Tesla Battery-Powered Semi

[Chance]

Can you imagine an RV with a house battery bank just 5 to 10 percent the size?

How cool what that be? I'd love to see it some day.

[petefoss]

A bit pricy! https://www.amazon.com/LiFePO4-volt-.../dp/B06XX197GJ

[Chance]

Yeah, the price difference between what analyst estimate it costs Tesla and what we would pay retail per kilowatt-hour of capacity still remains a major obstacle for RVers to use much more of this technology.

Some rough estimates I've seen have placed the truck's battery bank at a minimum capacity of 800 kWh, with some estimates much higher. Tesla stated the truck needs less than 2 kWh of energy per mile, so the 500-mile range suggest a HUGE battery. Some speculate 8 X 100 kWh modules from auto model.

For comparison, let's look at a typical flooded golf cart 6-Volt battery rated at 1.5 kWh, giving .75 kWh of useable capacity at 50% depth of discharge. That semi battery is therefore storing at least as much energy as 1,000 Trojan T-105 batteries. Granted weight and costs are off the chart, but if only 5% to 10% was economically viable, we'd have the equivalent of 50 to 100 Trojan T-105s.

[fhenn]

If one gets in a major accident Just think of the many agencies that will be involved to clean up the enviroment

[Bob Denman]

I prefer their Roadster, and it's "Plaid" power setting!

[JamieGeek]

Originally Posted by fhenn

If one gets in a major accident Just think of the many agencies that will be involved to clean up the enviroment

Not many--about the only thing that would leak out is the coolant which is the same as any other car.

Tesla's, Volts, Leaf's, etc. all have been involved in many accidents and none have involved people in hazmat outfits cleaning up after them. (In fact my coworker got rear-ended in his Focus EV which had no more drama than if he was rear ended in a normal ICE powered Focus.)

Fire is a greater danger if some of the wiring or cell packs short out. All EV manufacturers have special first responder instructions for their vehicles (mostly involving where the high-voltage battery disconnects are).

[Bob Denman]

Until the battery technology and re-charging infrastructure catches up: I have no interests in these cars, trucks, or motorcycles...
With my Can Am Spyder: I can be halfway across the Country in two days...
I have yet to see an electric vehicle (particularly a motorcycle), that can manage the same stunt...

[JamieGeek]

Originally Posted by Bob Denman

Until the battery technology and re-charging infrastructure catches up: I have no interests in these cars, trucks, or motorcycles...
With my Can Am Spyder: I can be halfway across the Country in two days...
I have yet to see an electric vehicle (particularly a motorcycle), that can manage the same stunt...

51 hours is only a smidge over two days:
https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15...all-run-record

That's fine--more EV's for me and the rest of us LOL. Having driven an EV for 3 years I know they are where everything will be going and I can't wait to get my next one.

[Bob Denman]

Where do you live in Michigan?
(It's got to be in the midst of a big population center...)
I'm out here in the "Boonies". The combination of mountainous terrain and nothing that remotely resembles a charging station, is what keeps me happy with my dinosaur-powered vehicles.

[JamieGeek]

Originally Posted by Bob Denman

Where do you live in Michigan?
(It's got to be in the midst of a big population center...)
I'm out here in the "Boonies". The combination of mountainous terrain and nothing that remotely resembles a charging station, is what keeps me happy with my dinosaur-powered vehicles.

Well I'm in between Detroit and Ann Arbor. Sure there is a AAA about 3 miles from my house with a charger (not that that matters because I have a charger at the house). That was the thing with the EV though: It was for commuting: Its range was longer than my daily commute. I'd leave in the morning with a full charge and plug it in when I got home; the next morning it'd be full again..For 3 years I only went to a gas station to fill up the RV (or to fill up the wife's car)

Sure I'm aware that there is a big country out there with no chargers. Heck just "up north" here in MI and you're in plugless land I always wanted to take the EV up there behind the motorhome as I do have an charger I can plug into the 50A plugs at campgrounds to charge up the EV, or PHEV. (Never got to with the EV, but have taken the C-Max all over the place and charged it up in campgrounds).

C-Max charging:

The EV camping (and charging)--yeah a Focus Electric:

This was before I had the 50A charger so it was using just 120V. The C-Max is using the 50A charger in the other pic, however. In this pic the charger is sitting on the picnic table.

[Bob Denman]

I figured that your location had to be affecting your opinion, as much as mine does!
Since my commute to work is only thirty feet: that's not the issue.
But any place else that I want to get to; seems to end up being more than a 100 mile trip, before we get back home...
(We have 15 miles or more between communities around here...)
With little to no cell-service: we're left sticking with what works best! (for us)

[petefoss]

The UP of MI was why my wife loved her Volt. 30 to 40 miles on electric around town for weeks and then 2 tanks of gas to drive to Marquette.

[petefoss]

Flip side for a toad is the Volt weighs 3543 while the Cruze Hatchback only weighs 2917. Quite a difference. I'm a fan of EVs and plug in hybrids like the Bolt and Volt but for a toad other factors may dominate.

[JamieGeek]

Originally Posted by petefoss

Flip side for a toad is the Volt weighs 3543 while the Cruze Hatchback only weighs 2917. Quite a difference. I'm a fan of EVs and plug in hybrids like the Bolt and Volt but for a toad other factors may dominate.

Oh yeah our C-Max weighs in at a portly 3900lbs! (CAT scaled) with it and the dolly we're pushing our 5000lb limit on the hitch (in our case the Axis weighs in around 11,500lbs so we're ok there: GCWR 18,500).

The Focus Electric was no lightweight either at 3650 lbs.

[Bob Denman]

It turns out that a tank of gasoline doesn't weigh nearly as much, as a bank of btteries...

But here's a really cool one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PS-DHqGaLYM

[Chance]

Not that I was referring to the Tesla semi's powertrain as a possible motorhome propulsión system, or about drag racing at all, but the Tesla semi has incredible (projected) specs that may attract the interest of a billionaire or two.


0-60 MPH of tractor in 5 seconds

0-60 MPH loaded in 20 seconds

Climb 5% grade at 65 versus typical 45 MPH for diesel


With an estimate of 500-mile range, they claim an 80% charge good for 400 more miles in 30 minutes. You could drive all morning, stop for a lunch break while recharging, and then drive all afternoon before arriving at next campground.

I wasn't thinking of an electric motorhome, but for those $500,000 to $1,000,000 rigs, how far off can it be? Additional cost for an electric semi with 80,000-pound GCWR is less than $100,000. A rig in the 40,000-pound GCWR would need much less battery capacity, and may also need less than 500-mile maximum range. With 80% recharge in 30 minutes, I'd bet most of us could live with 300 to 400 mile range as long as charging stations are available.


In any case I digress, because I see this lithium battery technology first replacing (or augmenting) generators with quiet and clean power for "house" electricity. An electric motorhome may happen someday, but it's too expensive to justify in mass because motorhomes don't get driven 100,000 miles per year as diesel semis do.

[wingnut60]

Musk is just needing some more investors...

[Chance]

Regarding battery data, particularly where we stand on cost and weight that could affect the future of motorhome house electrical systems, this article has some interesting facts.


https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/...l-quick-charge


The estimate that automotive lithium batteries only weigh around 15 pounds per kilowatt-hour (kWh), in sizes of 50 kWh or larger, is interesting and very important for comparison. Basically a 50 kWh pack should weigh around 750 pounds. "If" it could replace 4 lead batteries and a generator (particularly a diesel generator) the weight penalty wouldn't be that much compared to motorhomes in the 20,000-pound or higher range.

Regarding cost, one analyst had the cost as low as $100/kWh, but even at $200/kWh, that's only $10,000, not that different from the cost of some diesel generators, and only a little higher than cost of gas generator plus standard batteries.

The major bottleneck seems to be difference between wholesale and retail battery cost. Tesla's cost is already lower per kilowatt-hour than we'd pay for AGM batteries at retail. And when much greater cycle life is considered, lithium is a lot lower in cost.

[JamieGeek]

LOL sorry Chance got a little off track there.

We are already seeing "electric coaches" (RV's that don't use propane) its only a matter of time before those coaches go the Li-ion route and drop the genny too.

Even a smaller pack (something like the 7.7kWh pack in my C-Max, or the 23kWh--now 30kWh--pack in my old Focus Electric) would be able to power a coach for some time.

Those 200 Ah 12V batteries are only, what 2.4kWh so even 10kWh or so is 4x the charge--most likely good for a long weekend of dry camping (without A/C, probably good for a couple of days using A/C).

[Bob Denman]

Originally Posted by JamieGeek

LOL sorry Chance got a little off track there.

We are already seeing "electric coaches" (RV's that don't use propane) its only a matter of time before those coaches go the Li-ion route and drop the genny too.

Even a smaller pack (something like the 7.7kWh pack in my C-Max, or the 23kWh--now 30kWh--pack in my old Focus Electric) would be able to power a coach for some time.

Those 200 Ah 12V batteries are only, what 2.4kWh so even 10kWh or so is 4x the charge--most likely good for a long weekend of dry camping (without A/C, probably good for a couple of days using A/C).

Question: How long would it take a generator to charge back up an all-electric coach?
It's gonna take some power to be able to get back home too!