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08-23-2019, 12:26 AM
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#1
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Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: South Carolina
Posts: 32
THOR #11708
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Swap for lithium?????
I have a 2001 Damon Intruder. It is currently using two 6 volt golf cart batteries. I think I know the answer to the following, but thought I’d better check it out to be sure...
Can one replace the lead acid batteries with lithium batteries without changing the charging system ( a simple swap out)?
I doubt this is possible, but thought I’d check out just to be sure.
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08-23-2019, 01:00 AM
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#2
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Site Team
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 27.1
State: Florida
Posts: 14,325
THOR #7035
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Yes, there are drop-in replacements but sit down before you look at the price.
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Ted & Melinda
2016 ACE 27.1
2016 Chevy Sonic Toad - Selling
2020 Chevy Colorado Z71 Trail Runner Toad
2024 Chevrolet Trax 2RS - Soon 2B TOAD
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08-23-2019, 02:29 PM
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#3
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Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: South Carolina
Posts: 32
THOR #11708
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But would the existing changer system ( converter) work with lithium? I have read some company descriptions which make it sound “iffy”.
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08-23-2019, 02:58 PM
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#4
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Site Team
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 27.1
State: Florida
Posts: 14,325
THOR #7035
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rcyoung
But would the existing changer system ( converter) work with lithium? I have read some company descriptions which make it sound “iffy”.
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If they are "drop in" replacements - yes. That means they have an integral Battery Control Module which handles the charging/discharging intricacies.
Quote:
You do not need a special charger to charge your LFP deep cycle battery. As I mentioned above the battery prefers to bulk charge at 14.4 volts and float at 13.6 volts. Most standard chargers can handle these settings. There are some made for lithium chargers available on our store page and they will charge faster than a regular charger in most cases.
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https://battlebornbatteries.com/buy-...po4-batteries/
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Ted & Melinda
2016 ACE 27.1
2016 Chevy Sonic Toad - Selling
2020 Chevy Colorado Z71 Trail Runner Toad
2024 Chevrolet Trax 2RS - Soon 2B TOAD
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08-30-2019, 07:46 PM
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#5
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Palazzo 33.2
State: California
Posts: 252
THOR #12839
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What kind of inverter/charger do you have?
The reason I ask is that your inverter/charger may be programmable, allowing you to optimize the settings to be more comparable with the LiFePo batteries.
For example, if you have an inverter/controller with a control panel in the RV, you should be able to change the Battery Type from "Flooded" to "AGM" which will get you closer to the optimal charging profile. If you also have the choice of "Custom" , then that should bring up sub menus for all of the specific parameters, which the battery manufacturer can/will provide.
I have a Magnum inverter/charger but had to buy one of their control panels to access the Custom settings, because they weren't available through my factory Firefly control panel in our 2018 Palazzo.
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2018 Palazzo 33.2
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08-30-2019, 08:38 PM
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#6
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: Missouri
Posts: 2,325
THOR #6903
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I would just go with AGM and call it a day
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08-30-2019, 09:10 PM
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#7
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Forest River Forester 235
State: Indiana
Posts: 4,884
THOR #6826
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I’d just go with new flooded golf cart batteries. Mine last about 3 years of semi neglectful use. Can go through 3 sets for the price of AGM and I can’t even imagine how many before matching the cost of lithium! Plus the flooded ones give you plenty of notice that they are approaching their demise. My experience with AGM is that they work great until one day they don’t work at all. But, whatever works best for you is what you should do.
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08-30-2019, 10:03 PM
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#8
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I Think We're Lost!
Brand: Still Looking
Model: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
State: New York
Posts: 22,195
THOR #8860
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Lithium batteries do offer another advantage: a huge savings of weight and space!
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"What: me worry?"
Good Sam Member 843599689
Current coach: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
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08-31-2019, 02:25 PM
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#9
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 30.1
State: Colorado
Posts: 388
THOR #5190
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I’ve been thinking of going with lithium to replace my existing Interstate 6 volt batteries. The existing set up has a capacity of 225 amp hours, about half of which is usable. 200 amp hours of lithium would give me more usable capacity as you can discharge down to about 10%
I can reprogram my solar charger (Bogart SC-2030) to work with lithium. Not sure about my Progressive Dynamics converter. Need to do more research. Main issue is winter time. We store our coach outdoors and I think i’d have to pull the lithium batteries and drop in a cheap lead acid battery that would be kept charged with the solar panels such as I do today. I visit the coach every few weeks and run the engine and generator.
In the spring I’d put in the Lithium batteries back in and reprogram the solar controller. Now all I have to do is budget the 2 grand for the batteries.
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Rick
2017 Thor ACE 30.1
2017 Jeep Cherokee Trailhawk
Roadmaster Falcon All Terrain
RVi Brake 3
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08-31-2019, 03:23 PM
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#10
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I Think We're Lost!
Brand: Still Looking
Model: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
State: New York
Posts: 22,195
THOR #8860
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Please let us know what you find out.
Lithium batteries are the "new kid on the block", and there seems to be a lot to learn about them.
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"What: me worry?"
Good Sam Member 843599689
Current coach: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
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08-31-2019, 03:37 PM
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#11
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Senior Member
Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
Posts: 6,187
THOR #2121
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Running true deep cycle batteries down beyond 50% doesn’t add that much cost, even though cycle life is reduced.
Weight is the main drawback to lead-based batteries. But lithium has more temperature issues, so a good case can be made for either choice depending on one’s planned battery use.
Trojan chart attached for reference.
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09-02-2019, 01:59 AM
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#12
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Junior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: Connecticut
Posts: 5
THOR #16509
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rcyoung
But would the existing changer system ( converter) work with lithium? I have read some company descriptions which make it sound “iffy”.
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Integrated BMS lithium is ok with two exceptions, chargers that have a desulfation function (needs to be shut off) and charging when they are below freezing. Smarter BMS's will block these one way or the other but generally disconnecting the battery to do so.
Now you can also try and charge them too fast thats normally only the case with combiner type rigs and only the more advanced BMS's with integration deal with this (meaning the BMS is talking to the charger, battery monitor etc).
I have to say that lithium and a big inverter was the best quality of living upgrade I did. AC all night dry camping without a gen set running keeps a wife happy.
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09-02-2019, 03:18 AM
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#13
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Senior Member
Brand: DRV
State: Texas
Posts: 678
THOR #3109
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How much solar on top, and how many lithiums to use the AC? And the inverter?
Thanks
Joe
__________________
2016 Tiffin 40QBH
2015 38RSSA--traded
2005 36TK3--retired, but it was a good one
2017 F450 KR
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09-03-2019, 01:07 PM
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#14
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Junior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: Connecticut
Posts: 5
THOR #16509
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wingnut60
How much solar on top, and how many lithiums to use the AC? And the inverter?
Thanks
Joe
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1200w on top 4x200ah 12v Victrons and a 3kva victron inverter. I'm running a mac 3 ps so it's 1200w on high thats 30-60ah an hour once it's down to temp. Would look at the dc 9000's thats only 50a at 12v just expensive to buy into. The solar needs about 8 peak hours to recharge the 800ah without anything running.
A sunny day while traveling can keep the AC going from PV alone, cloudy and I get 40a from the alternator that tends to be enough to a little under with the fridge on AC as well. Dry camping nice weather generally do not need the gen set while still using AC/microwave/toaster oven.
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09-03-2019, 08:39 PM
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#15
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Chateau 31L
State: Florida
Posts: 2,063
THOR #12189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silas
1200w on top 4x200ah 12v Victrons and a 3kva victron inverter. I'm running a mac 3 ps so it's 1200w on high thats 30-60ah an hour once it's down to temp. Would look at the dc 9000's thats only 50a at 12v just expensive to buy into. The solar needs about 8 peak hours to recharge the 800ah without anything running.
A sunny day while traveling can keep the AC going from PV alone, cloudy and I get 40a from the alternator that tends to be enough to a little under with the fridge on AC as well. Dry camping nice weather generally do not need the gen set while still using AC/microwave/toaster oven.
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1200w and 4x200 takes up a lot of space. What's your rig, if you don't mind me asking?
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09-04-2019, 07:29 PM
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#16
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Junior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: Connecticut
Posts: 5
THOR #16509
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Breeze
1200w and 4x200 takes up a lot of space. What's your rig, if you don't mind me asking?
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Not realy that is on my now old 2009 Springdale 303bh TT the batteries fit nicely under the sink along with the inverter and the rest, 12x 100w panels fill the roof. My battery vendor (Victron) actualy has a new version of my 200ah comming out they dropped nearly half the weight and a bit physically smaller. No need to vent or maintain so a few feet back in a cabinet is fine.
New rig is a 2015 35sb still working on where things will go I fly down to drive it back in a week. Expect that will add a second 3kva inverter and alternator while reusing the rest. Have all winter to deal with that.
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