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Old 08-25-2019, 09:28 PM   #1
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: Quebec
Posts: 45
THOR #15335
rear awning barely holding

hello,
I have a Thor 4 winds Sprinter C 24 HL. The rear slide out has a awning and on one of the hinges that hold the awning on the rear wall , 4 out of 5 screws are broken. How do you fix ? move the hinge an inch and re drill ? I'm not sure how to handle this one. An insight appreciated. Regards,

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Old 08-25-2019, 09:50 PM   #2
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Model: Hurricane 29M
State: Texas
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THOR #11781
Can you get the broken/old screws out? If you can, fill the holes with epoxy and re-drill for same size screw. That's what I would do. If they break again, I might go up a size with higher grade screws. I would also check the operation of the slide and topper to make sure nothing is amiss.
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Old 08-25-2019, 09:52 PM   #3
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Model: 2018 24.1 AXISSIXxSIX
State: Arizona
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THOR #13932
This is such a basic bit of knowledge to have acquired throughout life that answering you by providing a solution might be detrimental.
I suggest you take it to someone familiar with the basics.

I'm not beating you up, I'm trying to save you from the damage you might do.
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Old 08-26-2019, 05:27 PM   #4
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Vegas 27.7
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THOR #10907
Even someone "familiar with the basics" would have trouble with this situation. If that slide topper is like the Carefree ones on my Vegas, they're a disaster waiting to happen.

This is a heads up for ANYONE with Carefree slide toppers or awnings.

On our last trip the rear slide started making a snapping noise when moving in or out. I had my wife put the slide in while I was outside looking for what was making the noise. As she was running the slide back in, the topper front cap fell off and landed at my feet! The screws had fallen out, if it hadn't fallen off right then, it could have easily fallen off on the highway and gone through somebody's windshield. Or worse, the entire topper could have come off since at that point IT WAS HELD ON WITH ONE SCREW. The front and rear caps only have two screws, one into the bracket and one into the topper roller. Either one of those falls out and the topper will no longer be attached to the RV at that end. (You still have the fabric itself of course, but there isn't any set screws holding the fabric in the RV channel so you can easily slide it right off.)

The screws in the caps aren't the only design problems either, which is probably what cladouce is talking about. I'm assuming he's talking about the brackets that hold the topper to the slideout. On the Carefree's that are on our Vegas, there are 6 screws in each bracket going into the slide. A few months ago I noticed several of the screw heads were missing. The screw heads had snapped off. I replaced almost all of the screws in those brackets with larger screws.

Fast forward months later to when the topper end cap fell off... I went to take the brackets off and found that 7 screws were broken. Almost all of the broken screws were on the bottom row of the brackets. Even a few of the larger screws I had just put in were broken. That tells me that there is excessive force from the slide fabric tension pulling on the brackets, trying to rip them off the slides. The brackets are simply shaped wrong. Instead of being wide across and short vertically, they should be much longer vertically to have better leverage against the twisting forces. Basically just a bad design.

How to fix it? The same way I fixed the main awning on our Vegas when half the screws on the brackets pulled out and the awning started tipping super low on one side. (The Vegas 27.7 has I believe the longest awning Carefree makes, it's 20 feet long. Think about the forces a 20 foot awning would have on it when extended.) I removed all the screws, cleaned the surfaces of the RV side and the brackets, coated them with marine epoxy (3M 5200 slow cure) and then riveted the brackets on with 1/4" x 1.5" steel rivets. The epoxy over that amount of surface area will absolutely help hold the bracket to the body of the RV, and the steel rivets are a better solution into the thin steel plate and aluminum tubing than trying to screw into it.

I would probably do the same with my slide toppers, IF I were going to put them back on, which I am not. The fewer poorly attached, big, heavy items that can fall off my RV and cause a highway pileup and possible deaths, the better.
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Old 08-26-2019, 09:48 PM   #5
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: Quebec
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THOR #15335
Quote:
Originally Posted by ducksface View Post
This is such a basic bit of knowledge to have acquired throughout life that answering you by providing a solution might be detrimental.
I suggest you take it to someone familiar with the basics.

I'm not beating you up, I'm trying to save you from the damage you might do.
I do not believe you understand the problem correctly.
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Old 08-26-2019, 09:54 PM   #6
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: Quebec
Posts: 45
THOR #15335
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmtech16450yz View Post
Even someone "familiar with the basics" would have trouble with this situation. If that slide topper is like the Carefree ones on my Vegas, they're a disaster waiting to happen.

This is a heads up for ANYONE with Carefree slide toppers or awnings.

On our last trip the rear slide started making a snapping noise when moving in or out. I had my wife put the slide in while I was outside looking for what was making the noise. As she was running the slide back in, the topper front cap fell off and landed at my feet! The screws had fallen out, if it hadn't fallen off right then, it could have easily fallen off on the highway and gone through somebody's windshield. Or worse, the entire topper could have come off since at that point IT WAS HELD ON WITH ONE SCREW. The front and rear caps only have two screws, one into the bracket and one into the topper roller. Either one of those falls out and the topper will no longer be attached to the RV at that end. (You still have the fabric itself of course, but there isn't any set screws holding the fabric in the RV channel so you can easily slide it right off.)

The screws in the caps aren't the only design problems either, which is probably what cladouce is talking about. I'm assuming he's talking about the brackets that hold the topper to the slideout. On the Carefree's that are on our Vegas, there are 6 screws in each bracket going into the slide. A few months ago I noticed several of the screw heads were missing. The screw heads had snapped off. I replaced almost all of the screws in those brackets with larger screws.

Fast forward months later to when the topper end cap fell off... I went to take the brackets off and found that 7 screws were broken. Almost all of the broken screws were on the bottom row of the brackets. Even a few of the larger screws I had just put in were broken. That tells me that there is excessive force from the slide fabric tension pulling on the brackets, trying to rip them off the slides. The brackets are simply shaped wrong. Instead of being wide across and short vertically, they should be much longer vertically to have better leverage against the twisting forces. Basically just a bad design.

How to fix it? The same way I fixed the main awning on our Vegas when half the screws on the brackets pulled out and the awning started tipping super low on one side. (The Vegas 27.7 has I believe the longest awning Carefree makes, it's 20 feet long. Think about the forces a 20 foot awning would have on it when extended.) I removed all the screws, cleaned the surfaces of the RV side and the brackets, coated them with marine epoxy (3M 5200 slow cure) and then riveted the brackets on with 1/4" x 1.5" steel rivets. The epoxy over that amount of surface area will absolutely help hold the bracket to the body of the RV, and the steel rivets are a better solution into the thin steel plate and aluminum tubing than trying to screw into it.

I would probably do the same with my slide toppers, IF I were going to put them back on, which I am not. The fewer poorly attached, big, heavy items that can fall off my RV and cause a highway pileup and possible deaths, the better.

You are correct . You better described the problem. I also found that the type of steel used for the screws were of a weak steel. Much weaker than SS. A trusted mechanic indicated that the torque used to initially screw the drill screws in were much higher than rated for and were probably broken day one. Thank you for the complete analysis . Very constructive.
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Old 08-26-2019, 11:12 PM   #7
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Vegas 27.7
State: California
Posts: 289
THOR #10907
Quote:
Originally Posted by cladouce View Post
You are correct . You better described the problem. I also found that the type of steel used for the screws were of a weak steel. Much weaker than SS. A trusted mechanic indicated that the torque used to initially screw the drill screws in were much higher than rated for and were probably broken day one. Thank you for the complete analysis . Very constructive.
That's exactly what I thought when I first saw the broken screws. Naturally it had to be a Thor assembly issue right? haha. I figured the guy putting them in just snapped them off and instead of trying to drill them out, just stuck the heads in the holes with some sealer.

Two reasons why I don't believe they were installed incorrectly or broken during assembly...

The first is that the ones I put in ALSO broke, even though they were larger screws and properly installed.

The second is the fact that almost all of the broken ones are in the lower edge of the brackets. That lower edge is where the pulling force on the screws would be. The upper screws would have more compression on them and would be less likely to snap the heads off, simply because of the way the bracket would want to bend or torque.

I just wanted to make that clear. In this case, I don't think Thor did anything wrong in the assembly. It's just a poor design on Carefree's part. Here's a good analogy... Your foot is easy to roll over sideways because it's narrow and long. That's what the force on these brackets are like. If they simply made the brackets square, they would have much more resistance to tipping when the topper fabric is pulling on it.

If you guys do find broken screws in yours, I'd replace them with larger SS screws and I'd probably add two more on that bottom row so there's 5 across the bottom of the bracket. Either that or like I said, marine epoxy and steel rivets would also work. Or even better, go crazy and weld larger plates on the brackets and then rivet that to the slide. Like I mentioned, my slide toppers and brackets are going in my storage shed.
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