Upgrading refrigerator

[richardehrhart]

I am ready to yank out the small 6 cu ft absorption fridge and replace it with a 10.1 magic chef residential fridge. I've watched multiple you tube videos on how to replace the unit but most were in a permanent location where they will be on 120v ac 100% of the time. We are planning to do a bunch of travel in the next year in our 2016 ACE 30.1. Does anyone have suggestions as to wiring the unit for both shore power and using house batteries while traveling? Do I modify the existing electrical system or put in a separate invertor, charging system, a set of batteries, and a transfer switch?

[DavidEM]

You will need a moderate size inverter, about 1000 watts to power your fridge. The real problem is residential fridges are comparatively inefficient. You will use 100-150 amp hours daily from your batteries to power the inverter.

That means you can only live for a day without hookups. You can increase battery size and go to lithiums, but that will cost thousands.

It all depends on how much dry camping you do. If you do very little then ok. Otherwise I would look for a bigger absorption fridge if 6 cu ft is too small.

David

[ducksface]

I would pass on that idea.
No one has really found a very swaying reason to do this.

If it's room you need consider one of the big12v/120v box cooler/freezers.
Convert from freeze to cool at the switch of a switch.

To do your change right you'll need about $1,800 in batteries AND an inverter and $1,200 or so in labor and the fridge and solar panels or run your generator almost daily.

What did the youtube videos say about it all?
You typed
Most
Not
All.

[Pete'sMH]

I wouldn’t have a residential fridge in an RV if it was free. They simply use too much energy to be practical. But maybe it’s just us.

[richardehrhart]

All good advice. In changing my method, I would like to put in a 12vdc rv fridge. They sell a 110 vac to 12vdc converter. Recpro recommends adding a solar panel with 30% to recharge deep cycle batteries when no shore power. This would help with safety as the propane is not used while traveling. I guess I'll need to start researching solar panel installation.

[OldWEB]

You said "...and using house batteries while traveling?" Are you saying you would not boondock, that you want to just power the reefer while moving from point 'a' to point 'b' and then connect to shore power. Or are you wanting to boondock for extended times?


Some are frightened to use propane while moving, some are not.

[ducksface]

If only 10 percent of rv users used the propane fridge while travelling.
(5,000 miles average yearly use, 500,000 motorhomes built last year alone)
That's 50,000 2020 rv's multiplied by 5,000 miles. Now multiply it back to say 2010...now back to 1960....

Honest, no bull, statistically there is almost a better chance of an rv being hit by lightning than having a fridge propane fire while driving.
And
The number of people using propane while driving is likely 90+%.

But
This conversation is as violating/volatile as any 3,000 mile oil change debate you'll ever have.
(My 1963, three 2 barrel carbs, 8mpg, old style v8 has a sticker saying 6,000mile oil changes and 100,000 mile chassis lube, but hey, someones coal-miner dad said differently.)

You are about to spend some money for no real reason.
I don't know the numbers but I'll all but guarantee aftermarket retrofit wiring of inverters/converters cause, I'll take a guess, 10,000 times the risk of fire than running a propane fridge.

If any of us have 'Fear money' to spend, it is(percentage of reality vs fable wise) far better spent on an engine fire suppression system.
THAT'S where rv fires come from.
You haven't said you're fearful but you haven't said why the change. (Or I missed it)

[OldWEB]

I was looking up some specs and found a Magic Chef 10.1 residential fridge and it is rated for 297kWh a year. It weighs 117lbs.

I found a Furrion 10cu. ft. 12V reefer rated for 1.08kWh/day = 394kWh/yr and weighs 134lbs.; so clearly the residential reefer is more efficient by 25% and weighs less.
But.... there are losses converting the 12v to 120v and I just do not know how well a residential fridge would stand up to travelling... their life is normally spent in one spot.


Oh, the residential fridge is almost $1200 cheaper too.

[OldWEB]

Originally Posted by ducksface

But
This conversation is as violating/volatile as any 3,000 mile oil change debate you'll ever have.

VERY good choice of word... for this forum!

[DavidEM]

Originally Posted by OldWEB

I was looking up some specs and found a Magic Chef 10.1 residential fridge and it is rated for 297kWh a year. It weighs 117lbs.

I found a Furrion 10cu. ft. 12V reefer rated for 1.08kWh/day = 394kWh/yr and weighs 134lbs.; so clearly the residential reefer is more efficient by 25% and weighs less.
But.... there are losses converting the 12v to 120v and I just do not know how well a residential fridge would stand up to travelling... their life is normally spent in one spot.

I must admit that the Magic Chef residential fridge is efficient as it is Energy Star rated, which gives you some confidence that the KWh per year is reasonably accurate.

The Furrion's rating method is unknown, but admittedly they try to make the kWh value as low as possible, but who knows.

Even with 10% inverter losses, the Magic Chef should use less DC power than the Furrion, again assuming the rating methods are the same. FWIW 297 kWh per year is 75 Ah per day at 12V with 10% inverter efficiency loss. That will still require a significant battery/solar/charger/BIM upgrade to go more than one night without hookups.

I wouldn't worry too much about bouncing around in a MH assuming the compressor is on a spring base, although I suppose it is possible that the bouncing could ultimately crack a refrigeration fitting.

David

[kwplot34]

We have had several motor homes with the absorption refrigerators, and now we have one with a residential fridge, neither one has caused us any issues and we don't have any negatives about either. The residential is bigger and will cool down faster. We boondock mostly and don't have any issues with the residential fridge.

[OldWEB]

I know from helping move fridges that the compressor on some really do 'clank' (for a technical term) a lot while shuffling it around, can only imagine what some roads would do after a long drive. Need a refrigeration expert to chime in with their thought?
Also, I was not trying to deride anyone's post, I just wanted to see the numbers for myself and shared them.

If the OP only needs the inverter while travelling, that is they will have shore power, then a residential would work as while driving the chassis alternator can keep the batteries topped up. For the savings on the price, a few replacements could be bought!

[taylorbob1]

I’m not looking to change out my absorption fridge on our current rig.
My one complaint is the huge frost/ice build up over a short period of time in the freezer compartment as we leave our rig plugged in at home 24/7 with fridge running.

That said, I suspect that future RVs will have residential or 12v only. And those don’t have the ice build up.

I do like our absorption fridge because we mostly boon-dock or stay at campgrounds with minimal conveniences. It works great on propane.

[ducksface]

Mine has been plugged in, constantly running, not off for 3 hours in three years.
It has never even thought of icing up. Not even a glimmer.
Humidity is certainly lower here. But we didnt ice up on our midwest trip last month during torrential rains and 90% humidity.

[OldWEB]

Frost forms if the door is constantly opened or it has a leak, allowing moist air to continually get in. Check the door seal for 'tightness' (usually a dollar bill test) and check the plastic interior (and the door) for any cracks.

[taylorbob1]

Originally Posted by OldWEB

Frost forms if the door is constantly opened or it has a leak, allowing moist air to continually get in. Check the door seal for 'tightness' (usually a dollar bill test) and check the plastic interior (and the door) for any cracks.

Ok, thanks for the hint
I’ll check that
Very strange, the Frost/ice build-up

[Chance]

Originally Posted by richardehrhart

All good advice. In changing my method, I would like to put in a 12vdc rv fridge. They sell a 110 vac to 12vdc converter. Recpro recommends adding a solar panel with 30% to recharge deep cycle batteries when no shore power. This would help with safety as the propane is not used while traveling. I guess I'll need to start researching solar panel installation.

If your main concern is keeping fridge cold without having to use propane and only while driving, you can also consider operating your absorption fridge from electricity rather than propane. This is inefficient because it requires about 25 Amps from engine alternator (+/- 300 Watts) depending on model, but can save you a lot of up-front money if your fridge is set up to operate from electricity (most are).

You may still need an inverter and wiring, but would not need a new fridge. Plus you can still use propane when not driving to avoid needing a lot of battery capacity. That solves boondocking issues.

Personally, I have used propane for fridge while driving over many years and it doesn’t concern me. Having said that, I would prefer my next camper have a compressor fridge instead of absorption heated by propane. But not because of concerns of propane fires.

[txc2936@yahoo.com]

View a few conversations on refrig pwr.

I have installed a 1000W inverter for just powering the refrig. when driving. I can select either shore pwr or inverter pwr. This gives me a cold refrig. after 3 -4 hrs driving. I didn;t want to run propane while driving and didn't want to fuel with the propane running or have to turn propane off prior to entering tunnels.

So when i am ready to leave my RV park for the next destination. I switch over the Refrig. to inverter, and shut down the generator.

So far so good. It works well, and i have also installed another outlet in the main area to just pwr the TV. This way i dont need to run the generator or shore pwr to watch TV as i take a rest stop.

[kwplot34]

Originally Posted by OldWEB

Frost forms if the door is constantly opened or it has a leak, allowing moist air to continually get in. Check the door seal for 'tightness' (usually a dollar bill test) and check the plastic interior (and the door) for any cracks.

Aren't the absorption fridges supposed to go through a defrost mode on there own? to keep from having the blocks of ice on the fins.

[txc2936@yahoo.com]

After reading this subject on the NORCOLD manual. They say there is no concern over frost build up.

"it is normal for frost to collect inside the freezer. Excess frost decreases the cooling performance of the refrigerator. Defrost the refrigerator and freezer as necessary."