Refridge

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Pete'sMH

It’s a fairly easy mod to put your fridge on an inverter. Especially if you already have one. Just run some 15/2 Romex to the outlet that powers your fridge - its outside behind the vent/access panel. If you have an ATS so much the better. The fridge draws 3-4 amps so it’s not difficult to cover that with solar but, of course, night and rainy days are a problem unless you have a big battery bank. I don’t boondock much but I prefer to drive with the propane off at the tank. My ATS switches to shore power as soon as I plug in so it pretty much of a no brainer in practice. If you don’t already have an inverter it’s easy to install one. Just remember to locate it as close to the battery as possible and use the appropriate size wire.

x1000

We actually have the ATS switch installed on our inverter; so it is automatic, but I don't tell that to family or DW. We have an Inverter remote switch inside on main electrical panel that has Green LED On when Inverter's power Switch is on (regardless if the AC feed bypass is activated or not). I try not to confuse the DW. It is all so simple. I am like you and do not wish to travel with propane on. But full disclosure; I ran propane on every trip prior to this mod to keep the fridge on if the genset was not running. It is akin to the fact that I do not like riding my Harley down 635 LBJ Freeway during rush hour, but I will do it if I need to go somewhere. My crowing about this mod is to only point out that I don't need to use propane while driving anymore, not that anyone that may be running propane while driving is doing something wrong.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Bob Denman

Maybe you could share them with the rest of us...

Ah HA!!! I knew it... that explains a lot of things

[Bob Denman]

[Chateau_Nomad]

DKoldman: Where do I go to get the free Solar? It is a hefty investment.

I pay $1.99 - $2.58 per gallon for propane as an Alternative Fuel at any of our local U Haul Dealers. I have never had to purchase propane on a trip (yet) The only way I can get ANY relevant propane usage is when I need heat in freezing temperatures (don't think solar can run my heater?). I can go several months and all summer maybe longer with just fridge & hot water off one propane tank $18.

If you own a genny, by recommended procedure; you must run it and in most cases you can't run it enough (100 - 150hrs / year) to keep it working in optimum condition. I would rather run 2 hours a day on a boondocked trip with immediate power; than leave it idle the entire time relying on weather and all day Solar to recharge me. I get and admire those that wish to be [/B]Green,[B] but think it comes with some costs and some limitations as Solar is not free.

Well, generators aren't free either! And I'm guessing any generator costs just a tad more than my $300 200 watt solar installation.

But my point is I'm not powering a city here... I just need enough juice to run an RV refrigerator. So... after that initial investment of $300 on that solar equipment, the electricity generated by it is indeed FREE... no? I haven't received a bill from anyone yet. However, I already paid for my generator AND propane tank... and to use those "appliances" I keep getting pestered by people wanting my hard earned money to REFUEL them!! Come to think of it, I thought I owned my house free and clear... but I keep getting pestered by TAX collectors!

I'm sitting here watching my RV charge it's batteries - and I haven't had to put a drop of gas in those solar panels!! Well, they DO take a nap at night... but they just wake up next morning and go to work again... in my world that's FREE energy!


Back to the affordable inverter for fridge use only...
I do not have an existing inverter, so this would be an install primarily for the refrigerator only. It could be a convenience to briefly power a laptop or low power device, but PRIMARY use would be for the refrigerator. If amp draw is low enough, I would leave it running here in the back yard for an occasional back-up fridge, or between trips to avoid unloading it completely.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Chateau_Nomad

Well, generators aren't free either! And I'm guessing any generator costs just a tad more than my $300 200 watt solar installation.

I agree, and point of clarification; I never said or implied that generators or propane were free. I actually stated where they cost money. I just do not agree with the premise that solar is free.

But my point is I'm not powering a city here... I just need enough juice to run an RV refrigerator. So... after that initial investment of $300 on that solar equipment, the electricity generated by it is indeed FREE... no?

Using the sun as an energy source is free, a solar system is NOT free IMO. For the record I think it is the Lithium users that may be looking to power a city, and they are primarily Solar users.

If the only intent is power the fridge as you state, I can take $200 of your $300 investment and run my fridge off propane for 10 years or more producing 30% ROI. For the record; I have no solar, no prewired solar, or anything; so I doubt I could have solar for $300 anyway. I will likely invest in Lithium batteries before buying a Solar system, or maybe buy a new RV that may happen to come with Solar. But if I had solar today, nothing I do today would change, except at 6:00PM when genset came on to top off the batteries; it may already be fully charged or not? But for sure 100% of the time at 8:00 PM; I am at max capacity 125ahs; which I am today

I haven't received a bill from anyone yet. However, I already paid for my generator AND propane tank... and to use those "appliances" I keep getting pestered by people wanting my hard earned money to REFUEL them!!

Using your logic, I can run my Norcold fridge up to 24 hours off my AGM battery, after my initial investment that energy source is always free. When batteries charged down to 60% capacity (not 50%) I shut them down or allow generator to start. If I wanted to; I could switch to propane and pay pennies just to keep fridge running, but as I have stated before, given that I have an Onan 5500 generator, and given that I must run it as much as I can ( I am a by the book kind of guy), I prefer to run it two hours every day; and while doing so; my batteries are topped off and the cycle repeats.

Let me ask the question this way, do you ever run your Genny, and if so when? Doesn't it power your charger to top off batteries too? We do the same thing, but mine is simply on a programmed schedule by AGS. For last two months 12.7 vdc is the lowest I have seen and it is typically on 12.9vdc when genset is off and no shore power.

I'm sitting here watching my RV charge it's batteries - and I haven't had to put a drop of gas in those solar panels!! Well, they DO take a nap at night... but they just wake up next morning and go to work again... in my world that's FREE energy!


See above, I think the lowest I have seen my new batteries get to us 12.7 vdc with normal items in usage. Regardless of vDC level, if boondocking my genset will come on at 6:00PM and run for two hours (Quiet time starts at 8:00 PM for us) and top off my batteries, I am good for the night.

What you may be missing is EVEN IF I HAD SOLAR; I would want to run my Genny 2 hrs each day when boondocking. Given that it is going to run, I don't need Solar short of movement toward Green. If you took away the genny; say assume I was down to 1/4 tank of gas remaining, then I could switch to propane and pay pennies to run fridge.

Back to the affordable inverter for fridge use only...
I do not have an existing inverter, so this would be an install primarily for the refrigerator only. It could be a convenience to briefly power a laptop or low power device, but PRIMARY use would be for the refrigerator. If amp draw is low enough, I would leave it running here in the back yard for an occasional back-up fridge, or between trips to avoid unloading it completely.

So now I am confused, if you do not have a Inverter now, how are you running your fridge off solar energy? Or, are you saying that currently your solar is ONLY to top off batteries, and you are looking to buy Inverter; so you may run the fridge? If it is the latter, remember the intent of my rewired Norcold fridge to run off the Inverter was for Driving only so again no Solar needed because of the Engine's Alternator. So I don't confuse, I have two refrigerators. One (Insignia) was wired to run off the Inverter by the factory, but it use almost nothing to run. Before I got my new 125ah AGM batteries, believe it or not; if we stayed up late with two TVs and outside kitchen fridge on, it could get dicey if we could make it to 8:00 AM the next morning before the batteries drained. And that was with batteries topped of at 8:00 PM the night before. Even Solar could not have fixed that problem

[Connie Ahlman]

We had trouble in our previous travel trailer with the propane flame blowing out as we went down the road. The dealer got the baffle readjusted so the flame wasn’t blown out enroute. We have not had a problem with our Vegas refrigerator propane being blown out enroute. We do shut off the refrigerator while filling the engine gas tank, as per directions in the refrigerator manual. For safety, similar to not running the engine of any vehicle while filling the gas tank. I have a remote sensor in the refrigerator and one in the freezer, so it reminds me if the temps go up that I might have forgotten to turn the refrigerator back on!

[Gulo]

If you're interested in using your RV batteries for your fridge full time, I suggest checking out JC Refrigeration in Shipshewana, IN. They will ship a DIY kit to you for 12 volt only if you wish or install it for you. I have an appointment in October to convert from propane/110 only to 12 volt via lithium battery. Their website is https://jc-refrigeration.com.


Best Wishes,




2012 THOR Four Winds 23U
4 Rich Solar 170w panels
3 Battleborn batteries 100 amp hour

[VegasinDallas]

I have also driven with my fridge on propane. I have installed "Fridge Defend" to protect it from overheating if it is un-level for an extended period of time.
https://www.arprv.com/products.php
The flame is small and I have a reminder on my fuel cap to turn it off before pumping.
I am in the process of installing an inverter. I used a watt meter for a couple of days with only my fringe running (parked in my driveway on shore power).
Peak while running was about 330 watts and the average over 2 days was 100 watts/hr. I opened it a couple of times each day to mimic use.
Even after I install the inverter I will have no issue running it on propane.

[Chateau_Nomad]

I also roll with the fridge on propane. The "risk" I've heard associated with having "charged propane lines" in your RV is in case of and accident or a road hazard rupturing a gas line.

The reason I'm not too concerned about that risk is the propane is flowing on the low pressure side of the regulator. A ruptured propane line OUTDOORS will most likely self-vent and disperse quickly. The mercaptan smell is easy to detect. Now... having an open flame at a gas station is nuts... so we kill the fridge there.

I do not currently have an inverter. I have a small solar install on the roof of 200 watts. While driving, those panels together with the coach alternator pump PLENTY of juice to prevent a critical battery discharge scenario. If I had an inverter, it's a no-brainer... no need to even think about it.

[Bill Johnson]

Originally Posted by Chateau_Nomad

I have the standard class C absorption (AC/propane) and have been using propane while rolling. I was toying with the idea of running it off of a dedicated "affordable" inverter. Any specific instructions on doing that? Is it more of a PIA than it's worth? Solar on the roof is free to charge the batteries... propane ain't cheap... and extra gas running the genny... free sunshine wins.

By me a 20 lb tank for my grill is 12.99, I figured that was reasonable for approximately 4.6 gallons

[Bob Denman]

Originally Posted by Bill Johnson

By me a 20 lb tank for my grill is 12.99, I figured that was reasonable for approximately 4.6 gallons

$21.00 here; but I do agree!

[Bill Johnson]

Originally Posted by Bob Denman

$21.00 here; but I do agree!

We have a propane place by the house and they have great prices. Flying J by me was the same price as them last year, this year they are 15.18 for that much

[Chateau_Nomad]

Yep, propane is relatively dirt cheap where I live too. I think my 20# grill bottles cost around $10 to refill.

I recently added a propane quick connect to the RV. The less propane I use for the fridge is more I have for the grill!

I'm thinking a 1,000 watt inverter should be plenty for the fridge. My Prog. Industries power manager has an amperage display. Gonna test it in a couple days and see how much juice it draws...

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Bill Johnson

By me a 20 lb tank for my grill is 12.99, I figured that was reasonable for approximately 4.6 gallons

Yes sir. We have 3 tanks at the house, two are hooked up (Firepit & grill) and one a spare. I was looking to get one of those adapters so I could connect to the RV, but we never run out of propane. (it is full before any trip) We have 18 gal tank on RV; but I think it only takes 80% of that. We have a Grill connector outside next to the outdoor kitchen. I love the propane, stove, heat and hot water. Given that propane can freeze a refrigerator, I wonder why you can't have AC units that work of AC & Propane like the fridge?

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Chateau_Nomad

I'm thinking a 1,000 watt inverter should be plenty for the fridge. My Prog. Industries power manager has an amperage display. Gonna test it in a couple days and see how much juice it draws...

I agree, but if I was buying my own Inverter I would by 2,000 watt one. I only have 1,000 watts and the most I can recall was using about 600 watts? I have already checked with Magnum Energy who says if I ever wanted 2,000 watt there model is plug and play and they said the wiring to / from the batteries is more than adequate. But we just don't need, just a nice to have.

[Chateau_Nomad]

Originally Posted by dkoldman

...I wonder why you can't have AC units that work of AC & Propane like the fridge?

I had a gas fired home AC system in the first house we owned in the early 1980s in Columbus Ohio. They were evidently subsidized by the gas company as an incentive. They are stupid simple... the only moving part is a circulation pump to move the refrigerant (ammonia solution) from the outside unit to the cooling coils in the furnace. A gas fired box heated/pressurized the ammonia instead of an electric compressor. It's what they used in the old ice houses when people had ice boxes.

The "cool" thing was our unit was almost 30 years old... and still worked great! The gas company was the only service to be had... I think they had 3 guys left that worked on them. I think I paid $25 for service every spring... they would be out there for at least 4 hours hosing out the fins and testing for leaks. The unit had a valve to adjust coolant flow... it was big enough to cool a house twice the size of ours.

It eventually developed a leak... and that was it's death knell... no condenser coils existed for replacement.

Based on that, no doubt there could be engineered a propane AC unit for RV use... probably could run off of 12 volt. Someone with better knowledge of HVAC could probably answer that burning question...

[Wiley1]

Originally Posted by dkoldman

If you own a genny, by recommended procedure; you must run it and in most cases you can't run it enough (100 - 150hrs / year) to keep it working in optimum condition.

Since I installed my Aimscorp 2500W as a whole-house inverter/charger, I rarely run my generator anymore. In fact, I don't think I started it even once last season. The fridge is quite happy going down the road on 120vac and the Ford E450 alternator easily keeps up with the demand. The main propane valve stays off until we need to cook or heat water.

Today, after I read your post, I went through the manual for my Onan RV OH-4000 genset but I couldn't find anything that says it should be run 150 hours per year. I did find a bunch of maintenance items that are driven by run hours, so the more you run it, the more you will need to replace oil, plugs, spark arrester, and filters.

What possible harm could come from running my generator only an hour per month?

[chunker21]

Originally Posted by Wiley1

but I couldn't find anything that says it should be run 150 hours per year. I did find a bunch of maintenance items that are driven by run hours, so the more you run it, the more you will need to replace oil, plugs, spark arrester, and filters.

What possible harm could come from running my generator only an hour per month?

None in fact that's good for it. I can't quote you the source but the recommendation is run monthly for 30-60 minute with about 50% load. That exercises the system, gets the moisture out of the armature and electronics, and good for general health of the engine. Not running, especially a gasoline type, can hurt/clog the fuel system. Not so much an issue with propane or diesel.

EDIT found this for my series generator

3.14 Exercising the Genset
Exercise the genset at least 1 hour each month if use is infrequent. Run the genset at approximately 1/2 rated power. See LOADING THE GENSET(Section 3.6). A single exercise period is better than several shorter periods.
Exercising a genset drives off moisture, re-lubricates the engine, replaces stale fuel in fuel lines and carburetor and removes oxides from electrical contacts and generator slip rings. The result is better starting, more reliable operation and longer engine life.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Wiley1

Since I installed my Aimscorp 2500W as a whole-house inverter/charger, I rarely run my generator anymore. In fact, I don't think I started it even once last season. The fridge is quite happy going down the road on 120vac and the Ford E450 alternator easily keeps up with the demand. The main propane valve stays off until we need to cook or heat water.

I don't run my genset either when driving (unless I need AC), I have Inverter that is charged by the Alternator so we do the exact same thing here.

Today, after I read your post, I went through the manual for my Onan RV OH-4000 genset but I couldn't find anything that says it should be run 150 hours per year. I did find a bunch of maintenance items that are driven by run hours, so the more you run it, the more you will need to replace oil, plugs, spark arrester, and filters.


I think my quote was "by recommended procedure; you must run it and in most cases you can't run it enough (100 - 150hrs / year)" I never said anything about a manual. Recommended procedure I got was direct from Onan when I added the EC-30 After market option to my OEM factory coach. Per Onan they were adamant that the #1 cause of the generator failures were due to lack of use. The Onan Engineer went on to say there is also big difference of failures related to customers that have AGS and use it versus those that don't. So for me it is recommended by Onan to run it. Then I further stated that in most case you can't run it enough, i.e my EC -30 has recommended service interval at 150 hours. I feel as I use my genny all the time but I will never get that on a yearly basis. I average around 75 / hrs per year which is 6.25 hrs / month.

What possible harm could come from running my generator only an hour per month?

I have no idea of any specific harm for 1/hr per month. Just what I stated above. I read all kinds of things about gensets from posters; the so call green monsters as they call it . I use my AGS all the time. Thus far I have yet to ever need to even prime my genset. But back to the 100 - 150 target (for me); I service my genset every year regardless of hours; so in a way; I try to get over 100 hrs but under 150 in one's year time to get the most value out of my oil, filter and air filter. That is what I consider optimum.

Note: The built in service level and reminder in my AGS EC-30 is 150 hours, so that is where that number comes from.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by chunker21

[/COLOR]

None in fact that's good for it. I can't quote you the source but the recommendation is run monthly for 30-60 minute with about 50% load. That exercises the system, gets the moisture out of the armature and electronics, and good for general health of the engine. Not running, especially a gasoline type, can hurt/clog the fuel system. Not so much an issue with propane or diesel.

EDIT found this for my series generator

3.14 Exercising the Genset
Exercise the genset at least 1 hour each month if use is infrequent. Run the genset at approximately 1/2 rated power. See LOADING THE GENSET(Section 3.6). A single exercise period is better than several shorter periods.
Exercising a genset drives off moisture, re-lubricates the engine, replaces stale fuel in fuel lines and carburetor and removes oxides from electrical contacts and generator slip rings. The result is better starting, more reliable operation and longer engine life.

I average 6.25 hrs/month and I never run it just for the purpose of so call exercising. My RV is never stored. I am using it to run my ACs when hot and to recharge my batteries if boondocking. If I could get up to at least 8.33/mo I would be happier.