Battery/Landing Gear Info

Fuentes88 · 05-31-2021, 01:24 PM

Hey everybody! So one of my batteries is completely shot and the other one still has some life. There isn't much info on them other than they are deep cycle and an A18 sticker on it. I have two questions, when looking for a replacement they are organized in category, I'm not sure what category mine is. Can anyone point me in the right direction? What brand do you guys prefer for longevity and warranty? I live in Vegas so you can imagine they will take a beating, the RV is a fifth wheel - 06 Jazz by Thor 32' with one slide out.

I will also be attempting to replace the motor and landing gear box, it started slipping about a year ago and recently a pin the connects the legs together broke. I wish i had the funds to replace with the Reese set up with individual motors but for now this will do. Motor has been sounding weaker and weaker each use, im sure the battery has something to do with this but anything special i should consider when doing this job? Seems pretty straight forward.

Thanks for your help!

javelin · 05-31-2021, 04:12 PM

Sounds like “maybe” you should be replacing both your coach batteries (assuming they or your charge system are damaged) and I would highly suggest that when you do that, you also should check your battery charger (converter) and charging system with a multimeter to make sure that it is actually working to properly charge your new batteries. No sense buying new batteries only to have them sulphate to an early death from a poor or non-working charging system. I can’t recommend what to buy because everyone has an opinion about this topic. I personally will always use lead acid wet cell batteries (cheap and reliable if looked after), because I monitor my charging system regularly and seasonally check water levels in the batteries. I am a seasonal camper so this works for me. I don’t know what group size batteries your coach takes, but you can measure them and compare dimensions to the table attached, which should help zero in on the group size that will fit your battery compartment.

I am not a 5th wheel landing gear expert by any stretch, but a broken pin anywhere on that apparatus sounds like a serious safety problem waiting to happen. Replace/repair it. Also low battery voltage will most certainly cause motor problems for you by increasing current through the motor windings and will probably reduce the life of your motor. You may find that with fully recharged batteries the motor behaves like it should again if gears are OK. I would personally inspect the landing gear and lubricate lead screws and gearing as required, assuming all the gears are still in good condition. If not repair them and make sure they are properly lubricated. Safe camping.

DavidEM · 05-31-2021, 04:58 PM

A Group 31 battery (surprised it isn't listed in the table above, maybe close to a G34) will fit into most battery compartments whether they originally came with G24, 27s or whatever. Whether in flooded lead acid (FLA) or AGM type they provide about 100 amp hours of capacity.

Sams or Costco is a good source for FLAs which can't be shipped. Amazon has shippable G31s from Renogy or WindyNation for about $200 each. Read up on the pluses and minuses of each type and decide.

I would definitely replace both at the same time.

David

Fuentes88 · 06-01-2021, 12:59 PM

Morning! So i tested them when i found them dead in march and one was faulty the other tested ok but i may just replace them both since its being suggested and maybe just to have a fresh start. I will look into some lead acid wet cell batteries (cheap and reliable if looked after) and start making this a regular thing to check on. Do you guys go as far as to removing and storing the batteries or just using the kill switch that comes with it? As far as testing the charging system am i just plugging it in to my truck and checking the voltage as if i was testing an alternator? As far as the landing gear motor im hoping it not shot but im sure the gear box is on its was out, it was defiantly starting to slip before the batteries were bad. I may start with the gearbox and batteries and see how that goes. I will also look into lubricating the system in addition to anything else that should be lubricated routinely. I believe i saw a thread somewhere on here.

Thanks Javelin and David for your info it is much appreciated!

javelin · 06-01-2021, 03:37 PM

Well, being a seasonal camper I park the RV for Winter and I do remove all batteries from the coach and store them in an unheated attached garage. We can hit -40F = -40C on occasion here. I do not use a trickle charger on them, but once a month in off season, all batteries get a monthly equalization charge (on a timer- 3 hours max) and then auto drop back to float charge for a few more hours. Then they sit uncharged until the next month. Removing all batteries from the coach forces me to clean the batteries; check water levels (use distilled only if adding water is required); plus I clean up the RV battery bays as required. Regarding the converter testing, I don’t do anything special, but have installed an inexpensive digital dual readout voltage monitor by the door that I can flip on/off any time I want to check battery voltage on coach and chassis batteries. I would suggest buying yourself an inexpensive digital multimeter and check your charger/battery voltages after replacing batteries to ensure that your converter’s charging stages are working properly and are not sitting in equalization mode forever as an example (overcharging and boiling wet cell batteries dry). My batteries float at about 13.1vdc and during camping season they are always being charged on shore when not on the road or camping. Each to his own of course. Good luck with your landing gear repairs and happy camping.

Bob Denman · 06-01-2021, 04:07 PM

If one battery s already dead, and the other is just "okay...

": do yourself a favor, and get 2 new batteries...

Fuentes88 · 06-03-2021, 03:26 PM

Good info!

So I just replaced the landing gears inside the lead leg, didn't appear to bad overall but the pin was broken and the kit came with the gears, next time around I'll be doing the individual legs/motor but did that kit, The gearbox and motor. Just need to get some batteries, I'll be replacing both, any final suggestions/recommendations In addition to what has already been provided for batteries? Thanks

OldWEB · 06-03-2021, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuentes88

Good info!

So I just replaced the landing gears inside the lead leg, didn't appear to bad overall but the pin was broken and the kit came with the gears, next time around I'll be doing the individual legs/motor but did that kit, The gearbox and motor. Just need to get some batteries, I'll be replacing both, any final suggestions/recommendations In addition to what has already been provided for batteries? Thanks

That sounds like a simple fix! Read the many posts on what size/style/voltage of batteries to install, also what room you have. Some go for larger 6 volt (two in series) to give them more capacity... depends what you need or how you use them.
As for charging, you mentioned earlier "As far as testing the charging system am i just plugging it in to my truck and checking the voltage as if i was testing an alternator?" are you implying it is charged from your truck? They are normally charged from the TTs built in converter.

Fuentes88 · 06-03-2021, 04:24 PM

I have plenty of room and I carry a generator. Just looking for the best battery that will take this Vegas heat and has had the best overall experience with you fellow campers. As far as testing the charging system i just don't have an idea where to start. I am pretty handy so I'm sure I can figure it out just looking to see how you guys go about testing it so I could test mine. Once I get the batteries I plan to take the rv to a park to finish the maintenance and give it a good clean up.

OldWEB · 06-03-2021, 05:19 PM

Oh my Grasshopper, you have much to read!

Just start on the 'net
https://is.gd/wEYGUB

Fuentes88 · 06-04-2021, 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldWEB

Oh my Grasshopper, you have much to read!

Just start on the 'net
https://is.gd/wEYGUB

Si si si!

Ok so after reading through a couple articles and with some on the information provided here i bout two new batteries from Costco group size 24, they are currently in boxes and they were a little too small for the 27s but at $75 each it will hold me over for the next year hopefully 2. Since it 108 degrees here ill be installing them tonight or tomorrow and test out the landing gear. Then ill get it to a rv site to start some other maintenance like checking the charging system and get it ready for out july trip!

OldWEB · 06-04-2021, 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuentes88

Si si si!

Ok so after reading through a couple articles and with some on the information provided here i bout two new batteries from Costco group size 24, they are currently in boxes and they were a little too small for the 27s but at $75 each it will hold me over for the next year hopefully 2. Since it 108 degrees here ill be installing them tonight or tomorrow and test out the landing gear. Then ill get it to a rv site to start some other maintenance like checking the charging system and get it ready for out july trip!

It is highly recommended you charge up the batteries before using them, maybe Costco did?? You say you are unsure if the charging system works, so when you connect them in the TT, check the voltage on the batteries, then plug the TT into an outlet and check the voltage again, the converter should charge them to 13.5 - 14.0VDC or there abouts, but higher than when not plug into an outlet.
At the very least, connect an automotive charger to them to get them fully charged.
I do not live in a HOT climate, only hot July/August months but treat the batteries like you do for your vehicles, check and top off the levels the more they are used.

OldWEB · 06-04-2021, 12:53 AM

Are you able to "plug in" the TT where it is located? Using a cheater cord/adapter maybe?

FYI, the converter (charger) is typically located inside the lower part of the breaker panel of the TT. You may have an upgraded converter, located elsewhere or you may even have an inverter and IT may have a charger built in (in that case the converter should have been disabled).
Only you know what set-up you have.

Fuentes88 · 06-04-2021, 01:02 PM

Dang it! I didn’t see that anywhere in those articles I read but I will get them on the charger now. Thank you for the heads up man, I’m really glad I joined this forum!

Tt for travel trailer? Well I have it parked on the street at the moment I don’t think running an extension cord out that would be good my luck somebody would trip over and sue me. So I’m gonna charge of these batteries, get this thing on my truck and then I will be taking it to an RV site so I can start doing the tests on the charging system, giving it a good clean up as well while I’m there.

OldWEB · 06-04-2021, 01:26 PM

Yes, TT = Travel Trailer; You did not mention the name of yer "beast".
Just for a test you could run the generator and that will also feed the converter to charge the batteries.
Running the generator to exercise it is good, also turn on the A/C for load.

Fuentes88 · 06-04-2021, 11:55 PM

So I have and 06 jazz by Thor fifth wheel. Funny I actually just told my wife we need to name it because I saw a thread and was going through some names so that will probably happen sometime soon possibly during our July trip so we can make it a family decision. It doesn’t have a generator I take one with me around, I actually just bought one a couple months ago during Black Friday got a killer deal on one. I’ll be getting that thing out of the box and up and running soon as well. Put the batteries on a slow charge this morning they were only down to about six fall so very glad you mention that, I have them on a trickle charger now to try and finish them up.

OldWEB · 06-05-2021, 01:38 AM

You asked about removing or just disconnecting the batteries earlier. Like javelin, my temps drop to -40 at times but I have never removed them for the winter. I fully charge them when I store the beast and disconnect the terminals, been lucky the last 5 years as come spring their voltages are all (chassis included) at 12.7V.
So I think as long as you disconnect them, they should be good. Also think of the crime rate in the storage area.... batteries and the catalytic converter are easy targets.

Here are some good "Jazz" nicknames!

Kenny "Pancho" Hagood
Michael "Dodo" Marmarosa
"Mr. Five by Five," Jimmy Rushing
"Fat Girl," aka Theodore "Fats" Navarro
David "Fathead" Newman
Eddie "Cleanhead" Vinson
Jimmy "Spanky" DeBrest
Joe "Tricky Sam" Nanton
James "Bubber" Miley
"Big Eye" Louis Nelson Delisl

Chateau29Z · 06-09-2021, 11:06 PM

One of the most common mistakes in house batteries is putting in 12 V batteries and wiring them in parallel. As soon as one cell gets weak, a current loop starts and the rest of the cells get drained trying to bring the weakest up to the same level. The series hookups can’t make a current loop except when they are being used to power something.

**16ACE27** · 06-09-2021, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chateau29Z

One of the most common mistakes in house batteries is putting in 12 V batteries and wiring them in parallel. As soon as one cell gets weak, a current loop starts and the rest of the cells get drained trying to bring the weakest up to the same level. The series hookups can’t make a current loop except when they are being used to power something.

If you have two 12 volt batteries in parallel and a cell goes bad in one of them you can disconnect that battery and still have 12 VDC available from the other one.

If you have two 6 volt batteries in series and a cell goes bad in one of them you are SOL until you get a new battery.

There is no "mistake" in selecting either configuration - it is personal preference.

Beau388 · 06-10-2021, 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chateau29Z

One of the most common mistakes in house batteries is putting in 12 V batteries and wiring them in parallel. As soon as one cell gets weak, a current loop starts and the rest of the cells get drained trying to bring the weakest up to the same level. The series hookups can’t make a current loop except when they are being used to power something.

Can't happen unless a cell is shorted. LA cell charging voltage is 2.183 to 2.255 volts depending on temperature. Discharging voltage is a max of 2.122 volts. No way a cell requiring 2.183 volts can be charged by a cell putting our 2.122 volts. If you have a weak cell in a 12 volt battery, the overall voltage will be ok until you start to draw amps from the battery, then the watts will drawn will decrease the voltage below what you expect and the total available amp-hs will be less. When recharging the battery, the weak cell will use much more water than the active cells. It is all inorganic chemistry.

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