Generator issues

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by Martinez

Great post as I've had the same issues. Why do you have to have something running when you are exercising the genny though?

To heat up and drive moisture from the generator windings.

[Rxster08]

Originally Posted by gmc

While you may have the voltage, the house batteries may be failing under load.

With engine running, the chassis and house batteries are joined, and alternator supplying power.

Hold down the emergency start switch and try starting the genny... if that works, I would suspect house batteries unable to handle load.

GMC,
Good suggestion, but again no joy on my part.
When holding the emergency start and trying to start the genny, I get nothing. I have tried to start the genny from the monitor panel and from the cab dashboard, but get only crickets.


Is there a switch or "mode" I should place the generator in when I want to operate off-the-grid?


Thanks again for your input.


Rxster08

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by Rxster08

GMC,
Good suggestion, but again no joy on my part.
When holding the emergency start and trying to start the genny, I get nothing. I have tried to start the genny from the monitor panel and from the cab dashboard, but get only crickets.


Is there a switch or "mode" I should place the generator in when I want to operate off-the-grid?


Thanks again for your input.


Rxster08

OK, time to do some wire tracing. I suspect you have a tripped 100 amp DC breaker that should be wired directly to the positive side of your house batteries. On the load side of that breaker will be the starting circuit for the generator and the cross-connect device to tie the house and chassis batteries together.

The breaker, when tripped, has a red or yellow flag popped out sideways. Push it back in to reset it.

The reason it works when the engine is running is because the alternator output has triggered the cross-connect relay and is supplying 12+ VDC to the generator's starting circuit.

The reason it doesn't work when using the emergency start switch is because the switch gets its activating voltage from the house side of the cross-connect relay, which, of course, is dead with the breaker tripped.

This is assuming everything is wired normally - it may not be with a used coach. Find and check that DC breaker!

[Rxster08]

Originally Posted by 16ACE27

OK, time to do some wire tracing. I suspect you have a tripped 100 amp DC breaker that should be wired directly to the positive side of your house batteries. On the load side of that breaker will be the starting circuit for the generator and the cross-connect device to tie the house and chassis batteries together.

The breaker, when tripped, has a red or yellow flag popped out sideways. Push it back in to reset it.

The reason it works when the engine is running is because the alternator output has triggered the cross-connect relay and is supplying 12+ VDC to the generator's starting circuit.

The reason it doesn't work when using the emergency start switch is because the switch gets its activating voltage from the house side of the cross-connect relay, which, of course, is dead with the breaker tripped.

This is assuming everything is wired normally - it may not be with a used coach. Find and check that DC breaker!

Ted,
I tip my hat in your general direction and I owe you a beverage or two.

Thank you for your efficient diagnosis, I found the breaker with the yellow flag out. Reset the breaker, hit the start button and genny started right up.


Thanks again,


Rick

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by Rxster08

Ted,
I tip my hat in your general direction and I owe you a beverage or two.

Thank you for your efficient diagnosis, I found the breaker with the yellow flag out. Reset the breaker, hit the start button and genny started right up.


Thanks again,


Rick

Glad to help!

[jgvegas]

Hello;

I have a 2014 Thor Vegas.
Generator runs fine, but it is not transferring to inverter. I have full DC voltage coming out of generator, but nothing to inverter to take over the 100 power.

Is there a fuse or reset.

I tried the generator reset fuse and checked all the fuses where the inverter is?

I am at a loss. it worked fine until I pressed the batter disconnect too soon before it transferred over to 110 power and now I have no power when generator is running?

Jim Gallagher
email: jg@atifbo.com

Thanks

[Beau388]

Originally Posted by jgvegas

Hello;

I have a 2014 Thor Vegas.
Generator runs fine, but it is not transferring to inverter. I have full DC voltage coming out of generator, but nothing to inverter to take over the 100 power.

Is there a fuse or reset.

I tried the generator reset fuse and checked all the fuses where the inverter is?

I am at a loss. it worked fine until I pressed the batter disconnect too soon before it transferred over to 110 power and now I have no power when generator is running?

Jim Gallagher
email: jg@atifbo.com

Thanks

First of all the Onan output is 120 Volts, 60 hz AC. Generally, there are no fuses in a motor-home's A/C circuitry, as they use circuit breakers.


The test to see if the generator is powering the coach's power center is to start an A/C or use the microwave. If there is no A/C power to the power center, check the circuit breaker found on the right side of the generator's frame. If the power center has A/C power, then trip and reset the A/C circuit breaker for the charger in the power center. Finally, check the 50 amp circuit breaker in the battery house compartment. It cannot be tested but if tripped there will be a yellow or red flag showing. Lastly the use/store latching relay must be in the use position (if you have a master power switch it must be in the on position). If all is working your house battery voltage will be above 13.0 volts DC

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by jgvegas

Hello;

I have a 2014 Thor Vegas.
Generator runs fine, but it is not transferring to inverter. I have full DC voltage coming out of generator, but nothing to inverter to take over the 100 power.

Is there a fuse or reset.

I tried the generator reset fuse and checked all the fuses where the inverter is?

I am at a loss. it worked fine until I pressed the batter disconnect too soon before it transferred over to 110 power and now I have no power when generator is running?

Jim Gallagher
email: jg@atifbo.com

Thanks

You don't have an inverter unless you added one and if so, it has nothing to do with the generator.

Why would you even operate the battery disconnect switch when using the generator? It needs to be connected without generator or shore power to operate the DC loads; and it has to be connected when on SP or running the generator in order for the CONVERTER to charge the house batteries.

[jgvegas]

Thank you for the replies.

So I cannot find a Breaker in the Battery Box compartment.

I have always ran the generator and Shore power without using the battery "Use".

I have never had to engage it before when on generator or when on shore power.

I did fire up the generator and turned on the "Use" switch and of course I have power (lights)from the batteries ....I did not check the Microwave or Plugs (Sorry it was late and cold) but I will repeat this when I get out of work.

It just seems odd that when I am on shore power I do not have to engage the "Use" switch. And never had to with generator running before for many years. I bought the coach with only 5000 miles...so I can't say if there were any major modifications.

Oddly when my electronic technician tested the Generator at the relay he got 12 volt reading and could not get a consistent 110...so he assumed is was a DC generator...which I thought was odd.

Thanks again...I will continue to try to ensure that the systems are working properly. The manual does not help much.

Thanks again for the direction and input.

Jim

[jgvegas]

I do have an inverter under the Refrigerator. And please repeat...when i should and should not put the battery DC in "Use".

Kindly

Jim

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by jgvegas

I do have an inverter under the Refrigerator. And please repeat...when i should and should not put the battery DC in "Use".

Kindly

Jim

2014 Vegas MHs did not come with an Inverter, You have a 120 VAC/Propane fridge. An Inverter takes 12 VDC from the house batteries and creates 120 VAC for use by residential fridges and TVs when not plugged into SP or running the generator.

A Converter takes 120 VAC from SP or the generator and creates 12 VDC for DC loads and charging batteries. That's what is under your fridge.

Your USE/STORE switch should ALWAYS remain in USE unless you are storing the MH without being plugged into SP. It is simply a disconnect for the house batteries disconnecting them from the DC Load Center (Battery Buss) so they don't get run down by DC loads when in storage. It also prevents the batteries from being charged when SP is connected or the generator is running if in STORE.

[Beau388]

Originally Posted by jgvegas

I do have an inverter under the Refrigerator. And please repeat...when i should and should not put the battery DC in "Use".

Kindly

Jim

Any time you are using the generator or shore power, you are USING the coach, so use/store switch in USE. Anytime you are USING the refrigerator, the use/store switch in use. If you are storing the coach (not in, close or around the coach) for a couple days or more, without store power, the coach should be in Store.

The use/store switch connects the house batteries to the power center (the DC part with the fuses). Turing it off (store) severs the connection of house batteries to power center. Severing this connection does not allow the house batteries to be charged if shore power or generator power is available.

[MJC62]

Leave the battery disconnect in use mode anytime you are using the coach. The only time the disconnect is in store is oddly enough when you store the coach. We have had several MH's and have stored plugged in to keep the batteries charged so we never trip the switch to store.
Your genny supplies 120 volts a/c to the coach and keeps the converter supplied with a/c power to convert to 12 volt d/c to charge the batteries. The batteries supply the 12 volt power to lights, fans, water pump, furnace and circuit board for fridge. There is no reason to hit the battery disconnect anytime the coach is being used.
If you have the battery disconnect switch in store mode when plugged into shore power or with the genny running then you are not charging house batteries.

[jgvegas]

Thank you all for replying.

I will wrap my head around the CONVERTER instead of inverter and use the "USE" switch when connected to both shore power and Generator.

I should only disconnect the USE when in storage.

I will try this and see what happens. Again it is just odd that when I am plugged into SP that I have everything as expected and do no engage the "Use" switch for battery power.

And this was the same way when running the generator until a recent trip.

finicky.

Thank you for responding.

Jim

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by jgvegas

Thank you all for replying.

I will wrap my head around the CONVERTER instead of inverter and use the "USE" switch when connected to both shore power and Generator.

I should only disconnect the USE when in storage.

I will try this and see what happens. Again it is just odd that when I am plugged into SP that I have everything as expected and do no engage the "Use" switch for battery power.

And this was the same way when running the generator until a recent trip.

finicky.

Thank you for responding.

Jim

That is because the CONVERTER is supplying 12 VDC to the DC Load Center powering all DC loads - but, as mentioned previously, your house batteries will NOT be charged if in STORE.

Now, back to your original issue.

The generator runs?
The generator is not powering the coach?
SP Powers the coach as expected (normal operation)?

Did you check the output breaker on the generator?

If yes, the most likely culprit is your Automatic Transfer Switch (ATS). This automatically selects the generator as the power source if it is running and providing normal power output. If the generator is not running, it selects SP as the 120 VAC source.

In many cases the twist-lock connections that Thor uses to connect the ATS to wiring come loose and create a high resistance or poor connection. Many people have found these connectors/wiring melted when they looked.

What model Vegas do you have? Someone with the same model can direct you to the location of the ATS for you to look at it (unplug from SP and turn off the generator first). If you don't see anything obvious with the connections it may be time to break out a multimeter and do some measurements. If this is something you are not proficient at you may need to contact a mobile tech or repair facility at this point.

[jgvegas]

See below

The generator runs? YES
The generator is not powering the coach? Correct only when Battery USE is engaged
SP Powers the coach as expected (normal operation)? YES

Did you check the output breaker on the generator? YES it seems light on the touch but did reset

If yes, the most likely culprit is your Automatic Transfer Switch (ATS). This automatically selects the generator as the power source if it is running and providing normal power output. If the generator is not running, it selects SP as the 120 VAC source. WHERE IS THIS PLEASE?

In many cases the twist-lock connections that Thor uses to connect the ATS to wiring come loose and create a high resistance or poor connection. Many people have found these connectors/wiring melted when they looked.

What model Vegas do you have? 24.1 Vegas
Someone with the same model can direct you to the location of the ATS for you to look at it (unplug from SP and turn off the generator first). If you don't see anything obvious with the connections it may be time to break out a multimeter and do some measurements. If this is something you are not proficient at you may need to contact a mobile tech or repair facility at this point.
***************

THANK YOU!

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by jgvegas

The generator is not powering the coach? Correct only when Battery USE is engaged

***************

THANK YOU!

The definition of "the generator powering the coach" means both AC and DC loads work (regardless of the status of the USE/STORE switch - it is not connected to the generator in any way):

AC Loads:
Fridge (heating element)
Microwave
Air Conditioner
Water Heater (On Electric)
TVs

DC Loads:
Interior lighting
Control Power for the fridge, furnace, and water heater
Furnace fan
Radios
Exhaust fans
Water pump

So if you have to place the USE/STORE switch in USE for anything to work with the generator running, then the generator is NOT powering the coach.

[jgvegas]

The definition of "the generator powering the coach" means both AC and DC loads work (regardless of the status of the USE/STORE switch - it is not connected to the generator in any way):

AC Load: NOT with generator running only with SP
Fridge (heating element)
Microwave
Air Conditioner
Water Heater (On Electric)
TVs

DC Loads: YES off batteries
Interior lighting
Control Power for the fridge, furnace, and water heater
Furnace fan
Radios
Exhaust fans
Water pump

So I only get DC power with generator on and house batteries in "use" of course.

The shore Power runs everything for the AC power when plugged in but not the generator.

I cannot locate the ATS...It is not under the beds in rear of the 24.1. Yesterday i looked and saw a similar picture to the ATS box behind the Inverter under the fridge, but NOT easy to get at. I have to remove the inverter fuse box.