Are RV's being built w/poor quality standards?

[Bob Denman]

[chunker21]

Originally Posted by Bob Denman

The big Maple tree at the unlit end of the parking lot...

Standing room only

[JeffThor325]

Staying on topic, I have thought about this subject a lot and have had many people ask me about it. I've come up with a few pretty basic theories.

1. A passenger car/truck/van is vastly smaller than an RV yet typically has only an incrementally smaller engine. Plus it has no need of things like roof vents, slide-outs, appliances, bathrooms, etc. Bottom line: with tremendously less weight they can be made of all metal. Far less likely to leak. They also just have less complexity from lack of plumbing, propane lines, etc.

2. Tractor-trailers and similar commercial cargo vehicles are purchased by corporations who are willing to pay a lot more to ensure a vehicle will run forever with very low maintenance. They also generally lack the plumbing, propane, slide-outs, etc of an RV. That higher price point and generally lower complexity means a more reliable vehicle that doesn't leak.

3. RV buyers suffer from a combination of problems that doom the industry to mediocre quality standards:
a. They want everything under the sun: as much living space as a house, TVs in every room, multiple air conditioners, gigantic refrigerator… the list goes on and on.
b. An RV isn't just a vehicle but also has a kitchen, bedroom, bathroom, etc.
c. They want to pay as little as possible for all of the above.
d. On average, they will only actually use the RV less than 30 days per year.

[EA37TS]

Originally Posted by JeffThor325

Staying on topic, I have thought about this subject a lot and have had many people ask me about it. I've come up with a few pretty basic theories.

1. A passenger car/truck/van is vastly smaller than an RV yet typically has only an incrementally smaller engine. Plus it has no need of things like roof vents, slide-outs, appliances, bathrooms, etc. Bottom line: with tremendously less weight they can be made of all metal. Far less likely to leak. They also just have less complexity from lack of plumbing, propane lines, etc.

2. Tractor-trailers and similar commercial cargo vehicles are purchased by corporations who are willing to pay a lot more to ensure a vehicle will run forever with very low maintenance. They also generally lack the plumbing, propane, slide-outs, etc of an RV. That higher price point and generally lower complexity means a more reliable vehicle that doesn't leak.

3. RV buyers suffer from a combination of problems that doom the industry to mediocre quality standards:
a. They want everything under the sun: as much living space as a house, TVs in every room, multiple air conditioners, gigantic refrigerator… the list goes on and on.
b. An RV isn't just a vehicle but also has a kitchen, bedroom, bathroom, etc.
c. They want to pay as little as possible for all of the above.
d. On average, they will only actually use the RV less than 30 days per year.

Very well said with one additional point. The auto and commercial truck manufacturers are so highly automated that human contact with the vehicle is next to none (very minimal). Reduced human contact equals reduced errors in assembly. RV manufacturers don’t produce the number of end units that would make automation a profitable investment.

[chunker21]

Originally Posted by EA37TS

Very well said with one additional point. The auto and commercial truck manufacturers are so highly automated that human contact with the vehicle is next to none (very minimal). Reduced human contact equals reduced errors in assembly. RV manufacturers don’t produce the number of end units that would make automation a profitable investment.

And to add, little sincere followup (Quality Control) of the product in the factory. Statements about QC by all the manufacturers, especially those that specialize in entry level RVs, is lip service and publicity statements only. We went to a Newmar factory and as a coach is going from station to station, people were inspecting the work, leaving sticky tabs in fault areas so they could be fixed before it went to the next station. The people inspection were not the people who did the initial work.
Does a Newmar come out fault free? No but I'll bet they have far fewer than a thor coach.

[Bob Denman]

If you were to take your stick-built house down the road at 60 mph: how long do you think it would still be in one-piece?

[MJC62]

Originally Posted by Bob Denman

If you were to take your stick-built house down the road at 60 mph: how long do you think it would still be in one-piece?

Ditto! Especially on the roads in this country that are rebuilt Willy Nilly.

[Chateau_Nomad]

Originally Posted by Bob Denman

If you were to take your stick-built house down the road at 60 mph: how long do you think it would still be in one-piece?

A previous house I owned - built in 1923 - would fare EXTREMELY well, provided it was supported by an appropriate chassis/frame. Compared to the OSB cookie-cutters built today - it was way overbuilt. Solid red pine walls and subfloor - no OSB or "structurally engineered support beams". But it will be standing as a well built (square & plumb) residence for easily another hundred years.

Houses in those days were built by craftsmen who earned the privilege to be called CRAFTSMEN. They were properly trained, and didn't take shortcuts. Most were proud to put their signature on their work. Today's craftsmen have been replaced by a "commodity" workforce - and the quality is reflected in that mindset.

[Bob Denman]

Mine was built in '27.
Full-dimensioned lumber is impossible to find anymore...
Plaster lathe walls that always need attention...
A wiring system that's over 90 years old...
Yeah: old houses are just tons of fun!
https://www.thorforums.com/forums/at...1&d=1632165116

[Chateau_Nomad]

Originally Posted by Bob Denman

Mine was built in '27.
Full-dimensioned lumber is impossible to find anymore...
Plaster lathe walls that always need attention...
A wiring system that's over 90 years old...
Yeah: old houses are just tons of fun!
https://www.thorforums.com/forums/at...1&d=1632165116

Yep... I had TONS of "fun" in ours... Fun finding what IDIOTS had done over the years and fixing it!

Our house had sheetrock - no plaster. No gypsum board. No insulation either. All the knob and tube had been replaced by UNGROUNDED 100 amp service/wiring sometime estimated in the 1950s. Since PVC plumbing hadn't been invented, any drains imbedded in concrete floors (tile backerboard didn't exist either) were starting to corrode/rust/leak. It still had the original cedar roof under 2 layers of asphalt roofing.

But... tract houses built today with NO maintenance yields about 30 years of life. Maintenance might get you to maybe 50. But those older houses will still be standing - if maintained - long after the budget houses of today have been dozed and rebuilt.

[10scDust]

To add to the un-quality in workmanship dept, I noticed two of my rear upper marker lights out. Getting to them, they are LED without a replaceable bulb type. Here is what I found:
They are mounted with a metal type screw (2 per light), the only wire present is the black 12v power feed to the light, the white one for ground coming from the bulb had been bared (intentionally) at the end, it was then stuck into the hole where the mount screw went, relying on its contact with frame to allow completing the circuit.
Of course, a little corrosion on the screw caused it to not function as intended any longer.

To replace it would mean doing something similar, they could have run a ground wire to each light, I mean, come on?

Should I be surprised?

[lwmcguire]

I have had RV'S fir 60 plus years

Price point has sure made a difference in the product and always will

The lower the price point more tweaking and reassembly is required

This is the same across the industry

If you're on a tight budget you better be handy

Absolutely no way it is going to change

[Lt Keefer]

Originally Posted by lwmcguire

I have had RV'S fir 60 plus years

Price point has sure made a difference in the product and always will

The lower the price point more tweaking and reassembly is required

This is the same across the industry

If you're on a tight budget you better be handy

Absolutely no way it is going to change

I would generally agree with you on price point but I did see a number of Foretravel coaches headed toward Nacogdoches last Sunday. Apparently, they need repairs as well.

[EA37TS]

Originally Posted by Lt Keefer

I would generally agree with you on price point but I did see a number of Foretravel coaches headed toward Nacogdoches last Sunday. Apparently, they need repairs as well.

Not always the case. Some higher end coaches go back to the manufacturer for periodic scheduled service or an owners workshop. Included in the high purchase price.