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Old 07-13-2018, 03:33 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by TurnerFam View Post
correct, no TV is going to be pulling those type of watts, mine runs on less than 1 amp at 120v, the receiver maybe a little more, it's not that much.

what I will add, though, from experience, is that most folks don't use their inverter for high-draw HEAT related items, like the toaster and the coffee maker, since both draw huge amps during their heating cycle, and can not only quickly draw down the batteries, but trip the inverter or circuit breaker, OR cause the Inverter to cut off due to the LBCO setting(Low Battery Cut Out).
most generally use the Generator or shore power for these items, just like a hair dryer, which falls into the same category.

'CAN' you do these things, especially 'all' at the same time.... sure, but it's doubtful you'll do it very often since you'll quickly realize that Inverters aren't designed well for those type of activities. If you use your microwave for 30secs to a minute, you can get away with it, but if you're trying to pop some corn for 4 or 5 minutes, you might find that an Inverter is lacking in that job detail.

It's not so much the 'size' of your inverter, as they mostly all can handle inverting very well, but it's the 'size' and condition of your House battery bank...that's where the power comes from.
Thanks to you and Chance for jumping in. Really. I canít get to the back of the TV and the user manual doesnít contain it (figures). Itís the OOB TV Ė Seiki (oh joy). I thought I read 600? It's the eyes. Maybe it was 60. It was the point (and the math), not the specs that were important?

The device specs are below and in the link provided. Any thoughts to share? The THD better be low Ė itís pure sine. 88% is not optimal but for 2500w I can live with that. Iíd likely only run the microwave for 2-3 minutes, so I made note of your comment there. Iíd run two 225ah lithium batteries. The device has 7 battery charging profiles, so I have a little latitude there.

Iím trying to do what I want to do even if itís quite time. I wake you up with a generator at 6AM to make my coffee, toast and watch the morning news and youíd quickly have my head Ė if the wife didnít get to me first.


I appreciate your thoughts. Please keep them coming.

Idle consumption is 55 watts (2amps - assuming [HOPING] this is per hour)
Continuous output power: 2500 Watt
Surge rating: 7500 Watt (20 seconds)
Output waveform: pure sine/same as input (bypass mode)
Output voltage: 100-110-120 VAC
Nominal efficiency: >88% (peak)
Line mode efficiency: >95%
Output frequency: 60Hz +/- 0.3Hz
Typical transfer time: 10ms (max)
Terminal output breaker/ transfer load: 30 amps automatic
THD: < 10% DC
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Old 07-13-2018, 03:41 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by RvEd View Post
Beau, just one thought on this? Unless you plan to run that one thing, and one thing only, I believe you have to add up all the things you may run at once and size the inverter to that. For example, I like to brew a cup of coffee, make a couple slices of toast and catch the morning news all at the same time. To do that, and only that, I would need at least 2000w.

Coffee Maker ..... 600w
Toaster ............. 750w
TV .................... 600w
Total ............... 1950w

Hope that helped?
As my coach came with an outside kitchen, it has a 1000 watt modified sine wave inverter. The inverter duplex receptacles are located at the TVs, over the frig (BOMB) and the outside kitchen. Our microwave draws 1400 watts and is on its own circuit breaker, The TVs draw 120 watts (LED/LCD). The outside frig draws 110 watts. I did add another circuit under the dinette for the portable ice maker as we use a great deal of ice here in Texas. It draws 400 watts. The interior kitchen circuits are on the GFCI circuit and not inverter powered. The inverter bypass is a 15 amp relay. The only time I dry camp is in a Walmart or Kroger parking lot and only for a couple hours. When I converted the coach for 30 amp service to 50 amps, the only additional 120 volt circuit was a 20 amp one for the bedroom A/C. I saw no need to enlarge the inverter or the generator. We don't drink coffee (strange people? )as it is bad for my blood pressure and I hate decaf.
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Old 07-13-2018, 03:48 PM   #23
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[QUOTE=RvEd;131264][FONT=Arial]I’d likely only run the microwave for 2-3 minutes... I’d run two 225ah lithium batteries. [quote]


are these 6v batteries? if so, and in parallel, they'll then be the 12v the Inverter needs, but also now 1/2 the stated ah of the batteries - so 112.5 ah for the battery bank.... and, since the typical understanding is that 50% of the battery bank power is what you should try not to go 'lower' than, you will have around 60ah of usable battery power, roughly speaking.
if they are 12v batteries, then you'll have about 120ah...though 12v batteries aren't the typical 'deep cycle' that the Inverter can make best use of
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Old 07-13-2018, 03:58 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by RvEd View Post
Idle consumption is 55 watts (2amps - assuming [HOPING] this is per hour)
Continuous output power: 2500 Watt
Surge rating: 7500 Watt (20 seconds)
Output waveform: pure sine/same as input (bypass mode)
Output voltage: 100-110-120 VAC
Nominal efficiency: >88% (peak)
Line mode efficiency: >95%
Output frequency: 60Hz +/- 0.3Hz
Typical transfer time: 10ms (max)
Terminal output breaker/ transfer load: 30 amps automatic
THD: < 10% DC
No, both watts and amps are "flow" readings. There is no watts per hour or amps per hour. If a devices uses 2 amps or 50 watts for a period of 1 hour it has consumed 2 amp-hours or 50 watt-hours.
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Old 07-13-2018, 04:00 PM   #25
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No, both watts and amps are "flow" readings. There is no watts per hour or amps per hour. If a devices uses 2 amps or 50 watts for a period of 1 hour it has consumed 2 amp-hours or 50 watt-hours.
Right. What I meant. What you said. I did say 'hope'
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Old 07-13-2018, 04:15 PM   #26
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[QUOTE=TurnerFam;131268][QUOTE=RvEd;131264][FONT=Arial]Iíd likely only run the microwave for 2-3 minutes... Iíd run two 225ah lithium batteries.
Quote:


are these 6v batteries? if so, and in parallel, they'll then be the 12v the Inverter needs, but also now 1/2 the stated ah of the batteries - so 112.5 ah for the battery bank.... and, since the typical understanding is that 50% of the battery bank power is what you should try not to go 'lower' than, you will have around 60ah of usable battery power, roughly speaking.
if they are 12v batteries, then you'll have about 120ah...though 12v batteries aren't the typical 'deep cycle' that the Inverter can make best use of
I'm hunting for 12v that will fit. That or I'll make room somewhere for 4-6v.

One of us has it backward? If I read that right:
Two 6v wired in series = double the volts (12v), same ah (220ah) - more power
Two 6v wired in parallel = same volts (6v), double the ah (440ah) - lasts longer
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Old 07-13-2018, 04:20 PM   #27
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I was reading an article about solar power in RVs. They mentioned wiring four 6 volt batteries in "series/parallel"...
It seems that you wire each pair of the batteries in parallel contact, and then attach them in series...


My head hurts...

Here's a picture that I found...

http://www.thorforums.com/forums/att...1&d=1531499104
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Old 07-13-2018, 04:43 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Bob Denman View Post
I was reading an article about solar power in RVs. They mentioned wiring four 6 volt batteries in "series/parallel"...
It seems that you wire each pair of the batteries in parallel contact, and then attach them in series...


My head hurts...

Here's a picture that I found...

http://www.thorforums.com/forums/att...1&d=1531499104
Hurting over solar? Then let's take it to the next level and make it swell http://www.thorforums.com/forums/att...1&d=1531500990 or .
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Old 07-13-2018, 05:08 PM   #29
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I think that I might need a prescription for lithium now...
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Old 07-13-2018, 05:16 PM   #30
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I don't know what your budget is and it's non of my business: https://nexgenbattery.com/rv-lithium-batteries/
https://www.victronenergy.com/blog/2...um-ion-vs-agm/
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Old 07-13-2018, 05:31 PM   #31
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Wow!!
But I think that it would take a decent bank robbery (and jail-time); for me to be able to afford them!
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Old 07-13-2018, 05:56 PM   #32
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typical 'larger' motorhomes have larger inverters and at least 4 - 6v deep-cycle batteries wired in Parallel AND Series, giving 12v output and 1/2 the battery stated AHs. So if you have 4 6v 200ah batteries wired this way, you have 100ah of 'usable' inverter power before they discharge to 50% of capacity.
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Old 07-13-2018, 06:01 PM   #33
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I seem to recall looking at the specifications of one of the "fancier" makes and models: it was sporting a pair of 2800 watt inverters!
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Old 07-13-2018, 06:05 PM   #34
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[QUOTE=TurnerFam;131268][QUOTE=RvEd;131264][FONT=Arial]Iíd likely only run the microwave for 2-3 minutes... Iíd run two 225ah lithium batteries.
Quote:


are these 6v batteries? if so, and in parallel, they'll then be the 12v the Inverter needs, but also now 1/2 the stated ah of the batteries - so 112.5 ah for the battery bank.... and, since the typical understanding is that 50% of the battery bank power is what you should try not to go 'lower' than, you will have around 60ah of usable battery power, roughly speaking.
if they are 12v batteries, then you'll have about 120ah...though 12v batteries aren't the typical 'deep cycle' that the Inverter can make best use of
I havenít run across any 6-Volt lithium batteries (not saying they may not exist), but if they were 6 Volt, they would have to be wired in series, which yields the full 225 Ah at 12 Volts.

If they are 12-Volt (most likely case), then they would require wiring in parallel with total of 450 Ah at 12 Volts.

Also, lithium batteries are usually rated to be discharged to 80% or 100% as usable capacity, so numbers are not the same as flooded or AGM. More importantly, lithium batteries hold their voltage at high discharge currents, so Inverter wonít likely trip due to low voltage as with flooded batteries. Lithium technology isnít perfect, but for high-power applications like running a microwave or especially starting an A/C, itís hard to beat. And Iím not saying that a microwave canít be powered with flooded or AGM because itís done all the time if sized and wired correctly.
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Old 07-13-2018, 07:40 PM   #35
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Wow!!
But I think that it would take a decent bank robbery (and jail-time); for me to be able to afford them!
If you wanted to step it down and wire two 12v 100ah batteries in parallel, you could get 200ah. I forgot what your required space requirements were (other post somewhere). Go to the specs tab on this page to see that as well as other good info. They claim a 90% DOD. That's pretty darn good. You can go to 100% w/o damage (a real plus) but that's highly DISrecommended and most will tell you 70-80% to play it safe. I don't think 100% damages it and I believe you give usable cycles: https://greenlifebattery.com/product...m-ion-battery/


Here's a less expensive one but I never heard of this company before:
https://www.altestore.com/store/deep...BBB100AH12VLFP
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Old 07-13-2018, 07:45 PM   #36
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I havenít run across any 6-Volt lithium batteries...
Me either, in which case I'd have to step back to AGM golf cart batteries then subsequently shoot myself for wasting so much time ignoring life to research this.
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Old 07-13-2018, 08:00 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by TurnerFam View Post
typical 'larger' motorhomes have larger inverters and at least 4 - 6v deep-cycle batteries wired in Parallel AND Series, giving 12v output and 1/2 the battery stated AHs. So if you have 4 6v 200ah batteries wired this way, you have 100ah of 'usable' inverter power before they discharge to 50% of capacity.
Nope: no way to wire it to get 1/2 the stated battery AHs.. Either you have them all if wired in series, or you double them when wired in parallel.
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Old 07-13-2018, 08:11 PM   #38
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Either you have them all if wired in series, or you double them when wired in parallel.
There is an exception to this? Some solar setups will wire two 6v in series to get 12v, then subsequently wire the 6v pairs in parallel to get the advertised ahs of one 6v. There are good diagrams that clearly demonstrate how it's done.


Example: 2-6v @ 100ahs wired in series would = 100ahs @12v.


Gang the 2-6v pair with another 2-6v @ 100ahs wired in parallel = 200ahs @ 12v.
(NOTE: the batteries are 6v pairs and MUST remain be in pairs throughout build)

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Old 07-13-2018, 08:20 PM   #39
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Me either, in which case I'd have to step back to AGM golf cart batteries then subsequently shoot myself for wasting so much time ignoring life to research this.

Iím not following your total point here (not entirely clear to me), but if a coach has two existing 6-Volt batteries in series, itís not that difficult to replace them with two 12-Volt batteries. Just saying that individual battery voltage shouldnít preclude you from switching from lead-acid based batteries to lithium. There may be other reasons why lithium may not be best battery option, but voltage isnít one of them in my opinion.
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Old 07-13-2018, 08:24 PM   #40
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ok ok
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