, 03:18 AM   #16
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THOR #18178
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurnerFam View Post
...you should have a USE/STORE switch right inside your entry door, but with your newer model, it may now be a 'digital pad'...regardless, it let's you choose to 'USE'(up) the coach, meaning that you want to use all of the 12v lights, fans, etc., AND allow the coach to be CHARGING when it has shore power.

...if you have it in the down/STORE position, then it is disconnecting the 12v House batteries, and you'll have no lights, fans, etc., and NO charging, even if plugged in.

You INVERTER, on the other hand, may continue to provide 'pass thru' power from Shore to your FRIDGE, since it is certainly a 120v residential fridge, but it's CHARGER function may not be ON, since you have 'disconnected' the batteries with the switch in the 'STORE' position...

confusing yet??
A little confused because when i use shore power the battery disconnect is on and I'm not able to shut it off. When not using shore power i can turn it on and off.
What I dont understand is how does the chassis battery die while it is on shore power.
All of the batteries are dead and all died while it was on shore power. I can't even turn on the inverter.
We haven't even used the coach yet it has been sitting in the driveway. We sterted moving stuff in it and when I checked the inverter for the charge on the batteries it was down to 11 so thats why I plugged it in to charge the batteries up. Instead I drained them all.
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Old 04-03-2020, 04:15 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Jim&Dianna View Post
It has a 1800 watt inverter but Im not seeing anything about a charger.
My battery disconnect switch in my entry way. When not on shore power I can rurn it on and off but when on shore power it comes on and stays on.
No, it doesn't. When plugged in the converter supplies power to the DC buss which lights the "indicating" light on your USE/STORE (Main Disconnect) switch. It does not change the position of the latching relay. The light is NOT an indication of the position of your USE/STORE (Battery disconnect) relay.
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Old 04-03-2020, 02:31 PM   #18
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This video talks about an "app-enabled multi-plex wiring system" @ 1:28 into the video. Do you have this too? I have read that you may have to control some of the electrical from this. Another style I watched (2016 model?) talked about turning on/off the inverter or charger from the touchscreen panel.
Need some more info on what exactly you are looking at.
Also, would you know what system you have that would tie the two battery systems together? It could be BCC (Battery Control Center) or a BIRD (Bi-directional Isolator Relay Delay), or maybe a BIM (Battery Isolation Manager). Information on these systems are readily available, may be in your pile of manuals they supplied to you upon purchase?

As you mention, the chassis battery should be the last thing to die in the system.
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Old 04-05-2020, 05:54 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Jim&Dianna View Post
We just picked up our new Challenger 35MQ three weeks ago. When we first went to look at it everything was dead and they had to jump start it. When we picked it up they stated they checked everything and everything was good but they said they replaced the chassis battery.
It's been in the driveway and I have it plugged into a 30 amp outlet. Unplugged it today to move it to the side yard and all batteries are dead. Everything thing in the coach has been off but the refrigerator which should be fine since its on shore power. Checked breakers and fuses all good. The fan on the converter is running so I would think the batteries should be charging. Not sure what to check next.
My 2017 Thor was giving me the same problems....I found out the Dixie RV had replaced the house batteries with 2 that were 2014 models, and the engine battery was a 2015....After finally getting them to replace them with new batteries, I had no more battery problems until the alternator on the engine went bad, and the converter charger went bad. Ford replaced the alternator and I had to out of pocket the converter charger.
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Old 04-08-2020, 07:45 PM   #20
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I believe TurnerFam is correct, but if you have solar panels wired directly to the coach batteries, they will charge regardless of the master power switch’s position. Also, I could be wrong and need to check, but I believe when I plug into shore power in my ACE 27.2, the master switch’s light comes on.
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