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Old 10-16-2020, 07:12 PM   #1
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Model: Challenger 37TB
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THOR #20824
Running 110 power outlets off Existing inverter

I have a 2019 Challenger 37TB that the residential fridge runs off the inverter. I want to make my 110 plugs (TVs and etc) run off the inverter as well. Anyone made this change? I am not sure how to handle the wiring, and i am having a hard time to finding a reliable installer in Los Angeles area to handle this.

I am adding more solar and replacing batteries with 4 Lithiums so i'll have enough juice for most electrical appllicances (except of course, convection ove, AC, etc that i only run with generator).

Thanks
Tony
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Old 10-16-2020, 07:23 PM   #2
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You need an Electrician. Try a local mobile tech.
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Old 10-16-2020, 07:25 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by tonyspad View Post
I have a 2019 Challenger 37TB that the residential fridge runs off the inverter. I want to make my 110 plugs (TVs and etc) run off the inverter as well. Anyone made this change? I am not sure how to handle the wiring, and i am having a hard time to finding a reliable installer in Los Angeles area to handle this.

I am adding more solar and replacing batteries with 4 Lithiums so i'll have enough juice for most electrical appllicances (except of course, convection ove, AC, etc that i only run with generator).

Thanks
Tony
Behind the inverter will be a junction box where all of the wiring for the inverter circuits are combined. You can remove the wires from the power center circuit breaker and move those wires to the inverter's junction box, however than is not a good idea as you can easily overload the inverter's transfer switch or the inverter itself. The correct way would to buy an inverter which will supply 30 amps or so with a 30 amp transfer switch (Xantrex Freedom X 3000). Then run all circuits you want to run off the inverter through a sub panel.
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Old 10-16-2020, 07:39 PM   #4
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Would it be a good idea to upgrade to an inverter that can deliver more watts?
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Old 10-16-2020, 07:45 PM   #5
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I don't mind upgrading the inverter to a more heavy duty inverter. Just need to find out the wiring. I am guessing same place as the fridge is connected, and then try to figure out which wire for the rest of 110 get connected to the fridge location on panel.

Even if i go to second inverter which i dont mind, its really the same question regarding which wire connects all the 110. so i can connect it to the second inverter.

I think i can download the elctrical panel schematics
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Old 10-16-2020, 10:18 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by tonyspad View Post
I don't mind upgrading the inverter to a more heavy duty inverter. Just need to find out the wiring. I am guessing same place as the fridge is connected, and then try to figure out which wire for the rest of 110 get connected to the fridge location on panel.

Even if i go to second inverter which i dont mind, its really the same question regarding which wire connects all the 110. so i can connect it to the second inverter.

I think i can download the electrical panel schematics
The cable that connects your 120 volt duplex receptacles presently goes to a 15 amp circuit breaker in the power center. It should be labeled by where the receptacles are located: bedroom, dinette, living room, bathroom, etc. In a Challenger you probably have 4 different 120 volt circuits not on the inverter. My power center is located in the bed side and the wiring is accessed by a removable panel in the bed platform.

Behind the inverter, there is a junction box for the duplex receptacles off the inverter (TVs, media center, fridge). In the picture attached of my coach, the junction box is just to the right of the inverter in the very back. It is no longer used in my installation as the sub-panel replaced the need for a junction box. The orange 10 awg cable connects the inverter's transfer switch to the power center then connects the inverter's output to the sub panel. The two 120 volt duplex receptacles circuits were moved from the power center's 15 amp circuit breakers to the sub-panel circuit breakers.
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Old 10-16-2020, 10:41 PM   #7
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I like your explanation. I "think" i know what you are saying lol

So, here are the schematics of my rig wiring in PDF, and couple of pictures. I just downloaded it.
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Old 10-17-2020, 12:04 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by tonyspad View Post
I don't mind upgrading the inverter to a more heavy duty inverter. Just need to find out the wiring. I am guessing same place as the fridge is connected, and then try to figure out which wire for the rest of 110 get connected to the fridge location on panel.

Even if i go to second inverter which i dont mind, its really the same question regarding which wire connects all the 110. so i can connect it to the second inverter.

I think i can download the elctrical panel schematics
no one wire connects to all the 110 except the shore power.
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Old 10-17-2020, 01:05 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyspad View Post
I like your explanation. I "think" i know what you are saying lol

So, here are the schematics of my rig wiring in PDF, and couple of pictures. I just downloaded it.
Well only one of those is a schematic and it is for the DC side of your coach; BUT the other PDFs show you have an 1800 watt inverter that besides powering the fridge, also powers the TV outlets, so you do have some additional 120 VAC capability already built into the coach.

The only other circuits you should move to the inverter would be the 5A and 6A circuits but that would give you 45 AC amps worth of circuits running off a single 15 Amp circuit breaker, not to mention overloading the inverter's output transfer switch and the inverter itself. You would need to change the breaker and AC wiring to the inverter, the inverter itself to a 4000+ watt inverter, and the DC wiring and fuse to the inverter.
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Old 10-17-2020, 02:41 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by tonyspad View Post
I like your explanation. I "think" i know what you are saying lol

So, here are the schematics of my rig wiring in PDF, and couple of pictures. I just downloaded it.
The cable (circuit breaker) labeled TV receptacles is for the inverter transfer relay. The one you want to power is general receptacles. You need to remove those three wires (Romex cable) to the junction box labeled TV and fridge.

The stock inverter is 15 amps @ 120 volts and is probably supplied by 2 awg cables and can pull 150 amps or 250 amps for 1/2 of a second through a 250 amp circuit breaker in the battery compartment. If you have 4 110 amp-h batteries, then you have 220 amp-h usable. I would not recommend you try to power the GFCI circuits with the common inverter.



I would recommend you look at the total needs for the fridge, TVs and the general receptacles. If you are like me and just plan to power a portable ice maker, TV and sound bar, DirecTV and the fridge and never a heater or coffee maker, the 4 batteries and 1800 vwatt inverter can handle it. I get by with a 2000 amp inverter with a 30 amp transfer switch.

With more batteries and a bigger inverter (or another 2000 watt inverter) you could do even more, but than would require more battery cable, another circuit breaker and more rewiring.
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Old 10-18-2020, 02:17 AM   #11
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Can't he set up something he can plug his shore power plug into in the basement? I know I'm probably missing something but, if he runs wires down there and sets up a receptacle, just plug it up in the electrical bay? That way the coaches standard equipment takes over the rest. He 'd just have to discipline himself around the micro and A/C.
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Old 10-21-2020, 08:15 PM   #12
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I just ran a parallel inverter

I started out doing something very close to the OP's question.
Since I also added solar, I decided to run an entire separate system and leave the original inverter, lead acid batteries and system intact.
Here's what I did:
I installed 750w of solar on the roof and (since I have a Thor 37RB) I installed a second array of 500w on the dropdown ramp that I can unfold and use when boondocking. Each array goes through it's own charger controller (Outback FlexMAX 60s)
Those arrays go to 420Ah of LiFePo4, which then goes to a Xantrex Freedom X 3000.
I also installed a Victron BMV712 to watch the batteries.
THEN, I installed a second Load Center off of the new Xantrex and simply moved the circuits (from the shore LC or the old inverter LC) that I wanted to go to the new one. Yes, this (especially) included the outlets! Why Thor didn't have them connected to the 1800w inverter is silly.. At least some of them!!
Now when I am deep in the outback, with both arrays *pouring* in heavy sunshine, I can even run one of my rooftop AC units!
I also don't have to deal with isolating the alternator from the LiFpo4s.


And why did I do this? Because from Day 1 of owning my brand new 2016 Thor, the generator has NEVER worked and no service center has been able to fix it. CW just kept replacing things until it was out of warranty and then charged an arm and leg just to look at the thing. It's a POS! And now, it's dead weight!
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Old 10-21-2020, 09:52 PM   #13
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My situation is a little different, but my ACE 27.2 did not come with an inverter. Unlike my old class C Forrester, the TVs in this rig are 110v. I wanted an inverter to run the TV, make coffee and spin the blender when boondocking or during quiet time. I bought a 1500 W inverter, wired it to the batteries. Ran the remote on off switch to the wall by the thermostat. Ran a wire from the inverter output under the bed where the panel wires are. Then I cut the wires to the kitchen plugs and TV, and wired in a rotary A/B/Off switch. Now, I can switch to the inverter side, turn it on remotely, and have 110v power. Took some work and a sketch from the supply house guy I got the switch from, but all is good, total cost under $200.
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Old 10-21-2020, 10:26 PM   #14
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My situation is a little different, but my ACE 27.2 did not come with an inverter. Unlike my old class C Forrester, the TVs in this rig are 110v. I wanted an inverter to run the TV, make coffee and spin the blender when boondocking or during quiet time. I bought a 1500 W inverter, wired it to the batteries. Ran the remote on off switch to the wall by the thermostat. Ran a wire from the inverter output under the bed where the panel wires are. Then I cut the wires to the kitchen plugs and TV, and wired in a rotary A/B/Off switch. Now, I can switch to the inverter side, turn it on remotely, and have 110v power. Took some work and a sketch from the supply house guy I got the switch from, but all is good, total cost under $200.
I did the same thing in my ACE 27.1 with a DPDT center off switch. I can select the Inverter output or the SP/GEN output or no output to all my non-GFCI outlets. Since my router and cell modem (Mobley plan in a Netgear modem) are wired to the entertainment outlet we can have rolling wifi as we travel.


For lmichel: the OP did have his TV outlets wired to his 1800 watt inverter as well as his fridge. Most Thor coaches with a factory residential fridge and 1800 watt inverter are wired this way.
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Old 10-21-2020, 10:59 PM   #15
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I had a similar issue with my ACE 27.2, but I already had an inverter as they switched to residential fridges near the end of production. I assessed my power needs and determined that to run the AC, microwave, toaster, coffee maker, etc. I would need to run the generator. So the intent is to run the generator in the morning while I make breakfast and again for dinner if needed.

Instead of spending money on electricians and complicated wiring, I just installed what is essentially an extension cord from the inverter to the main areas required. For me that was the cabinet with the bluray player, closet lights and the kitchen counter which will reach the main TV or a crock pot in the sink while travelling. If I had a larger inverter, I could run to all of the TVs.

I used standard household 14/2 wiring, which is what is used on the 110 volt outlets. I connected a male 3 prong plug to a short piece of wire for the connection to the inverter. I then made connections in a standard deep octagon splice box, with marrets, so that I could attach it to the wood frame above the inverter. One connection was a short run to a female plug to feed the closet light. One ran to an outlet in the bluray cabinet (I used a white outlet so it is a different color than the normal outlets). The last run went to the kitchen where I installed a pop up GFI outlet into the counter top. This closes flat to the counter top so that it does not take up valuable counter space when not needed. I am still well under the 15 amp inverter fuse even if everything is running at the same time.

This eliminates any screwing around with the RV power distribution. I only have to relocate the plugs from the 110V outlets to the inverter outlets when needed. If you need more power than 15 amps, you can upsize the inverter and run a similar setup from each inverter outlet. Just ensure that you don't exceed the amperage allowed per outlet on the inverter.

If you need to connect to a slide out, you can change that feed to round stranded wiring, which is more flexible. You will need to find how the 110v wiring is installed in your slide and feed the new wiring in the same location.
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Old 10-22-2020, 01:21 AM   #16
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I only wanted a couple of outlets and one TV running off of an inverter. I simply spliced the inverter (with transfer switch) in an existing line so that when connected to shore power the 110V merely passes through the inverter to the outlets and TV and when not connected, I can turn on the inverter and feed 110V to the two outlets and the TV, when needed.

In the Axis 24.2, the outside TV is adjacent to the batteries that are under the entry steps. We never used the outside TV, so I removed it and used the space to install the inverter. I also mounted wiring and switches for the solar going to/from the controller. Everything is labeled and easy to access.

The 12V for the inverter is on a short run from the house battery feed at the relay so that it is only available when the cabin switch is on. There are no long runs and 12V is on 4 or 6 gauge wires and 110V is on household wiring, I believe it is 12 gauge.
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Old 10-22-2020, 02:36 PM   #17
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my 2018 Miramar is already wired that way from the factory
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Old 10-22-2020, 03:36 PM   #18
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Inverter connections PDF

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Old 10-22-2020, 03:58 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by chuckb View Post
my 2018 Miramar is already wired that way from the factory
In my opinion that is the way all inverters should be integrated into the coach's wiring. My Xantrex Freedom Xi is always on when the generator is running or on shore power. If the inverter is off and power is applied to the coach it will come on automatically. This way it acts an an UPS. This is especially important when the DirecTV receiver is recording a program. Yes, you can turn the inverter off it there is no AC power to the inverter, or it will turn-off automatically if there is no power draw for 24 hours.

The DW does not like to be told to manage her power usage.
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