Winterize

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Scubawise

Rv antifreeze are non toxic and specifically prepared for this. They mostly come in pink color, but you may also get them in blue colors. ... It is non-toxic and the safest for all types of RV plumbing. This antifreeze is non-flammable and does not taint water systems

You keep forgetting, I have the Pink Anti Freeze, I use it, I know what it is, and I doubt I even pay $3 for it. The color doesn't matter, and it can taste like Kool Aid, I am not putting it into my fresh water supply. I don't need to, because my plumbing is all drained Doubt very seriously it gets to -2 below around here again, but if it does; and I am winterized; that is my peace of mind.

I would love to see actual stats of how many breakthrough cases of bursted pipes during a hard freeze with RVs that had been properly drained by owners manual, versus loaded with with pink anti freeze. In my mind knowing you have some water in the system that may not have got diluted is the greater risk, you can error by forgetting something with either method.

And FWIW; there are a lot of Non Toxic stuff that I don't put in my freshwater, so just because it is non toxic does not resonant. When I winterize I am bone dry everywhere except anti freeze on p traps and in the black / gray tanks. With that said, if the 360 Syphon does what it is advertised, I may stop putting the Pink Antifreeze in the P traps? Trust me, if I thought the Pink Antifreeze that I already have in the garage would protect my brand new and now two year old RV, I would have put it in the 1st two winters. I am approaching Winter #3 after a Winter #2 for about a week or so was as hard a freeze as anywhere else in the country.

I can fully winterize in 10 minutes. I can verify I am bone dry 24/7 by simply turning on the pump and opening drain to see if anything trickles, I can dewinterize in 15 min including sanitizing. 90% of that is waiting for the 70 gal fresh water tank to fill to full, maybe if I would stop it at 1/3 tank; I could dewinterize in 5 minutes

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Scubawise

Same here

On Jan. 20, 1954 a temperature of -70 was recorded during one of the harshest winters in the history of the Treasure State. This is the coldest temperature on record in the lower 48.

So if our RVs were parked side by side on Jan 20,1954 in the Treasure State, you would have bursted pipes and I would have frozen pink antifreeze in my p trap and in my holding tanks; but not enough to do any damage from expansion.

[MJC62]

RV antifreeze is cheap. If you live in climates that freeze hard to properly winterize an RV and sleep undisturbed when the temps dip, pink stuff is added to the water system AFTER you blow all the water from the lines. It is not a question of either or, it is BOTH. Blow the water out of the lines then run the antifreeze through the piping.

[Pete'sMH]

Originally Posted by dkoldman

You keep forgetting, I have the Pink Anti Freeze, I use it, I know what it is, and I doubt I even pay $3 for it. The color doesn't matter, and it can taste like Kool Aid, I am not putting it into my fresh water supply. I don't need to, because my plumbing is all drained Doubt very seriously it gets to -2 below around here again, but if it does; and I am winterized; that is my peace of mind.

I would love to see actual stats of how many breakthrough cases of bursted pipes during a hard freeze with RVs that had been properly drained by owners manual, versus loaded with with pink anti freeze. In my mind knowing you have some water in the system that may not have got diluted is the greater risk, you can error by forgetting something with either method.

And FWIW; there are a lot of Non Toxic stuff that I don't put in my freshwater, so just because it is non toxic does not resonant. When I winterize I am bone dry everywhere except anti freeze on p traps and in the black / gray tanks. With that said, if the 360 Syphon does what it is advertised, I may stop putting the Pink Antifreeze in the P traps? Trust me, if I thought the Pink Antifreeze that I already have in the garage would protect my brand new and now two year old RV, I would have put it in the 1st two winters. I am approaching Winter #3 after a Winter #2 for about a week or so was as hard a freeze as anywhere else in the country.

I can fully winterize in 10 minutes. I can verify I am bone dry 24/7 by simply turning on the pump and opening drain to see if anything trickles, I can dewinterize in 15 min including sanitizing. 90% of that is waiting for the 70 gal fresh water tank to fill to full, maybe if I would stop it at 1/3 tank; I could dewinterize in 5 minutes

It certainly works to use air to winterize and I’m glad you are pleased with your process. But it’s not uncommon for folks to fail to fully dry their systems and experience problems. It only takes a small amount of water to collect in a toilet valve, shower mixing valve, ice maker or water pump to cause grief come spring. Also, have you ever seen a cut open compressor air tank? They are full of rust, munge and moisture. I don’t want to blow that into my RV. You can use a filter and yada, yada, but the pink stuff is still easier, and more effective.

[Scubawise]

Originally Posted by Pete'sMH

It certainly works to use air to winterize and I’m glad you are pleased with your process. But it’s not uncommon for folks to fail to fully dry their systems and experience problems. It only takes a small amount of water to collect in a toilet valve, shower mixing valve, ice maker or water pump to cause grief come spring. Also, have you ever seen a cut open compressor air tank? They are full of rust, munge and moisture. I don’t want to blow that into my RV. You can use a filter and yada, yada, but the pink stuff is still easier, and more effective.

Exactly what my 30 year tech said. He has seen air fail many times. He said same as you a little anywhere will ruin your system. He said please use pink all over. The had a 18 foot camper. Air winterized and it failed

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by MJC62

RV antifreeze is cheap. If you live in climates that freeze hard to properly winterize an RV and sleep undisturbed when the temps dip, pink stuff is added to the water system AFTER you blow all the water from the lines. It is not a question of either or, it is BOTH. Blow the water out of the lines then run the antifreeze through the piping.

I agree here, and why I said in earlier post, not sure how far North I would have to move to be that concerned; and with the FACT that you state AFTER you blow out the water. Failure to improperly drain all water can be disastrous for both methods, as my money says a number of RVers simply add the Pink antifreeze to what water may already be in the lines or water that has not properly drained. Diluted antifreeze will freeze sooner, not that you don't know that; but just stating why I say both methods can fail if improperly performed.

[Scubawise]

Post #1000 I am glad we deep dive these things..
Don't want our rigs to fail.
We all do a good job taking care of them.
Water damage is a BIG issue.
Thanks all posters

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Pete'sMH

It certainly works to use air to winterize and I’m glad you are pleased with your process. But it’s not uncommon for folks to fail to fully dry their systems and experience problems. It only takes a small amount of water to collect in a toilet valve, shower mixing valve, ice maker or water pump to cause grief come spring. Also, have you ever seen a cut open compressor air tank? They are full of rust, munge and moisture. I don’t want to blow that into my RV. You can use a filter and yada, yada, but the pink stuff is still easier, and more effective.

Yes it works very well for me in our case and specific situation. My focus is to simply drain properly, and I am done You also must keep in mind, that I may only be winterized for a week or two before I am putting water back into the tanks using the RV again in full as intended. I sanitize each time I do that; so it is as clean as it is going to be. Before we got our newest boat that does not require winterizing, I winterized our other boats for 30 years the same way with no antifreeze stuff, just let it run bone dry. If I were to error, I would know about it really soon because I don't winterize the way most folks to the Spring. We use year around. In fact; I have trips planed for Christmas & New Years already. Granted it is NOT to Montana

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Scubawise

Post #1000 I am glad we deep dive these things..
Don't want our rigs to fail.
We all do a good job taking care of them.
Water damage is a BIG issue.
Thanks all posters

[Matthew]

In SC, sometimes I have to blow the lines,
sometimes we run the AC in the winter.

[Johng]

I winterize motor home and family cottage with an air compressor on low air pressure. Ensure you.push out all water from each faucet and drain. When finished leave faucets open and remove hot water tank drain. Pink stuff goes in drains only. We get down to -25 for several days each winter

[Bill Johnson]

I blow my lines out with compressed air and connect the antifreeze to the inlet of the water pump and pump it through all the lines until it runs pink. Then I blow the lines out with compressed air again. Can't freeze if there's nothing in the lines. I leave the faucets open so if something did freeze it can't make pressure and split a line. The water heater is bypassed and drained. This old house did a video on frozen pipes splitting, they didn't split where the freeze was it was the pressure of the ice in the line that raised the pressure in the pipe and the pipe split at the weakest point in the system. The plumber said if the faucet was open the pipe wouldn't have split. He said you can't compress a liquid so if the faucet is closed and there is a freeze the pressure in the pipe is increased to hundreds or thousands of pounds, I don't remember which, I'm sure there are videos on YouTube that show this happening.

[IDguy]

Originally Posted by Scubawise

My 30 year rv tech agrees. Remove dump strainer and use pink stuff. See image. This women owns this rig and thought she air blew the lines. Had leaks. Our tech ordered her a $9000 part to replace water pump etc!

Good news is she told him the price is not bad

etc must include a lot of stuff!

[IDguy]

Originally Posted by Scubawise

Exactly what my 30 year tech said. He has seen air fail many times. He said same as you a little anywhere will ruin your system. He said please use pink all over. The had a 18 foot camper. Air winterized and it failed

You need to know how to do it. Air is input through city water connection thus does not clear pump and its filter.

Most newer RVs come with a three way valve at the pump suction to pump antifreeze through it. You need to do that a little to protect pump. And if you use about a gallon can do all lines and fill traps at the same time. If you do air first you can use less antifreeze.

Unfortunately the fresh water tank on my Georgetown does not drain completely. The connection is above the bottom. But it has proven capable of handling that small amount in the tank. The i e just pushes up.

[Wiley1]

Originally Posted by dkoldman

90% of that is waiting for the 70 gal fresh water tank to fill to full, maybe if I would stop it at 1/3 tank; I could dewinterize in 5 minutes

Please be careful. You might start another 190 post thread.

[Scubawise]

Post #201 Wow will do this did not know. I have never pump.
Will air and then pink stuff..


Most newer RVs come with a three way valve at the pump suction to pump antifreeze through it. You need to do that a little to protect pump. And if you use about a gallon can do all lines and fill traps at the same time. If you do air first you can use less antifreeze.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Scubawise

Post #201 Wow will do this did not know. I have never pump.
Will air and then pink stuff..


Most newer RVs come with a three way valve at the pump suction to pump antifreeze through it. You need to do that a little to protect pump. And if you use about a gallon can do all lines and fill traps at the same time. If you do air first you can use less antifreeze.

Earlier this week, I pulled my manual from Winnebago and Winterization Procedure is pretty clear. Like you stated earlier they give two options and there was nothing about one being better than the other, safer than the other or need to be done in real real freeze conditions. Just two options to winterize PERIOD

Oddly the Air Method was listed as Option #1 It was simplest to do; no valves are required to be turned. Just drain and blow 30 psi air to open faucets, pour in RV antifreeze in the P Traps; drain the hot water heater and close every thing back up and call it a day. That is all I do, and it is 15 min tops

The 2nd method states that you do all that is in Option 1; then you have to turn two bypass values to pull in the RV Anti Freeze. Oddly even if you are using the Pink Anti Freeze in the plumbing IT SHOULD NOT be in the Water Heater; that is purpose of the bypass valves.

So by definition to fully use Pink Anti Freeze everywhere that it is allowed, it will take longer. I have learned as a result of this thread that not only is the air blow out method sufficient, I have no need to pump in Pink Anti Freeze in fresh water line ever; even if I was traveling to Montana.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Wiley1

Please be careful. You might start another 190 post thread.

Yes you are probably right, I realize there are different strokes for different folks but some things people do is like asking a little kid to see a polka dotted elephant in the house and not say anything

I apologize if I offended anyone in the process, but some of the practices about freshwater fill/drain just blows me away

[Scubawise]

Well you know montana may have originated camping
Kurts repairs and other 30 year techs here use pink stuff..

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Scubawise

Well you know montana may have originated camping
Kurts repairs and other 30 year techs here use pink stuff..

I use the pink stuff too just like my operating manual says in the P Traps. Winnebago Ind has been making RVs for 63 years. The operating manual also specifically says to NOT put the pink stuff in the Hot Water Heater, and it is an OPTION to backfill the water supply lines GIVEN that you have properly WINTERIZED by draining and air blowing @30psi first. It does not distinct any method, preference, or option based on actual location or expected temperatures.

Surely you "The Principal" of all people will not fault me for Reading the Owners Manual and following the procedures.