Thor now #1 in Class B

[Chance]

Surprising how quickly Thor took over the #1 Class B spot. Not that long ago Thor Class B market share was in single digits.

Also worth noting that Class B vans exceeded Class A motorhomes by significant margin for first time. If higher gas prices remain, that trend may become permanent.

Greater volume should lead to more designs and choices, but manufacturers may try to increase prices too much to make up for lower profits in other motorized lines. Sales have declined for 9 straight months per report.


https://rvbusiness.com/ssi-february-...est-on-record/

[ducksface]

Probably a mental malfunction of mine, but
I see b owners as extremely dedicated or extremely naive, with no in between.

So,
I'll say, blindly and potentially sillily,
Thor jumped on the
naivety bandwagon
to rah-rah the
'me too' drunken band members.
Once inventory is sold Thor can't care how many repossessions/financially buried folks there will be.

Run toward the sunshine. Investors love it.

[powerboatr]

Originally Posted by ducksface

Probably a mental malfunction of mine, but
I see b owners as extremely dedicated or extremely naive, with no in between.

So,
I'll say, blindly and potentially sillily,
Thor jumped on the
naivety bandwagon
to rah-rah the
'me too' drunken band members.
Once inventory is sold Thor can't care how many repossessions/financially buried folks there will be.

Run toward the sunshine. Investors love it.

i have to agree.
class b is alot of work to actually camp and set up.
but thor is number #1 because they own 75% of market share with its brands ????

[Chance]

It’s a given B vans are not for everyone. From my perspective they have three major disadvantages (cost, towing, and space), but are these deal breakers for everyone? Apparently not.

Vans can cost a considerable amount, but historically hold their value very well. Also, if they can serve as a second family car or daily driver, they can lower cost of RV ownership considerably. Fuel economy and lower maintenance costs helps also. And in some cases being able to park at home saves on outside storage.

Towing capacity of newer ProMaster, Sprinter, and Transit vans can be relatively low, but very few Class Bs need to tow anything, and when they do, it is usually a light trailer and not a heavy car or SUV. Most Bs can tow motorcycles, ATVs, jet skis, and other toys with ease.

In my opinion it mostly comes down to available living and storage space due to a van’s limited size/volume on which to build a camper/motorhome. Fortunately, vans keep getting larger, making them more like small Class As. Young or retired couples can often be quite comfortable in a large van provided they have moderate expectations; assuming of course van is designed appropriate for their needs.

For size comparison, older Ford and Chevy extended one-ton vans from the past started life just under 300 cubic feet of cargo volume, with largest vans today approaching 600 cubic feet. Presently, buyers often choose vans smaller than largest available, suggesting added space alone must not be that critical to them.

[paulwadley]

Having been a former Class B owner, then moving to a Class C and now owning a Class A, B Class coaches have a small niche in the world of motor homes. We loved our Class B but after a couple of years found that it didn't meet our needs so we moved to a Class C which was also built on the same chassis(Mercedes Benz) as our Class B. That was great for another 3 years and we found that we "out grew" it with needs for more space inside and outside. There are trade offs along the way. Costs and fuel economy are two of them but we expected those with the upward movement between the three coaches. If it were just my wife and I then the Class C we had was perfect but we travel with more family/friends these days and could not fit our travel needs. Thor was able to move into the Class B movement during the right time.

Paul

[RACarvalho]

I know that there is this niche market there but what I can't really understand is the fascination for really expensive diesel platforms for a such small rig.

A gas Ford Transit or Chevy E350/E450 van is a way more cost effective path to reach the same objective and any savings people may have with diesel are completely obliterated through depreciation of a higher value, higher maintenance, insurance, registration, etc cost...

[Chance]

Niche???? Am I missing context?

From report:

• Class A: 957 (down 21.7% vs. 1,222 in February 2021). Market share leaders: 1. THOR (50.2%); 2. Forest River (15.7%); 3. Newmar Corp. (14.7%).
• Class C: 1,611 (down 11.6% vs. 1,823 in February 2021). Market share leaders: 1. THOR (54.7%); 2. Forest River (27.1%); 3. Winnebago Motorized (5.3%).
• Class B: 1,146 (up 66.8% vs. 687 in February 2021). Market share leaders: 1. THOR (44.2%); 2. Winnebago (32.5%); 3. Forest River (5.9%).



Vans outsold Class As by 20% in February. They seem mainstream to me.



P.S. — Agree on diesel, but think that’s because of Mercedes status and Sprinter offering only 4X4 van in US market. Ford is AWD and does not lend itself as well to RV conversion; and popular ProMaster is strictly FWD, hence can’t go far off road.

[RACarvalho]

Originally Posted by Chance

Niche???? Am I missing context?

From report:

• Class A: 957 (down 21.7% vs. 1,222 in February 2021). Market share leaders: 1. THOR (50.2%); 2. Forest River (15.7%); 3. Newmar Corp. (14.7%).
• Class C: 1,611 (down 11.6% vs. 1,823 in February 2021). Market share leaders: 1. THOR (54.7%); 2. Forest River (27.1%); 3. Winnebago Motorized (5.3%).
• Class B: 1,146 (up 66.8% vs. 687 in February 2021). Market share leaders: 1. THOR (44.2%); 2. Winnebago (32.5%); 3. Forest River (5.9%).



Vans outsold Class As by 20% in February. They seem mainstream to me.



P.S. — Agree on diesel, but think that’s because of Mercedes status and Sprinter offering only 4X4 van in US market. Ford is AWD and does not lend itself as well to RV conversion; and popular ProMaster is strictly FWD, hence can’t go far off road.

I guess this report is from march???
yes, Bs out sold As by 189 units in March(?) but in February As outsold Bs by 535 units....
With only the above data We cant assume a trend.
I'm willing to bet that the difference is related to availability....
A's supply chain is way longer than B ones which make them more vulnerable to issues.

And yes, it is a niche in my book because it fits the needs of a very specific and restrict part of the consumer field.
While As and Cs can be bought and used by anyone from a single person to couples to families , Bs rarely can fit the needs of families and you need a very specific kind of couples to want it.

[dg0603]

All depends on your RVing goals.

We came down from a 37 foot trailer because it was too much work to hassle with. Our situation is different now, than it was in the TT days. The Class B fits what we want to do.

[EA37TS]

Class B outselling Class A for one month does not indicate anything. When they outpace other classes for 6 consecutive months then you might have a trend as long as all other factors are equal.

One major question, what constitutes Thor and what constitutes Winnebago? Is Thor, Thor Motor Coach only or is it all Thor Industries motor homers. If it’s the latter the report is garbage because the list Newmar outside Winnnebago.

This looks like something Thor would put together and hand off to someone for publication.

[Scubawise]

Originally Posted by ducksface

Probably a mental malfunction of mine, but
I see b owners as extremely dedicated or extremely naive, with no in between.

So,
I'll say, blindly and potentially sillily,
Thor jumped on the
naivety bandwagon
to rah-rah the
'me too' drunken band members.
Once inventory is sold Thor can't care how many repossessions/financially buried folks there will be.

Run toward the sunshine. Investors love it.

We have had many B owners ask us about our Vegas.
They are unhappy with the size and cost

[Scubawise]

Originally Posted by Chance

Niche???? Am I missing context?

From report:

• Class A: 957 (down 21.7% vs. 1,222 in February 2021). Market share leaders: 1. THOR (50.2%); 2. Forest River (15.7%); 3. Newmar Corp. (14.7%).
• Class C: 1,611 (down 11.6% vs. 1,823 in February 2021). Market share leaders: 1. THOR (54.7%); 2. Forest River (27.1%); 3. Winnebago Motorized (5.3%).
• Class B: 1,146 (up 66.8% vs. 687 in February 2021). Market share leaders: 1. THOR (44.2%); 2. Winnebago (32.5%); 3. Forest River (5.9%).



Vans outsold Class As by 20% in February. They seem mainstream to me.



P.S. — Agree on diesel, but think that’s because of Mercedes status and Sprinter offering only 4X4 van in US market. Ford is AWD and does not lend itself as well to RV conversion; and popular ProMaster is strictly FWD, hence can’t go far off road.

Last week a dealer told us Amazon purchased most of the Mercedes diesel engines for there van deliveries
So costs will jump

[Chance]

Originally Posted by Scubawise

We have had many B owners ask us about our Vegas.
They are unhappy with the size and cost

I can understand them being unhappy with size after actually camping in it, but being unhappy with cost after purchase makes no sense at all. It’s not like anyone forced them to agree to the price.

[Chance]

A “trend” means a general pattern of change and not much else. In this case, the trend is that going back well over a year (or two), market share for Class As of the total motorized RV segment has been declining, while market share of Bs has increased.

I just noted February was first time this data showed Bs significantly ahead of As. This same data showed Bs were less that 20% of As not that long ago (in years, not months). Thor CEO was aware of downsizing trend years ago, and took advantage by developing Class Bs.

I have no vested interest in this at all. If anything, higher Class B demand will increase prices which will likely work against me.

[Scubawise]

Originally Posted by Chance

I can understand them being unhappy with size after actually camping in it, but being unhappy with cost after purchase makes no sense at all. It’s not like anyone forced them to agree to the price.

Once in Red Loge MT and California both B class owners asked us what we paid.
We told them $84K on our 2020 and they said ours a a lot more less room and can't even fit 1 or 2 grandkids adn cost way more than yours

[MLP]

Some parts of the country have little to no RV storage lots to speak of and most homes do not have large enough yards to put anything but a Class B. My sister is one and still enjoys camping with hers. It is not for everyone. Our class C just fit in our driveway. Thankfully we got a storage place for out fifth wheel and then was able to put our class A in the same spot. There just is not any place to store RV's around San Jose, CA any more. So small trailers and class B's are selling off the lots fast.

[Scubawise]

Originally Posted by MLP

Some parts of the country have little to no RV storage lots to speak of and most homes do not have large enough yards to put anything but a Class B. My sister is one and still enjoys camping with hers. It is not for everyone. Our class C just fit in our driveway. Thankfully we got a storage place for out fifth wheel and then was able to put our class A in the same spot. There just is not any place to store RV's around San Jose, CA any more. So small trailers and class B's are selling off the lots fast.

We just lucked out! Inspection passed on new NM home with gated side rv yard with dump

[dg0603]

NOT fitting grandkids is exactly why you get a Class B.

[Chance]

Originally Posted by MLP

Some parts of the country have little to no RV storage lots to speak of and most homes do not have large enough yards to put anything but a Class B. My sister is one and still enjoys camping with hers. It is not for everyone. Our class C just fit in our driveway. Thankfully we got a storage place for out fifth wheel and then was able to put our class A in the same spot. There just is not any place to store RV's around San Jose, CA any more. So small trailers and class B's are selling off the lots fast.

In Texas you can find off-site storage, but can add significant cost to motorhome ownership. A family I know well just purchased a very nice 28-foot Class C, and while he could park it outside at home, did not want it sitting out in the weather. He found indoor storage for $300 while waiting for a better deal.

In fairness, practically no Class B van camper will fit in standard home garages anyway, so if owner wants to protect investment by not letting it sit outside, it too would need outside storage that is nearly as expensive as for a larger motorhome.

I would love to have a small RV-size garage at home, but my lot is too small, plus I doubt HOA would allow it. Cost would be lower than offsite storage, and would provide immediate access to camper.

[RACarvalho]

Originally Posted by Scubawise

Last week a dealer told us Amazon purchased most of the Mercedes diesel engines for there van deliveries
So costs will jump

Need to take what a Woke company does with a grain of salt.
Why would fedex and UPS have most of their fleet run on gasoline and natural gas and Amazon on expensive diesel?