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Old 05-31-2016, 12:52 PM   #21
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1
State: Michigan
Posts: 9,183
THOR #1150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chance
I don't even buy the idea that motorhomes have to be loaded down by the owner before the steering can be aligned. Sounds like a good theory, but I personally think it's mostly BS in order to shift the work to the owner. They should be aligned at time of delivery in my opinion.
I can see the logic in it: The bare frame is aligned at the factory and when you receive it it now has all the camper bits loaded on. Thus you'd want the alignment as best as possible so you'd want your stuff in it too.

The problem I see with that is: Compared to the overall weight of the camper; your stuff + fuel + water is a very small percentage and probably wouldn't have that much of an affect on the alignment.
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Old 05-31-2016, 02:00 PM   #22
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Brand: Still Looking
State: Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamieGeek View Post
I can see the logic in it: The bare frame is aligned at the factory and when you receive it it now has all the camper bits loaded on. Thus you'd want the alignment as best as possible so you'd want your stuff in it too.

The problem I see with that is: Compared to the overall weight of the camper; your stuff + fuel + water is a very small percentage and probably wouldn't have that much of an affect on the alignment.
I'm not talking about the bare stripped chassis, but the way the motorhome comes from Thor. They are the ones that "complete" the vehicle as sold, and should take care of alignment before it gets to customer.

The "weight added to a finished motorhome" argument is absurd in my opinion. My van weighed +/- 5,000 pounds empty and came aligned. And it can be loaded to nearly twice that weight without needing to be aligned again.

The same occurs if you buy a new ProMaster or Sprinter van. If you load 50% of their respective weight in them, the vans don't have to be realigned.

And the same with commercial trucks that can weigh twice as much full as empty. If they needed alignment full, how would they drive empty?

So now we have a finished 10,000-pound or more motorhome that "requires" about 10% weight added in order to get the alignment right?

I just don't see it other than for what it is. A new owner should never have to worry about getting his rig aligned on day one.
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Old 06-02-2016, 04:27 AM   #23
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Model: Dynamax REV 24 RB
State: Pennsylvania
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THOR #3069
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chance View Post
I'm not talking about the bare stripped chassis, but the way the motorhome comes from Thor. They are the ones that "complete" the vehicle as sold, and should take care of alignment before it gets to customer.

The "weight added to a finished motorhome" argument is absurd in my opinion. My van weighed +/- 5,000 pounds empty and came aligned. And it can be loaded to nearly twice that weight without needing to be aligned again.

The same occurs if you buy a new ProMaster or Sprinter van. If you load 50% of their respective weight in them, the vans don't have to be realigned.

And the same with commercial trucks that can weigh twice as much full as empty. If they needed alignment full, how would they drive empty?

So now we have a finished 10,000-pound or more motorhome that "requires" about 10% weight added in order to get the alignment right?

I just don't see it other than for what it is. A new owner should never have to worry about getting his rig aligned on day one.
You make a good argument on the alignment or lack of one. Some say that the suspension needs to "settle" so to wait until you have about 2500 miles on the odometer. I don't know if that is valid although I accepted it as true until I read your thoughts.
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Old 06-02-2016, 12:40 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Delco Bobby View Post
You make a good argument on the alignment or lack of one. Some say that the suspension needs to "settle" so to wait until you have about 2500 miles on the odometer. I don't know if that is valid although I accepted it as true until I read your thoughts.
I don't know what they mean specifically by "settle" so won't comment on that.

What I do know is that the suspension on Axis/Vegas is the same as Ford has used for decades on E-Series Super Duty vans. Its Twin I-beam front with coil springs and solid rear axle with leaf springs. It's also the same style as used on most F-Series Super Duty pickup trucks.

I've never heard of buyers of Ford vans or pickups being told that they needed to take their new vehicles home, load them, and then get them aligned. And what's different about motorhome suspensions that would not allow them to be aligned at some point prior to delivery?

What is happening with motorhome alignment doesn't make sense to me. That's just a personal opinion. Bottom line is the industry works the way it does, sells plenty of units, and makes lots of money in the process. As long as we keep buying what they make, under their terms and conditions, they have little reason to change. Our complaining isn't going to help so I'm going to stay out of this.
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Old 06-02-2016, 05:32 PM   #25
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Amen Chance!!! You are hitting one of my "You Got To Be Sh***ing Me" buttons. I've never understood this initial realignment - I'll call it "urban legend" for lack of anything better. I'm NOT disputing the experience of many owners that did have to have an alignment because their coach was way off, BUT...

These E-350/E-450 chassis sit under ambulances, delivery vans, refrigerator trucks, fire/rescue trucks, short school buses, etc. I can't understand if it was aligned by Ford before it left the factory, why isn't that alignment good across the entire range of the specification of GCWR? Do I rush my car in for a realignment when I load within 10 lbs of its GCWR? Do all these businesses with E-350/E-450 chassis run to the alignment shop when their vehicle is fully loaded, then emptied, then loaded again, ad infinitum?

If I were cynical I'd say that if you need an alignment on your new motorhome there's a good chance that it was not aligned properly before leaving the Ford factory. If it was aligned, then the motorhome factory did something to the suspension system to knock it out of alignment and they should be responsible for realigning the suspension.
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Old 06-02-2016, 05:40 PM   #26
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Model: Hurricane 27K
State: Nevada
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I owned a tire and front end shop for many years, our alignment machine could handle 18 wheelers and we aligned plenty of logging trucks, motorhomes and cars. It was not uncommon to see cars come in with irregular worn tires with few miles on it, I just figured they did not get aligned right at the factory. My motorhome had the same issue, it was toed out 5/8 in. When it was delivered to me. The amount of extra stuff you are going to put inside your RV is minuscule to the total weight of it at delivery. Let's go back to the logging trucks, they were always empty or full, so 1/2 the miles were empty, the other 1/2 they had 80,000 pounds loaded coming from the woods going to the mills. So in the "Thor theory" those tires should have basically shredded because of all that extra weight. guess what, they did not. As posted these large trucks run around full or empty and it does not affect the alignment much. Bottom line the factory or dealers don't give a crap if the alignment is good and they are trying to pass that off on the buyer. Don't take delivery until you see a print out of the alignment to make sure it is OK. I am not saying every single motorhome sold has an alignment problem, but why take the chance.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chance View Post
I'm not talking about the bare stripped chassis, but the way the motorhome comes from Thor. They are the ones that "complete" the vehicle as sold, and should take care of alignment before it gets to customer.

The "weight added to a finished motorhome" argument is absurd in my opinion. My van weighed +/- 5,000 pounds empty and came aligned. And it can be loaded to nearly twice that weight without needing to be aligned again.

The same occurs if you buy a new ProMaster or Sprinter van. If you load 50% of their respective weight in them, the vans don't have to be realigned.

And the same with commercial trucks that can weigh twice as much full as empty. If they needed alignment full, how would they drive empty?

So now we have a finished 10,000-pound or more motorhome that "requires" about 10% weight added in order to get the alignment right?

I just don't see it other than for what it is. A new owner should never have to worry about getting his rig aligned on day one.
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Old 06-03-2016, 11:26 PM   #27
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Model: Dynamax REV 24 RB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petef View Post
I owned a tire and front end shop for many years, our alignment machine could handle 18 wheelers and we aligned plenty of logging trucks, motorhomes and cars. It was not uncommon to see cars come in with irregular worn tires with few miles on it, I just figured they did not get aligned right at the factory. My motorhome had the same issue, it was toed out 5/8 in. When it was delivered to me. The amount of extra stuff you are going to put inside your RV is minuscule to the total weight of it at delivery. Let's go back to the logging trucks, they were always empty or full, so 1/2 the miles were empty, the other 1/2 they had 80,000 pounds loaded coming from the woods going to the mills. So in the "Thor theory" those tires should have basically shredded because of all that extra weight. guess what, they did not. As posted these large trucks run around full or empty and it does not affect the alignment much. Bottom line the factory or dealers don't give a crap if the alignment is good and they are trying to pass that off on the buyer. Don't take delivery until you see a print out of the alignment to make sure it is OK. I am not saying every single motorhome sold has an alignment problem, but why take the chance.
peter, that sounds like the final and definitive answer. Thanks.
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Old 06-04-2016, 12:33 AM   #28
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: windsport 27k
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Love your purchase tactics,I do believe we shall try your methods on next purchase.one question do turn in an existing rv or sell it yourself?
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Old 06-04-2016, 03:45 AM   #29
vkb
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1 KC's Big Box
State: Kansas
Posts: 2,112
THOR #3510
alignment

Ed ... Ron agrees with your approach. He DID have the alignment done as he did not like the 'play' in the steering wheel. With that said...his front end man told him, after he aligned it...to drive it...break it in...and if he wants it fine tuned he would do so at no extra charge. We are on the road right now and had some ferocious side winds and the Axis has done well. The big box does catch the wind..more so than our previous motorhomes and does take getting used to.
Ron does not feel the stabilizer bar is necessary for us.

I suppose each individual has a comfort zone and you must do what makes you comfortable.

Enjoy ! and happy camping !!

WE LOVE OUR AXIS !!
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