Lithium Batteries and Factory Charge Controller

[mrgscooter]

I have a different mh, 2019 windsport 27b, my coach batteries are in a outside storage compartment behind the passenger front tire and the bim is mounted in the back wall. For yours, if you have the Thor electrical plan for your mh it probably will give you a clue as to where to start looking.

[The_Breeze]

I downloaded this from the Resource Center but it's not legible. I see no sign of a BIM or BIRD.

[Bill in Redlands]

Originally Posted by The_Breeze

Landed in winter base camp and getting ready to install some lithium batteries and my question is directed at installing the lithium BIM as the first part of the project. If I don't get the BIM right, the lithium batteries sitting in the shed are a waste of money or a train wreck waiting to happen.

Thor Chateau 31L:
1) Do I already have a battery isolation manager for the house batteries in the current setup?
2) If so, can just replace that manager with the lithium one and where would it be located?

The coach has the emergency chassis battery jump switch so it would seem logical there's a isolation manager in the system somewhere. Seems one would be needed so the alternator doesn't overcharge the house batteries and boil them off.

I spotted what looks like one under the hood on the driver's side behind the overflow tank, though that may be the emergency jump switch. What I'm really hoping is I can leverage the existing wires and their runs.

Thanks in advance for any knowledge and/or experience you share. If you need more info, please don't hesitate. I'll find it somehow.

I installed the LBIM in my 2016 Axis and found it to be a pretty easy job. I believe that in your case there must be some sort of isolation switch - if it is a Bird/Trombetta you may find some help in the following thread that I started when I was looking at alternatives. You mention what might be the emergency jump switch - in my experience that is part of the function of the BIRD or the BIM, whichever is present. The switch you press in the cockpit only energizes the connection.

https://www.thorforums.com/forums/f2...ger-22634.html

The key for me was to separate the wires and verify the connections before installing them on the LBIM. There are really only (1) the wire carrying current from the chassis battery, (2) the wire carrying current from the cabin batteries, (3) a ground, (4) a wire that is only hot when the ignition is on and (5) the wire that triggers a connection when the switch that connects the batteries to effect a jump start is energized.

On my rig, there is a heavy gauge wire connected to the positive post of the chassis battery that, when followed, connects to a 50amp breaker/switch then to the vicinity of the engine compartment fuse box where the BIRD/Tombetta was located and now the LBIM is located. Perhaps you can follow wires to locate yours?

[The_Breeze]

Originally Posted by Bill in Redlands

...cut...

The key for me was to separate the wires and verify the connections before installing them on the LBIM. There are really only (1) the wire carrying current from the chassis battery, (2) the wire carrying current from the cabin batteries, (3) a ground, (4) a wire that is only hot when the ignition is on and (5) the wire that triggers a connection when the switch that connects the batteries to effect a jump start is energized.

On my rig, there is a heavy gauge wire connected to the positive post of the chassis battery that, when followed, connects to a 50amp breaker/switch then to the vicinity of the engine compartment fuse box where the BIRD/Tombetta was located and now the LBIM is located. Perhaps you can follow wires to locate yours?

Thanks. It's a Trombetta, so the BIM may be a direct replacement, less the mount points. That would certainly be nice. Sun is setting. I'll pull the overflow tank tomorrow, get some volt readings ad start looking how I might install the BIM.

[The_Breeze]

I have an Ignition Delay Relay mounted to the fender well (down and to the right in the pic). It has a hot wire (red) a ground (blk) and a blue wire. I think the blue wire is connected to the emer jump switch.

The red wire joins another wire on the small front terminal post (in the pic). The small one in the back is the ground (grounded off on the fender well). The large on in front is the house circuit (marked 'H'). The other large one is the chassis (marked 'C').

With this in hand, do I reuse the ignition delay and just wire the LBIM as the trombetta was wired or do I bypass this device altogether?

Thanks for your help.

[Bill Johnson]

Originally Posted by The_Breeze

I have an Ignition Delay Relay mounted to the fender well (down and to the right in the pic). It has a hot wire (red) a ground (blk) and a blue wire. I think the blue wire is connected to the emer jump switch.

The red wire joins another wire on the small front terminal post (in the pic). The small one in the back is the ground (grounded off on the fender well). The large on in front is the house circuit (marked 'H'). The other large one is the chassis (marked 'C').

With this in hand, do I reuse the ignition delay and just wire the LBIM as the trombetta was wired or do I bypass this device altogether?

Thanks for your help.

I don't know if this will helphttps://images.app.goo.gl/2UZUruoJXXjGYQ599

[Bill in Redlands]

Originally Posted by The_Breeze

With this in hand, do I reuse the ignition delay and just wire the LBIM as the trombetta was wired or do I bypass this device altogether?

Looking at the schematic provided by Bill Johnson, it seem to me that you would bypass it. I am basing my response on the schematic which does not seem to me to look much like your photo?

The lead from the ignition would go the LBIM post marked "ign" and the lead from the "emergency" switch would go the post marked "sig". The LBIM would replace the Trombetto.

I am not familiar with your specific arrangement but this would replicate what I and others have done.

You may want confirmation from others.

The following might provide some guidance/understanding.

https://www.explorist.life/how-to-wi...tery-isolator/

[The_Breeze]

Originally Posted by Bill in Redlands

Looking at the schematic provided by Bill Johnson, it seem to me that you would bypass it. I am basing my response on the schematic which does not seem to me to look much like your photo?

The lead from the ignition would go the LBIM post marked "ign" and the lead from the "emergency" switch would go the post marked "sig". The LBIM would replace the Trombetto.

I am not familiar with your specific arrangement but this would replicate what I and others have done.

You may want confirmation from others.

The following might provide some guidance/understanding.

https://www.explorist.life/how-to-wi...tery-isolator/

Thanks much for this. It's more than I had to go on before. I will solicit and hope to receive, additional input.

[Bill in Redlands]

Originally Posted by The_Breeze

Thanks much for this. It's more than I had to go on before. I will solicit and hope to receive, additional input.

Looking back at your picture, it appears that these are large cables, capable of carrying the current to/from batteries. I can't see what they are connected to and wonder if it is simply a junction of some sort.

I would continue to follow wires looking for something that more closely resembles a BIRD or BIM with smaller low amperage wiring coming to it in addition to the battery cables.

Good luck in your search.

[The_Breeze]

Originally Posted by Bill Johnson

I don't know if this will helphttps://images.app.goo.gl/2UZUruoJXXjGYQ599

It sent me in the right direction. Thank you.

[The_Breeze]

Thanks for all your help and feedback. It really helped me get my head wrapped around this part of the setup (he thinks).

I haven't been able to properly test this as I'm hooked to shore power and don’t believe a running alternator will throw juice at the house batteries if it senses a shore power connection.

Here's what I wound up doing. If you see anything glaringly wrong, please advise. I'll be swapping my batteries and an inverter out for lithium soon (inverter/charger/Xfr switch). I don’t have to mention how expensive it can get if I got this wrong. The confusion started when the Trombetta had 2 small posts and the LBIM 3. I'll contact Battle Born to see if they have any knowledge and update this post with their answer.

The heavy cables are as you suggest - house and chassis. The rest had me scratching my head. There were low amperage wires connected to the Trombetta on the small posts and one that joined the house battery cable but there were only 4 light gauge wires with one ganged on that small front post.

The wire on the small back post is ground (ground off on the fender well). I wired that to the LBIM Grnd.

One of the wires joined the house battery cable so I replicated that on the LBIM. You can see it on the large right post and marked with a 'H'. It ran towards the dash. I put that back with the house battery on the LBIM. It seemed to make sense. Why would you ask the chassis battery for juice to operate the switch/relay when it's cripple? Something has to engage the switch to complete the circuit and you pray the house batteries are up to the task because the chassis battery probably isn't.

The larger of the two wires mounted onto the small front post was only hot when the engine was running - the one on the bottom with the blue connector. I put that on the LBIM Ign post.

The red wire coming from the relay (small black box on the right w/red, blue and black wires coming out) onto the small post in the front threw about 2.5A when the dash switch was pressed and zero when it was released. I hooked that to the LBIM Sgnl post.

More useless info:
As far as I understand, you would have nothing, a BIRD, BIM or Trombetta not a combination. I don’t know if I'm right. Only what I understand from reading threads on this forum and elsewhere. I know I don’t have a BIRD or BIM. Your larger class A types have those and again, as I understand it, the class C has a Trombetta. The class A's charge the chassis battery when plugged into shore power. Mine does not.

My wiring looks exactly like this: http://precisioncircuitsinc.com/wp-c...i-BIM-Rev1.pdf


Thanks again.