New Lithium option for Thor B's

[Bob Denman]

We can't wait to hear your "Report From The Saddle!"

[Darrell Root]

Those concerned about window placement in the 20lt should call: Mitchell Johnson, Pd Manager B Van, 574-389-5368, he has the info

[W9TR]

Does anyone know where the second alternator is located for the Mastervolt Lithium option?

We have a friend who has a Promaster based Roadtrek with no genset and the second alternator is located very low at the front of the vehicle, just behind the bumper on the passenger side. Kind of like an Aztec sacrifice strapped to the front of the vehicle. Totally unprotected.

[Chance]

All the ones I’ve seen had second alternator very low on passenger side. I would guess (not sure though) that they use the same kit (haven’t looked that closely). Being a FWD van, the front of the engine limits it to passenger side, and behind the engine down low there is no room. So unless someone comes up with a way to mount it up high, it’s likely the same 280-Amp alternator kit (or its equivalent).

Longer-term it’d be great if RAM offers a second OEM alternator option like Ford started to do for Transit and E-Series. I’d expect a better design and much much lower cost. Or RAM could add the more powerful 48V alternator (motor/generator) as part of mild hybrid option, except with provisions to charge house batteries much faster. I think RAM calls their mild hybrid system eTorque.

[W9TR]

Thanks! I see that Nations Stsrter and Alternator has a retrofit package but it looks to be low and forward as well.

I think I’ll pass on the lithium option for now. I don’t actually have a use case for it here in CO where even in the summer the evenings are cool.

Tom

[bry899]

Originally Posted by Chance

All the ones I’ve seen had second alternator very low on passenger side. I would guess (not sure though) that they use the same kit (haven’t looked that closely). Being a FWD van, the front of the engine limits it to passenger side, and behind the engine down low there is no room. So unless someone comes up with a way to mount it up high, it’s likely the same 280-Amp alternator kit (or its equivalent).

Longer-term it’d be great if RAM offers a second OEM alternator option like Ford started to do for Transit and E-Series. I’d expect a better design and much much lower cost. Or RAM could add the more powerful 48V alternator (motor/generator) as part of mild hybrid option, except with provisions to charge house batteries much faster. I think RAM calls their mild hybrid system eTorque.

Has Ford talked about using an electric driven AC compressor for the transit or E-Series van. Is this something that can be done?
This would allow placement of the second alternator in a different location.

On smaller Class C motorhomes and class b vans the dash air conditioning should be enough to keep them cool.

ex. My coach is 24' (Four Winds 22E), today was 91 degrees inside, and the dash ac lowered the the inside temperature to 85.5 degrees in 20 minutes.

A coach with fully electric dash air conditioning would possibly get better gas mileage by removing the engine driven compressor and eliminating the rooftop ac.
The dash ac is also much quieter then the rooftop ac

[Chance]

Originally Posted by bry899

Has Ford talked about using an electric driven AC compressor for the transit or E-Series van. Is this something that can be done?
This would allow placement of the second alternator in a different location.

On smaller Class C motorhomes and class b vans the dash air conditioning should be enough to keep them cool.

ex. My coach is 24' (Four Winds 22E), today was 91 degrees inside, and the dash ac lowered the the inside temperature to 85.5 degrees in 20 minutes.

A coach with fully electric dash air conditioning would possibly get better gas mileage by removing the engine driven compressor and eliminating the rooftop ac.
The dash ac is also much quieter then the rooftop ac

Yes, electric air conditioning is not only possible, it’s done all the time on electric vehicles and many hybrids. If you look at the upcoming hybrid F-150 specifications, Ford mentions high voltage electric air conditioner compressor so it can cool when engine is not running.

Regarding a second alternator, Ford already started offering dual alternators as an option in E-Series with the new 7.3L V8, and also in Transit vans with optional EcoBoost 3.5L V6. In these two examples they keep the standard belt-driven A/C compressor.

Longer term, I have little doubt that to electrify van and or motorhome chassis to serve for RV applications more effectively, that the electrical system (alternator) must be upgraded to at least 48-Volts in order to better power air conditioners, microwaves, etc. It’s all moving in that direction but not fast enough for my taste. Many companies are holding on to 12-Volt systems because it’s presently more common and cheaper, but 48V is slowly being adopted.

I recently read that the common aftermarket second alternator supplier plans to release a 48V alternator kit. Between that and 48V (nominal) batteries, we should see faster adoption of 48V in lieu of 12V.

.

[JamieGeek]

Originally Posted by Chance

Yes, electric air conditioning is not only possible, it’s done all the time on electric vehicles and many hybrids. If you look at the upcoming hybrid F-150 specifications, Ford mentions high voltage electric air conditioner compressor so it can cool when engine is not running.

Regarding a second alternator, Ford already started offering dual alternators as an option in E-Series with the new 7.3L V8, and also in Transit vans with optional EcoBoost 3.5L V6. In these two examples they keep the standard belt-driven A/C compressor.

Longer term, I have little doubt that to electrify van and or motorhome chassis to serve for RV applications more effectively, that the electrical system (alternator) must be upgraded to at least 48-Volts in order to better power air conditioners, microwaves, etc. It’s all moving in that direction but not fast enough for my taste. Many companies are holding on to 12-Volt systems because it’s presently more common and cheaper, but 48V is slowly being adopted.

I recently read that the common aftermarket second alternator supplier plans to release a 48V alternator kit. Between that and 48V (nominal) batteries, we should see faster adoption of 48V in lieu of 12V.

.

All that really means is a ton more posts on here about "how many 6-V or 12-V and in series or parallel do I need to get my 48V system right??"

[Bob Denman]

More than I can count...

[Chance]

Originally Posted by JamieGeek

All that really means is a ton more posts on here about "how many 6-V or 12-V and in series or parallel do I need to get my 48V system right??"

Yeah, a switch to 48-Volt “house” electrical in itself won’t reduce confusion, but with any luck RV manufacturers will find new ways to build on this upgrade and start cleaning up electrical design and make it simpler, easier to troubleshoot and cheaper to repair.

In my opinion RV manufacturers should strive for an ownership experience similar to electric cars with fewer things to worry about. Far too many owners don’t understand how RVs work, or how to repair them. Like electric cars, anyone should be able to get in and drive away with minimal learning. The old mindset that you needed to know how to change a tire, do a tune-up or a brake job in order to own a car is obsolete. Same applies to RVs. The average person today isn’t very handy with repairs of mechanical and electrical systems.

[Bob Denman]

Owning an RV does require quite a bit of ability to deal with the various onboard systems.
Plumbing and hot water heaters
Freshwater supply
the tanks...
Leveling them
Slide operations
and then there's the power supply...

This is NOT a sport for the weak-willed. It takes involvement: not isolation.

[Chance]

This thread was based on motorhomes without slides, leveling systems, or traditional generators. While they cost more and still require attention and work, it’s a first step towards simplifying RV design so average people can own and enjoy them without so many repair hassles.

They’re not there yet, but moving in right direction. In any case, comparing to conventional campers makes little sense. These motorhomes are designed from the onset to be very different than the ones most forum members own.

[Bob Denman]

Actually: it was about "New Lithium option for Thor B's".
Whatever form they take.
There's no real reason why a "B" couldn't have a slide, and I know of at least on manufacturer that offers leveling systems as an option.
There's room for everyone in this game... they'll eventually build an RV that'll be perfect for you too!

[macdaddy1111]

Going be fun to hear the nightmare stories on being 1st!