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10-04-2024, 06:52 PM
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#1
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Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Omni RS36
State: California
Posts: 59
THOR #30872
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Winegard to Starlink Conversion
Does anyone know if there is anyone making a conversion kit to remove the Winegard from the top of the RV and install a Starlink Roam dish? I never use the winegard, and having a permanent mount for the Roam dish up top would be great. Hopefully we could use the power supply and mounting holes that were meant for the winegard. I'm not sure if it is even possible, but if so, I would be interested.
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10-04-2024, 09:31 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Chateau 24F
State: Ohio
Posts: 5,035
THOR #16721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PSDtime
Does anyone know if there is anyone making a conversion kit to remove the Winegard from the top of the RV and install a Starlink Roam dish? I never use the winegard, and having a permanent mount for the Roam dish up top would be great. Hopefully we could use the power supply and mounting holes that were meant for the winegard. I'm not sure if it is even possible, but if so, I would be interested.
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The problem with a fixed mounting of the dish is difficulty of positioning it for a relatively clear view of the northern sky, which means positioning your entire motorhome. Satellite comms are very directional, so optimally the dish must be facing the northern sky AND aligned/pointed at a specific satellite... dictated by the Starlink software. Unlike previous versions, Gen 3 and Mini dishes are not motor driven for alignment. It's done manually.
In western geographic regions, roof mounting might work, but with tree cover and blockage you're better off being able to string the cable out and place the dish in a clear area.
As Starlink replaces existing satellites with upgrades to allow more focused beam technology this will likely change and improve. I mounted mine on a flagpole attached to the ladder, but can also lay it out in the grass or on a picnic table if needed.
As for using the Winegard wiring... Starlink needs much more voltage... quote from Starlink:
Quote:
The Starlink Mini has a power input rating of 12-48VDC, 60W. Starlink only guarantees performance with the included Starlink power supply and cable.
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Add to that the length of the cable itself which requires more voltage over the length. I've seen tests where folks tried powering straight from the RV's 12 volt system, and discovered the voltage is too low. So the Winegard power wiring technically could be used... but a voltage booster would still be required.
I'm currently using the supplied AC-DC power wall wart. It only uses 30 - 40 watts, but the conversion from AC to DC is kind of silly and unnecessarily wasteful of power. My inverter is in a rear storage compartment, and has a handy 120v outlet built in. I simply drilled a hole in the rotocast plastic storage bin, popped in a grommet and feed the Starlink cable in there.
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10-04-2024, 09:45 PM
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#3
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Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Omni RS36
State: California
Posts: 59
THOR #30872
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chateau_Nomad
The problem with a fixed mounting of the dish is difficulty of positioning it for a relatively clear view of the northern sky, which means positioning your entire motorhome. Satellite comms are very directional, so optimally the dish must be facing the northern sky AND aligned/pointed at a specific satellite... dictated by the Starlink software. Unlike previous versions, Gen 3 and Mini dishes are not motor driven for alignment. It's done manually.
In western geographic regions, roof mounting might work, but with tree cover and blockage you're better off being able to string the cable out and place the dish in a clear area.
As Starlink replaces existing satellites with upgrades to allow more focused beam technology this will likely change and improve. I mounted mine on a flagpole attached to the ladder, but can also lay it out in the grass or on a picnic table if needed.
As for using the Winegard wiring... Starlink needs much more voltage... quote from Starlink:
Add to that the length of the cable itself which requires more voltage over the length. I've seen tests where folks tried powering straight from the RV's 12 volt system, and discovered the voltage is too low. So the Winegard power wiring technically could be used... but a voltage booster would still be required.
I'm currently using the supplied AC-DC power wall wart. It only uses 30 - 40 watts, but the conversion from AC to DC is kind of silly and unnecessarily wasteful of power. My inverter is in a rear storage compartment, and has a handy 120v outlet built in. I simply drilled a hole in the rotocast plastic storage bin, popped in a grommet and feed the Starlink cable in there.
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Thanks for your input and I agree with much of what you are saying. However, there are multiple companies that are making solid mounts to be attached on top of the Sprinter/RV conversions and those people are claiming that it can work on the move. I have a Roam, and I know what you mean about alignment, but how are they getting around it? I've only used my Roam twice and never tried it without alignment. As for the power issue, I agree with that too. My thought on that is most RV's that I have seen have a power switch for the Winegard (or powered antenna) right by where the main TV plugs in. I was thinking if my idea was even plausible, you could interrupt the power at the switch and feed power from the "wall wart" or something similar down the wires that used to be used for Winegard. Not sure the gauge or anything on wires, but it is possible that they are large enough. What may I ask did you do for the "flag pole" mount?
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10-04-2024, 10:56 PM
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#4
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Chateau 24F
State: Ohio
Posts: 5,035
THOR #16721
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Harbor Freight flagpole. First I designed and 3D printed an adapter for the flag pole top which mates to the supplied Starlink pole mount. Then designed and 3D printed a "tip in" mount, which is two pieces bolted onto the ladder. works similar to another popular setup. Well tested... note the road grime from the hurricane rain on our recent trip.
Slide the dish into the pole adapter and tighten screw. Then extend as many sections of pole as needed for desired height... I never extended more that two, which put the dish several feet above the roof. Tip the upper pole into the upper bracket, then set the bottom of pole into the lower bracket.
After Starlink boots up it shows a graphic of which way to rotate the dish for perfect alignment. Just twist the pole to make it align, then tighten the thumb screw to hold it in place.
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Be creative, and have a fun life...
...and don't be an @**hole! -Ken Block
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10-04-2024, 11:16 PM
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#5
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Site Team
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 27.1
State: Florida
Posts: 16,140
THOR #7035
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Starlink does not point at a satellite. The satellites are not in geosynchronous orbit, they are going by. The antenna follows the satellites electronically, moving from one to another as needed. Kinda like a cell phone in the car and cell towers, but in reverse.
As Starlink says:
1 PLUG IT IN
2 POINT AT SKY
Starlink requires an unobstructed view of the sky. Download the Starlink app to determine your best install location.
That unobstructed view does not have to be north anymore. As you can see, their satellites are almost everywhere.
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Ted & Melinda
2016 ACE 27.1
2020 Chevy Colorado Z71 Trail Runner Toad
2024 Chevrolet Trax 2RS - Soon 2B BU TOAD
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10-05-2024, 03:17 AM
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#6
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Chateau 24F
State: Ohio
Posts: 5,035
THOR #16721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 16ACE27
Starlink does not point at a satellite. The satellites are not in geosynchronous orbit, they are going by. The antenna follows the satellites electronically, moving from one to another as needed. Kinda like a cell phone in the car and cell towers, but in reverse.
As Starlink says:
1 PLUG IT IN
2 POINT AT SKY
Starlink requires an unobstructed view of the sky. Download the Starlink app to determine your best install location.
That unobstructed view does not have to be north anymore. As you can see, their satellites are almost everywhere.
Attachment 47866
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ACE you're gonna have to explain that one. IF the Starlink antenna can be pointed anywhere at the sky, why does the app give SPECIFIC INSTRUCTIONS, both by complaining that the antenna is not properly aimed? AND... why does the app specifically instruct aiming at an unobstructed view of the northern sky? Has Starlink failed to update the app?? Please explain what you're seeing in the app as you setup Starlink and go through the connection process. Maybe I'm overlooking something?
While I have got a connection (though compromised) by random aiming, it IS NOT consistent, and frequently disconnects if not aimed as instructed in the app. While it's true there's "handoffs" between satellites as they move overhead, Starlink "knows" which ones you should be connected to.
Pundits are claiming upgraded satellites will have laser interconnectivity and a more highly focused beam to the dish. But other than slick general advertising, which is often intentionally vague - I see NOWHERE in instructions I received with my Mini package saying "just point it at the sky". Yes it's simple, but not as simple as "just point it at the sky". Just like a "sign then drive" car lease ad, there's more to it.
I have a fairly open view of the sky straight overhead here at home. In the next few days I'll set up Starlink and "just point it at the sky overhead" and see what I get. The app also records a graphic representation of detected obstructions, so I'll put it to the test.
I'm willing to admit I may have been wasting my time with the aiming adjustments. If so it will open up a LOT more areas for camping! And if our Spectrum home Internet goes up in price any more, I'm investing in a Gen 3 package with the $120 home Internet. Straight overhead aiming for that would be VERY convenient!
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10-05-2024, 10:27 AM
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#7
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Quantum JM31
State: Tennessee
Posts: 961
THOR #21926
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I have to disagree with Chateau_Nomad on this one.
We have the Gen 3 Starlink and flat mounted the dish on the roof of the RV with a Trio flat mount adapter. This adapter lets you un snap the dish and reattach the original stand from Starlink. You can then plug in the long cable that came with the Gen 3 into the cable that you unplug from the Starlink dish by using a RJ-45 male to male adapter. Throw the cable over the side of the RV where needed and move the dish out to a clear sky location. By the way, Gen 3 uses standard Cat 6 RJ-45 cables so you can just order outdoor rated Cat 6 RJ-45 cables. I used a 7 foot one to go from the router to the dish on the roof and sealed the hole and cable with a cable entry plate and Dicor.
As ACE has pointed out the Gen 3 Starlink is not very picky about orientation. It will often work with some tree interference. It is said that you need to point it North but the first time we used it we pointed it South and it worked like a champ with over 200 MBS download. That was before I flat mounted it on the roof. We tested the Gen 3 driving down the interstate at 65 MPH and the app said we had over 200 MBS download speed. When we got to the campground our site had trees on both sides but some open sky and the app said we were not pointing in an optimum direction. I ignored it because the speed was over 200 MBS.
Here is a photo of our Gen 3 mounted on the roof and the Starlink router mounted in one of the cabinets. The Starlink power supply is seen on the floor of the cabinet unplugged. The motorhome is in the garage and the Starlink will not work there so we keep it unplugged.
__________________
Bob
2022 Quantum JM31
2023 Colorado Z71
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10-05-2024, 12:25 PM
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#8
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Tellaro 20k
State: Arizona
Posts: 305
THOR #27962
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ACE and Bob nailed it based upon my limited experience with my month old Starlink Mini. And dozens of YouTube videos I watched searching for mount and power options.
I came to the conclusion the clear view and north alignment was basically to get the initial and best connection. As an early experiment I set it on the roof of the truck, got connected, and then tossed it on the dash. Drove around while it bobbled on the dash and it still worked.
I’m still exploring mount options. How does it easily “unsnap” when it is in the Trio mount? Do you have to unscrew the frame pieces or is there a way to reach in and release it from the adapter?
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10-05-2024, 01:33 PM
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#9
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Tellaro 20k
State: Arizona
Posts: 305
THOR #27962
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MCP
ACE and Bob nailed it based upon my limited experience with my month old Starlink Mini. And dozens of YouTube videos I watched searching for mount and power options.
I came to the conclusion the clear view and north alignment was basically to get the initial and best connection. As an early experiment I set it on the roof of the truck, got connected, and then tossed it on the dash. Drove around while it bobbled on the dash and it still worked.
I’m still exploring mount options. How does it easily “unsnap” when it is in the Trio mount? Do you have to unscrew the frame pieces or is there a way to reach in and release it from the adapter?
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Oops! I think I see the answer on the mount release. You (Bob) have the flat mount instead of the speed mount. I was wondering how easy it would be to unmount from the speed mount. The flat mount would be easy to unsnap.
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10-05-2024, 01:44 PM
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#10
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Site Team
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: ACE 27.1
State: Florida
Posts: 16,140
THOR #7035
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chateau_Nomad
ACE you're gonna have to explain that one. IF the Starlink antenna can be pointed anywhere at the sky, why does the app give SPECIFIC INSTRUCTIONS, both by complaining that the antenna is not properly aimed? AND... why does the app specifically instruct aiming at an unobstructed view of the northern sky? Has Starlink failed to update the app?? Please explain what you're seeing in the app as you setup Starlink and go through the connection process. Maybe I'm overlooking something?
While I have got a connection (though compromised) by random aiming, it IS NOT consistent, and frequently disconnects if not aimed as instructed in the app. While it's true there's "handoffs" between satellites as they move overhead, Starlink "knows" which ones you should be connected to.
Pundits are claiming upgraded satellites will have laser interconnectivity and a more highly focused beam to the dish. But other than slick general advertising, which is often intentionally vague - I see NOWHERE in instructions I received with my Mini package saying "just point it at the sky". Yes it's simple, but not as simple as "just point it at the sky". Just like a "sign then drive" car lease ad, there's more to it.
I have a fairly open view of the sky straight overhead here at home. In the next few days I'll set up Starlink and "just point it at the sky overhead" and see what I get. The app also records a graphic representation of detected obstructions, so I'll put it to the test.
I'm willing to admit I may have been wasting my time with the aiming adjustments. If so it will open up a LOT more areas for camping! And if our Spectrum home Internet goes up in price any more, I'm investing in a Gen 3 package with the $120 home Internet. Straight overhead aiming for that would be VERY convenient!
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I thought I explained it with the snapshot of all the starlink satellites around the earth. The APP may help you point it for an optimal signal for a specific location, but you really don't need optimal positioning for acceptable performance., as evidenced by "in-motion" applications.
__________________
Ted & Melinda
2016 ACE 27.1
2020 Chevy Colorado Z71 Trail Runner Toad
2024 Chevrolet Trax 2RS - Soon 2B BU TOAD
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10-05-2024, 03:41 PM
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#11
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It's 'towed', not toad.
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2018 24.1 AXISSIXxSIX
State: Arizona
Posts: 8,443
THOR #13932
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I do not ever need optimum.
The chances of it needing pointed north are pretty slim for me.
I might be a nice bit of fun to find max signal but frankly, very frankly, 24meg gets you 4k tv and less than 3meg gets you 1080.
I haven't been able to out-type a source since the 300baud days.
Gamers?
They're different.
Not a gamer...north is not a thing.
If my starlink speed today was 6meg I wouldn't know the difference.
How do low meg numbers affect you? They don't seem to affect me or my 70ish echo/Alexa devices.
I ask because maybe there is advsntage i am not aware of.
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10-05-2024, 03:59 PM
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#12
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Chateau 24F
State: Ohio
Posts: 5,035
THOR #16721
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So eating a big bowl of crow for breakfast this morning. I plopped the Mini dish in the middle of the backyard this morning. Ignored the alignment graphic in the app
First test pointing slightly southwest. Got consistently just over 100.
Second test pointing nearly straight up. Pretty much same result.
Third test aligned dish according to the app. Got speeds consistently in the 90s... SLOWER than when ignoring alignment.
My conclusion is that for roam to work properly, to require a specific aim in any direction would cripple the system. Since there is pretty much a blanket of satellites in every direction, when Starlink opened up the Roam plan the entire constellation was "unlocked". Therefore aiming according to the app is pointless... just find open sky and go.
Now excuse me while I wash these feathers out of my mouth.
P.S. Brother-in-law is between Ohio and Colorado testing his Gen 3 in the same manner. He's using the Roam unlimited plan. Will report when I hear back from him with results.
__________________
Be creative, and have a fun life...
...and don't be an @**hole! -Ken Block
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10-06-2024, 09:18 AM
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#13
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Quantum JM31
State: Tennessee
Posts: 961
THOR #21926
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MCP
Oops! I think I see the answer on the mount release. You (Bob) have the flat mount instead of the speed mount. I was wondering how easy it would be to unmount from the speed mount. The flat mount would be easy to unsnap.
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Yes, just reach up under the dish and pull down to move the two tabs down enough to allow the dish to move forward and push in the direction of the front of the motorhome.
As for plugging in the long cable I just use the main section of the bulkhead RJ-45 pass through connector I purchased but decided not to use. In the minds eye planning stages of this project I had planned to mount a bulk head pass through connector somewhere near the outside television to plug the long cable into. After thinking about the fact that I would still need to go up on the roof to detach the dish and bring it down decided that was silly and eliminated the ground accesable RJ-45 from my plans.
__________________
Bob
2022 Quantum JM31
2023 Colorado Z71
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10-07-2024, 03:08 PM
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#14
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Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Omni RS36
State: California
Posts: 59
THOR #30872
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Great discussion, I have learned a lot. Does anyone agree with me on the idea of removing the Winegard and placing the Starlink in it's place? After seeing this discussion, it seems plausible? I also have another question, I have the "Roam" or "Mini" or something. I'm not sure if "Mini" is the dish and "Roam" is the service, but I have been wanting to get a pole mount for it. Does the "Gen 3" pole mounts work with the what I have? Thanks
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10-07-2024, 03:12 PM
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#15
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It's 'towed', not toad.
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2018 24.1 AXISSIXxSIX
State: Arizona
Posts: 8,443
THOR #13932
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Perfectly plausible.
If you're handy a soup can and a $4 tin shear(scissors)should make your adapter in just very few minutes.
Once you Eyeball it all,
Finding and placing a ladder should be the longest step in the process.
(Soup cans provide the very best tin for jobs like this. HardWood will work as well if it suits you or the job better)
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10-07-2024, 03:30 PM
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#16
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Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Omni RS36
State: California
Posts: 59
THOR #30872
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ducksface
Perfectly plausible.
If you're handy a soup can and a $4 tin shear(scissors)should make your adapter in just very few minutes.
Once you Eyeball it all,
Finding and placing a ladder should be the longest step in the process.
(Soup cans provide the very best tin for jobs like this. HardWood will work as well if it suits you or the job better)
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Duck, was your can idea for the pole mount or to make an adapter for to replace the Winegard?
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10-07-2024, 03:35 PM
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#17
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It's 'towed', not toad.
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2018 24.1 AXISSIXxSIX
State: Arizona
Posts: 8,443
THOR #13932
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For the winegard adapter.
Mount the can(or a flat piece of the tin you salvage from the can) to the starlink then bend/cut to fit the winegard mount.
I'd try that first since it's clean and easy and requires no pole or pole mount or where to mount a pole.
My booster is mounted to my roof ladder by u bolts.
If you post pics of the winegard mount and the back of the starlink we can as a group design your mount.
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10-07-2024, 04:34 PM
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#18
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Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Omni RS36
State: California
Posts: 59
THOR #30872
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ducksface
For the winegard adapter.
Mount the can(or a flat piece of the tin you salvage from the can) to the starlink then bend/cut to fit the winegard mount.
I'd try that first since it's clean and easy and requires no pole or pole mount or where to mount a pole.
My booster is mounted to my roof ladder by u bolts.
If you post pics of the winegard mount and the back of the starlink we can as a group design your mount.
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I'll get some pictures when I get chance to get to the RV. I could, probably make this myself. I would just use some aluminum. I emailed the company that makes the Trio Flatmount to see if this is something they would want to do. I'm pretty sure I could buy and make an adapter using one of their current mounts. I'm still a little concerned about how to power it. Looks like the Winegard only used a 3 amp fuse so I'm going to assume that the wires are on the small side. I'm not sure I can simply use those wires, but I might be able to since the voltage is a bit higher from the Stalink powersupply.
The Wingard manual is here https://winegard.com/content/pdf/2452403.pdf
As you can see, it's only four mounting screws that I would have to make the adpter too.
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10-13-2024, 05:44 PM
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#19
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: New York
Posts: 166
THOR #21937
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It's raining outside so I'm not going on the roof to take pics but here is my setup and how I did it:
- My coach is a 1995 so I'm not sure if what I had was Wineguard or some other brand but there was a TV antenna up there. I took it down and removed every trace of it, both top and bottom (i.e. inside the coach).
- That left me with a decent sized hole in the roof. So I went to Lowes and bought a PVC kit to mount a toilet drain. This requires a helper to install since one person must be on the roof and the other inside the coach.
- The flat plate is inside the coach while the part the the toilet would normally mount to is up on the roof.
- (Note: PVC is not UV stable, so I painted the exposed parts with roof sealant.)
- The Starlink "leg" will drop right down through this hole. I wrap a piece of old bicycle inner tube around it to keep out water leaks. Then I attach U-bolts top and bottom to hold the dish in place.
- Bonus: The toilet drain mount is just standard 2" PVC. So I also have a 5ish foot length of 2" PVC, a 2"-1.5" adapter and a 6ish foot length of 1.5" PVC. When combined with four lengths of 3/16" stainless steel wire that attach to eye bolts installed at points along the roofline, I can raise the Starlink dish about 11 feet above my roofline. (It's on the tower right now as I'm butted up against a two-story house and need the height gain to avoid the house obstructing dishy's view of the passing satellites.)
I've been using this setup for about two years and never had a problem. Most of the time, dishy is mounted directly to the toilet drain, pretty much right on the roof. Other than the hassle of having to manually raise and lower the tower, and being able to see about a foot of cable on the ceiling there it comes in, this is a workable solution.
__________________
1995 Thor Columbus 325
Full-timer
Digital nomad
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10-14-2024, 07:55 AM
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#20
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Senior Member
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Quantum JM31
State: Tennessee
Posts: 961
THOR #21926
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From what I have read here and other sites it seems the Gen 3 Starlink is quite forgiving of where and how it is mounted. One person had it on their porch and said it worked. Another inside their vehicle under the sun roof. One person said they just placed it in the bed of the truck as they were fleeing hurricane Milton.
__________________
Bob
2022 Quantum JM31
2023 Colorado Z71
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