Is Colorado Safe for RVs?

[dkoldman]

Our Son recently accepted a new job in Denver; so we plan to go up to Denver Colorado next week and spend 5 days. Mainly to help him move in, but also a good chance to get out of the Texas freeze weather and get into a warmer state like Colorado.

But I am not sure I can safely drive the RV to Denver, Colorado? I was thinking to maybe drive it to Kansas (or similar) and then get a rental to drive into Denver? On one hand it would be nice to at least cross the border; so I can check Colorado off as one more state we have visited with RV, but my fears / concerns are as follows....

1. Mile high? What will that do to my RV systems like emissions etc.? Generator? Refrigerator?
2. Mountains? I drive in Tow Mode fulltime in Dallas area. Seems like I would need a Super Tow Mode for Colorado? I hate to be in some situational driving on a hill or decline where I may not be able to safely stop. I have driven through the Boston Mountains near Fayetteville AR in RV with no issues, but I have also driven our SUV Navigator on that Million Dollar Highway in Colorado from Silverton - Ouray and I know I NEVER want to do that again and would NOT even think about it with RV.
3. Campsites in Denver area (where I need to be) besides the reservations ( which is normal; but they say dump stations are closed until 4/1 Does that mean that if we are in Denver areas we may not find anywhere to dump?
4. Weather? Is it likely we may encounter freezing ice type conditions and become stranded?

We have had our RV 1 1/2 years now, and I just don't want this surprise trip to Colorado to become a disaster and take away from my son's accomplishment.

Thoughts

[taylorbob1]

My son lives in COSprings
We’ve visited him several times in our RV
All systems work fine.
CO & NM sell the 85 octane gas because of the altitude
Our E450 ran like normal
So no issues...

Our last trip we stayed at a KOA in October-2020, during the Virus.
Everything was fine until a snow storm came in
So we left town in a hurry and headed south to ElPaso, missing most of the weather, before heading back west thru Tucson.

[Travelin' Texans]

Sounds like you're new & inexperienced at driving the motorhome & already stressed just thinking about the "what ifs", I'd say leave the motorhome & just drive to Denver. Not sure I'd want to take a chance on the late winter storm possibly in Kansas or Colorado.
On the other hand what better way to become more experienced!

[Scubawise]

Do not drive during any rush hours! All other times are fine

[16ACE27]

If it was not safe for RVs in Colorado then wouldn't that mean there would be no campgrounds for RVs in Colorado?

Not being able to stop your RV on a decline is an operator deficiency, not a geographical or RV deficiency. People drive RVs over mountain passes daily without issue.

My wife can't stop laughing at your premise of escaping the "freezing" temperatures of the flat plains of Texas by going 1000 miles north up into the Rocky Mountains. We've been in Denver where is was sunny and in the 70s one day and in the 20s with 6 inches of snow on the ground the next morning.

There are altitude adjustments that may be required for your generator and gas appliances.

Your biggest issue is not a safety issue: where to dump? The work-around is to not use the RV "facilities" so you then have no need to dump.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Travelin' Texans

Sounds like you're new & inexperienced at driving the motorhome & already stressed just thinking about the "what ifs", I'd say leave the motorhome & just drive to Denver. Not sure I'd want to take a chance on the late winter storm possibly in Kansas or Colorado.
On the other hand what better way to become more experienced!

New and inexperienced is correct but relative to your perspective.

We bought RV brand new, flew to Florida to get it and drove it back 1500 miles with no issues on maiden voyage. We have owned it for 1 1 /2 years now; and we have but 10,000 miles on it. I think it had about 700 miles when we bought it.

But I never figured to go to Colorado in March thus my questions, or stress as you state. I rather proactively plan or take into account now versus later while on the road. If you ever been on Million Dollar highway in Colorado and was NOT stressed you have my ultimate admiration because I was scared $^%$less and that was in my SUV with my wife and two kids

But driving a car into Denver is a real possibility. However I would not drive my vehicle, if I were to drive I would get a rental car, if Western Kansas is just as bad then I can get a rental in Amarillo, I know the roads well between Dallas & Amarillo so that is not a concern

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by taylorbob1

My son lives in COSprings
We’ve visited him several times in our RV
All systems work fine.
CO & NM sell the 85 octane gas because of the altitude
Our E450 ran like normal
So no issues...

Our last trip we stayed at a KOA in October-2020, during the Virus.
Everything was fine until a snow storm came in
So we left town in a hurry and headed south to ElPaso, missing most of the weather, before heading back west thru Tucson.

85 Octane gas I had never heard of. Thanks so I will be prepared for that, and not freak out at the pump

Can I assume you came up I-25 through Raton, Pueblo to Colorado Springs? If so; where there any sharp pig tail tight turns with deep ravines off the side? Do you recall if you had many climbs that forced you under say 40 mph, or converse where you had try to decrease speed by downshifting or use of the tow haul transmission. I drive in tow haul mode, so I would like to think I can drive the entire way just driving like normal as far as acceleration and braking.

[atreis]

From someone that towed sizeable full-height trailers with minivans for years, in the mountains, including SD, CO, I-68 in MD/WV, and I-77 in NC:

How to tow in mountains:

You need to know your vehicle. Most especially, figure out where the power band is for your engine. This is an RPM range (nothing to do with speed) where the engine produces the most power. If you have a tachometer, you can figure it out by staying in a low gear and revving through the RPM range. There will be a point where you feel noticeably more power, and another point where it falls off. If you don't have a tachometer, you can still do it, but it's a little fuzzier. You figure out the rough engine RPMs by sound, or by knowing what gear you're in and what speed you're going. (Sound is usually easier.) Play with it a bit and you'll get the feel of it.

Engine Noise: Don't be afraid to USE your engine. Yes, it can scream like a banshee at high RPMs if that's where your power band is. It's designed for that. Let it scream! I like to turn the radio off so that I can hear the engine better.

Going up: Goal: Keep the engine in the power band. Don't worry about speed.

At the bottom of the slope, get up to speed (speed limit to a little over). As you start up the slope, put your engine into the power band. The goal here is not to maintain speed, it's to maintain RPMs. Keep the engine in the power band. As the slope gets steep, just keep it in the power band. You'll slow down some, and it will downshift to maintain that level of RPMs. Start at the top of the power band, as you slow down and approach the bottom of the power band, push it to shift. If you stay in the power band, you'll be surprised how good a job it does at maintaining speed. You'll pass big rigs, much larger RVs, etc. driven by people that don't know how to do this or who are afraid to let their engine roar. (Loved passing big diesel pickups with trailers while towing a 21 foot trailer with a minivan!) The big thing to note here is that speed is unimportant. You'll go however fast your vehicle can while maintaining the engine in the power band. Don't stress about it. (Pulling a 19% grade with trailer in a minivan in PA, on a back road that I travel sometimes, I'd end up going no more than 20 mph by the time I got to the top. Interstate grades aren't anywhere near that steep, and I've never fallen below 40 mph on an Interstate.)

Going down: Goal: Control and limit use of the brakes. You don't want them to overheat.

As you approach the start of the downhill, slow down to the minimum speed.
Gravity will take care of making you go faster. As the slope gets steep enough that you start gaining speed without giving it gas, put the engine into high RPMs by downshifting using the shift lever. The friction of the engine will help slow you. (Again, don't be afraid to let it scream.) Let gravity speed you up, don't give it gas unless the slope isn't steep enough for gravity to do it. As you get up to the maximum speed you're comfortable with (not so fast the transmission computer forces an upshift!), brake firmly to slow back down to the minimum speed. So that your speed varies, for instance, between 65 at the high end or whatever is comfortable for you/the speed limit and 45 at the low end. The big thing here: don't ride the brakes. Brake firmly so that you're only applying the brakes for 10-30 seconds and slow down relatively quickly. Then let gravity start speeding you back up again. Repeat this process. Doing this, your brakes have time to cool between applications so that they can continue to work effectively.

Time: Allocate more time for mountain driving so that you're not stressing about that. It takes more attention and a little more mental work to drive in mountains, but once you get the hang of it, it's really not bad.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by 16ACE27

If it was not safe for RVs in Colorado then wouldn't that mean there would be no campgrounds for RVs in Colorado?

Not being able to stop your RV on a decline is an operator deficiency, not a geographical or RV deficiency. People drive RVs over mountain passes daily without issue.

My wife can't stop laughing at your premise of escaping the "freezing" temperatures of the flat plains of Texas by going 1000 miles north up into the Rocky Mountains. We've been in Denver where is was sunny and in the 70s one day and in the 20s with 6 inches of snow on the ground the next morning.

There are altitude adjustments that may be required for your generator and gas appliances.

Your biggest issue is not a safety issue: where to dump? The work-around is to not use the RV "facilities" so you then have no need to dump.

Looks like you cut and pasted the Denver weather forecast under the Dallas Accu Weather heading and vice versa ? Point well taken, but a little while back when Denver was a looming possibility for our son, it was much colder in Dallas and Denver. I have three burst pipes and a busted header return on my pool to prove it. Our pool will be disabled for at least a few months while we wait for a newly backordered pool heater. I can't even find 2" PVC couplers and 90 degree elbows to build a temporary bypass from the heater. I had to order PVC fittings online!!! I expect to receive them next week.

Other than that, it was kind of neat to have a Ice Skating Rink in the back yard

All kidding aside... what have I learned?
1. I will check my Onan and Norcold manual on what they say (didn't think of that before)
2. I have two portable port a potties we use from tent camping. I will carry both, one inside to use and the other in basement as spare. They can easily be dumped anywhere.
3. Think we can do as you say to avoid use of water or use very little. I actually just de winterize the RV in preparation for this trip, I am starting to 2nd guess that Should I re-winterize to be absolutely sure. I must have done good job winterizing before because the RV suffered no freeze damage during that week long sub freeze span.

[taylorbob1]

Originally Posted by dkoldman

85 Octane gas I had never heard of. Thanks so I will be prepared for that, and not freak out at the pump

Can I assume you came up I-25 through Raton, Pueblo to Colorado Springs? If so; where there any sharp pig tail tight turns with deep ravines off the side? Do you recall if you had many climbs that forced you under say 40 mph, or converse where you had try to decrease speed by downshifting or use of the tow haul transmission. I drive in tow haul mode, so I would like to think I can drive the entire way just driving like normal as far as acceleration and braking.

We have had no problems thru Raton Pass, just a normal climb up and then back down.
A good place to stay is the Black Mesa Casino - RV Park which is north of Albuquerque, and south of Santa Fe. It’s on I-25.
Cheap gas, lots of ez access RV spots available and a $10 dump station if you’re just passing thru and need a quick dump.
And hopefully the Casino will be open

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by taylorbob1

We have had no problems thru Raton Pass, just a normal climb up and then back down.
A good place to stay is the Black Mesa Casino - RV Park which is north of Albuquerque, and south of Santa Fe. It’s on I-25.
Cheap gas, lots of ez access RV spots available and a $10 dump station if you’re just passing thru and need a quick dump.
And hopefully the Casino will be open

Great, the Casino is not on path as we will be coming out of Dallas through Amarillo. I think we hit I-25 right at Raton.

You are giving me some courage. I think as long as I can keep my propane full I should be good. WE were in Fayetteville AR 2 nights where temp hit the 20s, but heater was on and everything was fine. We had no hoop-ups as I seldom use hookups anyway.

[abjbrtd]

Originally Posted by dkoldman

Great, the Casino is not on path as we will be coming out of Dallas through Amarillo. I think we hit I-25 right at Raton.

You are giving me some courage. I think as long as I can keep my propane full I should be good. WE were in Fayetteville AR 2 nights where temp hit the 20s, but heater was on and everything was fine. We had no hoop-ups as I seldom use hookups anyway.

Do you know how/when to adjust for altitude on the generator?
Post #8 by atreis is worth another read.

We've made the DFW trip to CO many times 5th wheel/F250, Class A/F53 and now Class C/E450. The class C gets to the top of Raton doing 40ish the others no problem maintaining 55.

I would like to make a couple of suggestions.

Plan on spending the night, we stop at the Walmart in Trinidad.
If you're making good time there's a truck stop N of Walsenburg on the west side. WATCH FOR WIND GUSTS on that LONG down hill run coming out of Walsenburg.
If your not making good time stop at the campground in Capulin

Don't but gas in NM

Don't wait till you're at the bottom of Raton Pass to start your climb.
I try to be breaking the speed limit by the time we begin the real climb
When your at the top double check to make sure you have tow/haul on, use your brakes firmly but sparingly! Let your speed build to 60ish (55) then firmly brake down to 50ish (40)
Watch those yellow signs that suggest you take this curve @ 25/15/10 IT'S NOT A SUGGESTION

Enjoy

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by atreis

From someone that towed sizeable full-height trailers with minivans for years, in the mountains, including SD, CO, I-68 in MD/WV, and I-77 in NC:

How to tow in mountains:

You need to know your vehicle. Most especially, figure out where the power band is for your engine. This is an RPM range (nothing to do with speed) where the engine produces the most power. If you have a tachometer, you can figure it out by staying in a low gear and revving through the RPM range. There will be a point where you feel noticeably more power, and another point where it falls off. If you don't have a tachometer, you can still do it, but it's a little fuzzier. You figure out the rough engine RPMs by sound, or by knowing what gear you're in and what speed you're going. (Sound is usually easier.) Play with it a bit and you'll get the feel of it.

Engine Noise: Don't be afraid to USE your engine. Yes, it can scream like a banshee at high RPMs if that's where your power band is. It's designed for that. Let it scream! I like to turn the radio off so that I can hear the engine better.

Going up: Goal: Keep the engine in the power band. Don't worry about speed.

At the bottom of the slope, get up to speed (speed limit to a little over). As you start up the slope, put your engine into the power band. The goal here is not to maintain speed, it's to maintain RPMs. Keep the engine in the power band. As the slope gets steep, just keep it in the power band. You'll slow down some, and it will downshift to maintain that level of RPMs. Start at the top of the power band, as you slow down and approach the bottom of the power band, push it to shift. If you stay in the power band, you'll be surprised how good a job it does at maintaining speed. You'll pass big rigs, much larger RVs, etc. driven by people that don't know how to do this or who are afraid to let their engine roar. (Loved passing big diesel pickups with trailers while towing a 21 foot trailer with a minivan!) The big thing to note here is that speed is unimportant. You'll go however fast your vehicle can while maintaining the engine in the power band. Don't stress about it. (Pulling a 19% grade with trailer in a minivan in PA, on a back road that I travel sometimes, I'd end up going no more than 20 mph by the time I got to the top. Interstate grades aren't anywhere near that steep, and I've never fallen below 40 mph on an Interstate.)

Going down: Goal: Control and limit use of the brakes. You don't want them to overheat.

As you approach the start of the downhill, slow down to the minimum speed.
Gravity will take care of making you go faster. As the slope gets steep enough that you start gaining speed without giving it gas, put the engine into high RPMs by downshifting using the shift lever. The friction of the engine will help slow you. (Again, don't be afraid to let it scream.) Let gravity speed you up, don't give it gas unless the slope isn't steep enough for gravity to do it. As you get up to the maximum speed you're comfortable with (not so fast the transmission computer forces an upshift!), brake firmly to slow back down to the minimum speed. So that your speed varies, for instance, between 65 at the high end or whatever is comfortable for you/the speed limit and 45 at the low end. The big thing here: don't ride the brakes. Brake firmly so that you're only applying the brakes for 10-30 seconds and slow down relatively quickly. Then let gravity start speeding you back up again. Repeat this process. Doing this, your brakes have time to cool between applications so that they can continue to work effectively.

Time: Allocate more time for mountain driving so that you're not stressing about that. It takes more attention and a little more mental work to drive in mountains, but once you get the hang of it, it's really not bad.

Thanks if you don't mine, I will copy this verbatim in my SOP for my RV.

I do have question, I have F-53 chassis with Tow Haul. Does it automatically shift up and down maintaining the rpms in range you call power band?

I remember the 1st time I used it in Boston Mountains, I could feel it upshift or downshift (braking) by itself. It scared me at first because I thought I had the Cruise Control on I wish I had a way to force my Tow Haul mode on every time I start it up, but for long trips I tend to remember.

[Pete'sMH]

Lots of good advice here but don’t obsess about any of it. Just go and use common sense. You’ll be fine and your coach will too. It’ll do you proud. There are a few mountain passes that will put you in the truck lane at 45 mph but just go with it. If you have a choice don’t use the 85 octane gas but again, don’t sweat it if you have to buy some of it. It’ll work. It’s beautiful country and I presume that you bought your coach to travel in so just go for it. You’ll have a lot more confidence after you’ve done it once.

[The_Breeze]

"Watch those yellow signs that suggest you take this curve @ 25/15/10 IT'S NOT A SUGGESTION"

There is a lot of good advice here though I would disagree with two statements [paraphrasing].

'Not a RV limitation'. I disagree. The vehicles performance is an important factor in maintaining control, particularly on downhill runs. If your brakes are on the verge of needing to be replaced, then there's a distinct possibility they could fail you when you least need them to.

'Brake for 10 to 30 seconds'. I can't call this absolutely wrong but I don't practice that. Everything written about the approach is correct however, you need to create space between he pads and the disk to cool them. I've found that pumping for 5sec and releasing for 5 results (or thereabouts) result in better breaking - specifically on long downhill runs. 21k miles and brakes have worn VERY little.

Safe travels.

[atreis]

Originally Posted by dkoldman

Thanks if you don't mine, I will copy this verbatim in my SOP for my RV.

I do have question, I have F-53 chassis with Tow Haul. Does it automatically shift up and down maintaining the rpms in range you call power band?

I remember the 1st time I used it in Boston Mountains, I could feel it upshift or downshift (braking) by itself. It scared me at first because I thought I had the Cruise Control on I wish I had a way to force my Tow Haul mode on every time I start it up, but for long trips I tend to remember.

No problem. As for the F-53, I don't know how it behaves with tow/haul on.
Generally, though, no, they don't keep themselves in the power band, so I'd not expect the F-53 to do that either. You have to give it enough gas to stay there, but not let the RPMs get so high that it shifts on you. Practice some in moderate hills, you'll get it.

BTW, I'll be learning a new one this year too. I just got my Four Winds on Chevy Express 4500, but my planned trips this year are pretty mild.

[Lt Keefer]

The only thing I would worry about is the fuel. The oxygenated fuel with it's lower octane can cause the engine to run poorly and can damage the engine and emissions control system over time. It may also void your warranty. In older vehicles, the engine can make an audible "knocking" or "pinging" sound. Many newer vehicles can adjust the spark timing to reduce knock, but engine power and fuel economy will still suffer.

[Bob Denman]

Colorado is plenty safe: just don't feed them after midnight, and don't EVER get them wet!

[rbykid]

[QUOTE=
'Brake for 10 to 30 seconds'. I can't call this absolutely wrong but I don't practice that. Everything written about the approach is correct however, you need to create space between he pads and the disk to cool them. I've found that pumping for 5sec and releasing for 5 results (or thereabouts) result in better breaking - specifically on long downhill runs. 21k miles and brakes have worn VERY little.
Safe travels.[/QUOTE]

Braking 5 sec on and 5 sec off is not what you want to do in tow/haul mode.

Read the manual how to use tow/haul mode and then practice using it. It is your best friend on downhill grades. The engine will hold you back and prevent over heating of the brakes.

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by The_Breeze

"Watch those yellow signs that suggest you take this curve @ 25/15/10 IT'S NOT A SUGGESTION"

There is a lot of good advice here though I would disagree with two statements [paraphrasing].

'Not a RV limitation'. I disagree. The vehicles performance is an important factor in maintaining control, particularly on downhill runs. If your brakes are on the verge of needing to be replaced, then there's a distinct possibility they could fail you when you least need them to.

'Brake for 10 to 30 seconds'. I can't call this absolutely wrong but I don't practice that. Everything written about the approach is correct however, you need to create space between he pads and the disk to cool them. I've found that pumping for 5sec and releasing for 5 results (or thereabouts) result in better breaking - specifically on long downhill runs. 21k miles and brakes have worn VERY little.

Safe travels.

I disagree with your disagreement.

"If your brakes are on the verge of needing to be replaced, then there's a distinct possibility they could fail you when you least need them to."

That's not an RV problem, that's an every vehicle problem. So that would be back to an Operator Problem not maintaining their vehicle.