Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 

Go Back   Thor Forums > Thor Community Forums > Thor Owners Community Discussions
Click Here to Login
Register FAQ Community Calendar Today's Posts Search Log in
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 09-12-2021, 10:09 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: '17-Vegas 24.1
State: California
Posts: 2,227
THOR #13362
“Pathetic quality”: RV dealers are fed up with what manufacturers are producing

Article in yesterday’s RV Travel…

https://www.rvtravel.com/pathetic-qu...oducing-1017b/

“Pathetic quality”: RV dealers are fed up with what manufacturers are producing

September 11, 2021


EDITOR’S NOTE: RVtravel.com is regularly invited to participate in nationwide conference calls with large RV dealers and others involved in the sales and servicing of RVs. A condition of our involvement in these conference calls is that no individual is specifically named in follow-up reports. While the situation is unusual, we feel the value of the candid comments and information that we can share with you outweighs the lack of the usual attribution. This time, you’ll just have to trust us that the quotes come from trusted, vetted sources.

If you’re in the market to buy a new RV, you might want to wait a bit. RV dealers on a recent nationwide conference call said the quality of most recreational vehicles now being produced is “pathetic.”

“It’s some of the worst stuff I’ve seen in 30 years,” said one longtime RV dealer. “It’s horrendous inside and out. But we have no recourse but to put it on the lot and try to sell it. You take what you can get, and you move on.”

The dealer said he suspects many longtime RVers are delaying purchasing a new rig, since it’s no secret – at least on social media and many blogs – that new RV owners aren’t happy with their purchases. “The lack of quality and all of the negative comments in the chat rooms have to be holding people back from moving forward with a purchase.”

The East Coast dealer said RV manufacturers are “building them as fast as they can, and there just isn’t any quality control. Manufacturers are not doing a good job of taking care of their customers. It’s gone from bad to worse.”

Will the industry topple?

One West Coast dealer echoed those thoughts. “My greatest fear now is watching the motorized RV industry get toppled,” he said. “They just don’t have the expertise to complete a motorhome in Northern Indiana anymore. Their labor force has no eye for quality and they have no way of teaching it. The industry is ripe for someone else to step in and start producing quality products, but it will likely have to be someplace other than Indiana. Right now, if the workers there get upset by something, they just walk off because it’s easy to get a job in Elkhart right now.”

He cited one manufacturer who admitted that he usually has no idea what his workforce will look like from week to week. “He said on Mondays, he never knows who is going to show up.”

A New England dealer said some manufacturers are only running their plants three to four days a week due to shortages in both parts and labor. “The quality that is coming out is just terrible,” he said. “Their ability to retain employees is bad. You can just tell that the guys on the manufacturing lines have been on the job for just a week. Plants don’t have the proper staffing, and they can’t do the service after the sale.”

Even newbies notice the poor quality

It isn’t just dealers who have noticed the drop in quality. “I had one newbie who purchased what they thought was the Taj Mahal of RVs,” said one dealer. “They take their first trip with it, and they come back in with 40 different problems with it. Then, I get to tell them they have to wait weeks or even months to get it fixed because nobody can get the parts.”

All of this angst on the part of dealers comes at a time when manufacturers are celebrating their success in producing record numbers of units.

The industry is projecting it will produce nearly 580,000 rigs by the end of 2021, and set a new record in 2022 with more than 600,000 new factory shipments.

“Continued robust demand for RVs, the need for RV dealers to restock historically low inventories, the strong financial standing of consumers, and sustained interest in the outdoors will work to keep RV shipments elevated,” said the RV Industry Association in a recent press release.

“Faced with many of the same kinds of supply chain and labor issues plaguing most industries over the past year, the RV industry has overcome these challenges and produced a record number of RVs month after month,” said Jeff Rutherford, President & CEO of Airxcel and RV Industry Association Chairman.

Read also: RV dealers say steady price increases from manufacturers make it difficult to lock in final costs for buyers

COMING NEXT SUNDAY: Roadside assistance companies stretched thin by huge growth in RVers and lack of available service centers

__________________
'17 Vegas 24.1
Fallbrook, CA
taylorbob1 is offline  
Old 09-12-2021, 10:18 PM   #2
Site Team
 
EA37TS's Avatar
 
Brand: Entegra
Model: Accolade 37TS
State: South Dakota
Posts: 8,774
THOR #1469
Interesting but without names there is no credibility or proof. What east cost dealer, what RV manufacturers what was supposed to be the Tak Mahal of RVs that turned out to be crap.

Subjective reporting at best loaded with personal opinions.

Get some guts and get objective with the reporting.
__________________
EA37TS is offline  
Old 09-12-2021, 10:31 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
PictureTheSouth's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Windsport 27K
State: North Carolina
Posts: 343
THOR #11007
The "Taj Mahal" might be the Magnitude/Omni stories we've seen on this forum - over and over and over again for the past year. I'll admit that I drooled over a Magnitude about 18 months ago - and seriously considered selling my current rig for a small loss; selling the house, getting an SV34 and retiring early on the road.

But after seeing all the reported structural issues in addition to the expected "per unit" problems - combined with reports here of the inability of dealers and Thor to fix those "first trip" problems".....

I'm now feeling like I made a narrow escape.

This pandemic has affected us all - and perhaps the RV community even more. Everyone want's a "safer way to travel" which increases demand (and price) for RV's. The inability to keep competent staff on board for manufacture and repair compounds the issue. Hell, I can't even find a repair shop in my general area (50 mile radius) who can replace a brake line for me before spring - because everyone is either sick, dead, over-worked and underpaid -or looking for work that doesn't require public interaction.

Get vaxxed, y'all. The RV life let's us easily "social distance" - take advantage of that. Mask up when you can't. And encourage your friends and family to do all the above. That's the only way we get past this, and back to something resembling what we once considered "normal".
__________________
PictureTheSouth is offline  
Old 09-12-2021, 11:09 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Hurricane 31S
State: Texas
Posts: 4,180
THOR #6411
Quote:
Originally Posted by EA37TS View Post
Interesting but without names there is no credibility or proof. What east cost dealer, what RV manufacturers what was supposed to be the Tak Mahal of RVs that turned out to be crap.
Subjective reporting at best loaded with personal opinions.
Get some guts and get objective with the reporting.
Based on what goes on here at the Toyota Truck plant, I would say the problems in Elkhart are the same. Cruising Kitchens has always poached Toyota's best workers, not because they pay more, but because the working conditions are much better. In MCs, if you order or want a seldom built floor plan. you must expect more errors, as the factory floor workers are not familiar with how it goes together. Floor workers are paid by the day and have have a number of task to preform per day. When they completer their assigned tasks they can go home. That means that the seldom made, more complicated floor plans will have more errors than the best selling floor plans. My Dad counseled me to never buy a new car built in the first year of a new model. I think that works for RVs as well, especially when comes to new floor plans. Just my observation with no actual statistics.

My floor plan was first produced in 2014 and last appeared in 2018 model years and the chassis from February 2015 until January 2020. My coach was produced in November 2015 on a September 2015 chassis.
__________________
Jim & Roy Davis
2016 Hurricane 31S
1961 Rampside in tow
Beau388 is offline  
Old 09-12-2021, 11:36 PM   #5
Site Team
 
EA37TS's Avatar
 
Brand: Entegra
Model: Accolade 37TS
State: South Dakota
Posts: 8,774
THOR #1469
Quote:
Originally Posted by PictureTheSouth View Post
The "Taj Mahal" might be the Magnitude/Omni stories we've seen on this forum - over and over and over again for the past year. I'll admit that I drooled over a Magnitude about 18 months ago - and seriously considered selling my current rig for a small loss; selling the house, getting an SV34 and retiring early on the road.

But after seeing all the reported structural issues in addition to the expected "per unit" problems - combined with reports here of the inability of dealers and Thor to fix those "first trip" problems".....

I'm now feeling like I made a narrow escape.

This pandemic has affected us all - and perhaps the RV community even more. Everyone want's a "safer way to travel" which increases demand (and price) for RV's. The inability to keep competent staff on board for manufacture and repair compounds the issue. Hell, I can't even find a repair shop in my general area (50 mile radius) who can replace a brake line for me before spring - because everyone is either sick, dead, over-worked and underpaid -or looking for work that doesn't require public interaction.

Get vaxxed, y'all. The RV life let's us easily "social distance" - take advantage of that. Mask up when you can't. And encourage your friends and family to do all the above. That's the only way we get past this, and back to something resembling what we once considered "normal".
Could be a Newmar Mountain Aire or a million dollar Prevost based unit.

Absolutely nothing in the article leads one to believe they are talking about Thor so please stop speculating and leading others to unfounded conclusions.
__________________
EA37TS is offline  
Old 09-12-2021, 11:36 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: North Carolina
Posts: 499
THOR #19102
Well I for one would stear clear of late model 2021 and all 2022 models at this point. Perhaps the 2023 model year will be better.
__________________
Campnjoe is offline  
Old 09-12-2021, 11:43 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Chateau 24F
State: Ohio
Posts: 4,175
THOR #16721
IF this is "true" journalism (sketchy with no sources - no guts), it's typical. Blaming workers . Your workforce, their skillet AND attitude/morale is DIRECTLY reflective of upper management and organization. TRAIN your workers... PAY them well for a job well done. This is proven to breed a positive attitude where workers take pride in their work.

This "report" makes it sound like the ENTIRE Elkhart workforce is a bunch of slackers drifting from job to job looking for an "easy paycheck".

Maybe it's an industry chasing a quickly failing "race to the bottom"... and we're seeing the results. This is an exact analogy to the parents who blame their own kids when maybe poor parenting skills are to blame? Look in the mirror!

BUT... This "report" is questionable at best. Maybe someone with an axe to grind...
__________________
Chateau_Nomad is offline  
Old 09-12-2021, 11:52 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
PictureTheSouth's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Windsport 27K
State: North Carolina
Posts: 343
THOR #11007
Quote:
Originally Posted by EA37TS View Post
Could be a Newmar Mountain Aire or a million dollar Prevost based unit.

Absolutely nothing in the article leads one to believe they are talking about Thor so please stop speculating and leading others to unfounded conclusions.

You're absolutely right. "Could be" Newmar, Coachmen, Forest River or Prevost units. But I don't follow those forums - only this one. The Omni/Magnitude example is mine and mine alone; as that is what I was looking at. But in the past couple of years; I've seen far more posts here than usual from new owners with issues that are far above what a customer should expect after a shakedown cruise.

Yeah, some of that is from first-time owners not realizing that a motor-home comes with all the problems of both a car and a house.... but a lot of it seems to be problems with QA on assembly and lack of after-sales support, regardless of manufacturer.

Which again leads me back to at least one of the underlying problems - keeping trained manufacturing, support and maintenance staff on the job; both at the factory and at point of sale. Which is where beating this virus comes into play.



We can all do our part - and part of our part is encouraging others to do the same. If Thor/Newmar/Prevost can't keep healthy people on the line - none of us will be able to keep our rigs on the road.
__________________
PictureTheSouth is offline  
Old 09-13-2021, 01:16 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: North Carolina
Posts: 499
THOR #19102
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chateau_Nomad View Post
IF this is "true" journalism (sketchy with no sources - no guts), it's typical. Blaming workers . Your workforce, their skillet AND attitude/morale is DIRECTLY reflective of upper management and organization. TRAIN your workers... PAY them well for a job well done. This is proven to breed a positive attitude where workers take pride in their work
I agree with what you are saying here and as always the buck stops at the highest exec, but I think the severe expansion in demand blinded some people to just push units out the door. I mean we all know that coaches have issues that normally get worked out, but some of the stuff lately is just crazy. I mean one guy was talking about a gap a cat could jump through in his brand new coach. Now QA obviously didn't catch the flaw on the line and it was moved to the next phase where it was buried by a trim guy. Probably only surfaced once vibration was added to the mix. Saddly though this is just one example. I don't think you can blame the management wholly as there are team leaders and supervisors that are clearly not doing their job.
__________________
Campnjoe is offline  
Old 09-13-2021, 01:18 AM   #10
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Hurricane 29M
State: Texas
Posts: 2,718
THOR #11781
Talk about Captain Obvious. TMC has been producing crap coaches for a lot longer than the pandemic has affected employment and supply chains. Based on the complaints on this forum and TMCs long history of poor quality, the crap coming out of TMC factories is probably worse than it has ever been. But back to the OP, no dealer in his right mind would allow his name to be put on an article condemning the industry. Nor would a person in charge of manufacture. If this was an article about the blowhards in DC, unnamed sources would be fine but I guess the RV industry is held to a different journalistic standard.
__________________
Lt Keefer
2018 Hurricane 29M
CHF, Saf-T-Plus, SumoSprings
Lt Keefer is offline  
Old 09-13-2021, 01:56 AM   #11
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Chateau 24F
State: Ohio
Posts: 4,175
THOR #16721
I once worked for a company who had a quote posted on their sign out front: "Quality, Price, Service... pick TWO"

It's an old saying, but still holds to this day. There are countless examples. Big box stores... Walmart. And maybe a few motorhome manufacturers.

There's a fine balance between efficiency of manufacturing for cost savings and just taking shortcuts. Shortcuts get you in deep trouble EVERY TIME!

Streamlined manufacturing requires a well trained staff of workers who are "on board" with your mission. Japanese car manufacturers figured this out. It's hard to fault their quality... and they forced American cars to up their game.

Covid does factor in to the delays... but it is NO EXCUSE for shoddy manufacturing. And the ridiculous price increases are blamed on what? Shortages?

The savvy consumer will sit patiently and wait. Those "shortages" have a way of disappearing when the public stops buying.
__________________
Chateau_Nomad is offline  
Old 09-13-2021, 04:11 AM   #12
Senior Member
 
The_Breeze's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Chateau 31L
State: Florida
Posts: 2,063
THOR #12189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chateau_Nomad View Post
I once worked for a company who had a quote posted on their sign out front: "Quality, Price, Service... pick TWO"
It's an old Project Management Triangle adage:
Time, Cost, Qaulity - pick two. Sit with it a while.
__________________
The_Breeze is offline  
Old 09-13-2021, 11:13 AM   #13
Site Team
 
EA37TS's Avatar
 
Brand: Entegra
Model: Accolade 37TS
State: South Dakota
Posts: 8,774
THOR #1469
Thread going nowhere and turning into another activist discussion on vaccine or no vaccine. Closing it down.
__________________
EA37TS is offline  
Old 09-14-2021, 03:05 PM   #14
Site Team
 
16ACE27's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 27.1
State: Florida
Posts: 14,347
THOR #7035
OFF TOPIC posts removed.
__________________
Ted & Melinda
2016 ACE 27.1
2016 Chevy Sonic Toad - Selling
2020 Chevy Colorado Z71 Trail Runner Toad
2024 Chevrolet Trax 2RS - Soon 2B TOAD
16ACE27 is offline  
Closed Thread


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Thor Industries or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


Thor Motor Coach Forum - Crossroads RV Forum - Redwood RV Forum - Dutchmen Forum - Heartland RV Forum - Keystone RV Forum - Airstream Trailer Forum


All times are GMT. The time now is 05:09 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2