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Old 08-17-2018, 10:12 PM   #41
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I honestly don't think the small incremental drop downs or "drop ups" of 2-4" create that much of an issue. In the case of the accident I outlined above, the guy was using an 8" drop down...that's a lot!!! Plus, who knows the actual weight of trailer, actual hitch weight he was carrying or the capacity as it related to the trailer hitch itself. I'm sure the lawyers and the engineers drawn into the suit know. My intent in the post was to have whatever modifications you have to make inspected...especially if it seems to go beyond what we would think as normal and minor.
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Old 08-17-2018, 10:52 PM   #42
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I agree: the more of a drop or rise you have: the more it will affect the situation...
But 2" to 4" either way; shouldn't be a problem!
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Old 08-17-2018, 11:01 PM   #43
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What are your thoughts on weight in a cargo carrier? Mine is carrying a pair of mopeds which along with the carrier itself probably weigh about 300 pounds. The hitch rating is 500 pounds but my carrier is carrying the weight a good 3ft or more out. Itís like a huge drop or a long breaker bar on a wrench. Does anyone suppose I might have a problem?
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Old 08-17-2018, 11:35 PM   #44
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While I have no hard facts, or even anecdotal evidence for you: those things just have to put stresses on a hitch, that they never were designed for.
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Old 08-17-2018, 11:43 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Mustang46555 View Post
OK, here a twist. I just double checked the 8000 lb hitch on our Quantum class C.
To get the Road Master towbar level when hooked to an '05 Liberty I have a 2 1/2" RISER. So my added force is two and a half inches above the receiver center line. How does that effect the failure potential? Looking at the side plates on my hitch they appear almost double the thickness of those in the pictures and the bends have a large very noticeable radius to them. I wish there was a formula to multiply drop or rise by and subtract from the rated weight to get an idea where the safe range is. But I'm not smart enough to create it, any mechanical engineers in the crowd?

What you have sounds a lot better to me, but I’d have to see pictures to confirm it’s significantly better. The Devil is in the details as they say.

Keep in mind that these failures have occurred at receiver-to-chassis connection elevation, which is significantly higher than where the receiver centerline is on the receivers in question (not all receivers are built the same).

A 6” drop may extend total moment arm to close to 12” (more or less — would have to be measured), whereas your 2-1/2 riser would result in a moment arm of around 4” (again, would need to be measured). So yeah, I can see how it would be a lot better if your information is accurate and everything else is equal.

Just my 2 cents ....


P.S. — A simple formula as you mention is a bad idea in my opinion. There are too many variables to consider, which would lead to misuse. Perhaps the motorhome’s manufacturer could publish a maximum toad weight as a function of hitch drop (assuming level tow bar). That would shift responsibility to engineers at Thor and away from consumers who may not understand the physics involved. And in fairness, it’s not a simple problem to analyze.
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Old 08-18-2018, 12:39 AM   #46
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Find a farm equipment repair or a welding/fabricating shop..small farm towns have these. and have them build you one that is hell for stout..
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Old 08-18-2018, 03:47 AM   #47
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Pete...several hitch companies state any extension of a hitch will reduce the capacity by 50%. Hitches are rated at a distance of 4" from end of receiver tube. You.may be pushing the outer limit.
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Old 08-18-2018, 09:01 AM   #48
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The Vegas we have uses a 2" drop on hitch. The Suburban I previously used has a 6" drop.

One thing I do check for when setting up/selecting drop for hitch is does braking or acceleration cause rear of tow vehicle to lift or squat at all? That may be source of forces tearing these hitches apart. Looking for lift/squat may be tougher on a motorhome. Was easy on everything else I have used for towing.

I still have Suburban as backup to tow racecar and had to add airbags to get hitch height back to original. 8 year old rear coil springs were sagging.

Hitch issues scare hell out of me. I check everything visually before, during and after any trip. I also check attachment bolt tension quarterly. There were 2 bolts missing on mine. I put ones in when I bought it.
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Old 08-18-2018, 02:17 PM   #49
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If your serious to eliminate the issue it appears this is the way to go if u have a larger drop. I saw this on a super raised Dodge diesel pickup truck yesterday and stopped and asked them. Looks like it could solve the issue for some.


https://www.bulletproofhitches.com/p...abilizer-bars/
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Old 08-18-2018, 02:31 PM   #50
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Bud...
Now I admit to knowing as much about proper hitch design; as Hogs do about the Sabbath...

But to me: that ingenious contraption looks about like adding more Band-Aids, to a severed aorta...

I guess that I'd rather just keep things as simple as possible...
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Old 08-18-2018, 03:02 PM   #51
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I understand Bob. I stated before that I'm not an engineer but the braces appear to relieve the leverage issues and transfers the push to the framework where maybe it should be.
But a couple things: 1. )Bullitproof has al least put their name on the line and that gives them some responsibility as to the design and built. 2.)With all the options we, RV owners have available and the industry is telling us to make the decision of 8-12 inch drops and we're suppose to know what we are doing???

99% of RV users probably never considered the drop issues or they wouldn't understand it even if they had. Too many variables for a lay person to decide. U have Thor w a 30" high hitch, u have the hitch whatever size, receiver bar w drops and rises, then throw in Blue OX/Roadmaster and their requirements, which tow bar, brake systems, lighting etc. Lots of variables!!!

I agree w everyone on this as this is a serious issue that needs looked at. And Bullitproof may or may not be an viable option. I just saw it and threw it out there. But it's still a shame a family lost their life because of it. Once that happens and ur aware of it, now u just took on some more responsibility of not allowing to happen on your setup!!! I have a Blue Ox 4" drop only and not super concerned but if I had more I'd seriously consider this an option but I would ask for advice first. I'm not an engineer but doesn't mean I don't know plenty of them for advice!!! Thx Dennis.
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Old 08-18-2018, 03:11 PM   #52
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I see your point:
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Old 08-18-2018, 04:07 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Denman View Post
I'm guessing that almost everybody who is towing; needs to use a "goose neck" hitch.
What sort of reinforcements can be done to the the hardware, in order to take this into account?
What are you a "goose neck hitch"? A goose neck hitch is similar to a fifth wheel hitch in that it moves the connection point to over the rear axles in a pickup truck. You can't use a goose neck hitch on a motorhome in most cases and if you did it would transfer a lot more of the torsional stress to the goose neck itself.

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Old 08-18-2018, 04:57 PM   #54
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That's just the term that I grew up around, when folks talked about hitches used to raise or lower the connection points...
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Old 08-18-2018, 09:39 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by The Gritz Carlton View Post
Pete...several hitch companies state any extension of a hitch will reduce the capacity by 50%. Hitches are rated at a distance of 4" from end of receiver tube. You.may be pushing the outer limit.


That makes sense to me. I looked at the installation instructions for my carrier though and it says only to limit cargo weight to the lower of the carrierís rating (600 lbs in my case) or the hitch capacity (500 lbs). I asked about this at a local trailer supply store and they also said not to worry about it. Notwithstanding, I might switch to a class 4 hitch if I can find one. Sheesh! Thereís always SOMETHING to worry about.
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Old 08-25-2018, 07:37 PM   #56
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Hitch Replacement

Stuck in a small town I would look into having it welded rather than wait for Thor to send something. Then when back home up grade to a heavier hitch. You have traveled a lot and metal fatigue got the hitch so it's a good idea to upgrade.
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Old 08-25-2018, 08:15 PM   #57
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Waiting for Thor to call back...

http://www.thorforums.com/forums/att...1&d=1535224527
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Old 08-25-2018, 10:22 PM   #58
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I have seen this exact issue in trucks pulling trailers with brakes, dumps trailers and equipment trailers. Not so much as the weight of the trailer but setting the brakes to tight on the trailer. When trailer brakes hit on cheaper brake controllers they come on all at once full brake. On the new controllers they come on more gradually. I bet this is a similar case. Vehicle at max load for the towing vehicle, over set brakes, undersized tow set up.

All my trucks have 10K plus receivers, we use 15K inserts and 15K tow balls. YES the insert and the balls are rated as well as the receiver on the vehicle.

Now I will check the receiver on my Palazzo to see its rating before I hook up my jep again. A new receiver is far cheaper than our jeep or DP.
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Old 08-25-2018, 10:36 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by MEWright View Post
...Now I will check the receiver on my Palazzo to see its rating before I hook up my jep again. A new receiver is far cheaper than our jeep or DP.
Amen...
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Old 08-25-2018, 10:57 PM   #60
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Double R - I was the original poster of the thread on this issue. And as a number of folks have suggested, I'd find a local shop that does equipment repair and I'd almost guarantee you'll be able to find someone that is more tan capable of doing a weld repair. The folks that fixed my hitch, are local fifth wheel trailer manufacturer. Lots of confidence that I will not have the same. I had lots of formulas and reengineering suggestions but at the end of the day, I believe that this is a design flaw and over stresses the frame. I'd contact Thor - this is a huge safety issue with huge liability issues for someone given the number of failures that have been reported on this forum alone.

Be safe - hope all goes well.

PS: Update: we now have 52k+ miles towing our Explorer. That is 16k+ miles since the repair. All is good.
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