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Old 05-08-2018, 12:51 AM   #1
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Five 5 Star Tuning question

I posted questions about 5 Star Tuning on the Ford V10 a couple of years ago when I first got or MH. I even think the owner of 5 Star chimed in. Two years later and we are really starting to use the MH. Just returned from a trip 300 miles MD to Hatterus Island NC. The constant shifting while in cruise control was unnerving to say the least.

Interested in feedback from anyone who has had the 5 Star Tuning performed! Pros and cons please.

Thanks!
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Old 05-08-2018, 01:04 AM   #2
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There is not a magic bullet for the constant shifting BUT the 5 Star Tune definitely makes driving much improved. We just got back from a 3200 mile trip in just over 3 weeks - not what we normally would undertake but definitely a good trip. We took went via KC, Mo on the way west and I-10/I-40 on the way east. As I've reported the sweet spot for drivability is 67 mph. Combine that with a bit of attention going up hills and the coach really is easy to drive.

One of the places that the 5 Star really helps is on-ramps. While our coach is no sports car, it is definitely improved.

Would I buy the 5 Star again - you betcha.
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Old 05-08-2018, 04:18 AM   #3
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There is not just one tune, basically there is a tune for each chassis and for each year chassis. If you are not satisfied with the first tune, just shoot them an e-mail with what you want (with in reason) and in about a week you will receive a new tune. I was happy with the first engine tune but the down shift schedule for the 6-speed need to be more aggressive. The second tune the down shift schedule was too aggressive and delayed up-shifts too much for my liking. The third try is perfect. what more could you want from a company?
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Old 05-08-2018, 04:33 AM   #4
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40 hp and 70 ft-lap torque doesn't hurt. I noticed it kind of hunkers down and feels kind of beast like. I noticed on ramps are more inviting. Shifting runs through the gears more evenly. Especially the mid gears. I try not to hit these numbers for gas reasons, but 70+ mph is easy to cruise around in. That and a SafeSteer really helped overall tighten up the MH.
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Old 05-08-2018, 10:16 AM   #5
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Five Star is great!!! Better shifting, better acceleration, and I get slightly better mpg. I’ve had my Tune for a little over a year and a half and wouldn’t go back. After I had my Tune for a couple of weeks I called Five Star and asked them to make a couple of tweaks, they are super nice to work with, they sent a new tune and I’m a Very happy camper.
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Old 05-10-2018, 05:31 PM   #6
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Does making this tune affect the factory warranty?
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Old 05-10-2018, 07:16 PM   #7
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Does making this tune affect the factory warranty?

Short answer, it can. Ford would have to have a specific reason to void the warranty and be ready to prove it. I have seen Ford dealers selling the 5 Star Tunes. I have one on my F150 and it is really great but I am waiting on the V10 until the warranty expires.
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Old 05-10-2018, 08:26 PM   #8
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If you're adding it for better driveability then it's possibly worth the expense. If your tuning it for better mpg, save your money. It's #1 a Ford #2 a V10 not built to get good fuel mileage, so the 1/2 mile per gallon you might get would take about 2 lifetimes to ever recoup the cost of the tunes.
Don't have a Ford or a V10 but have driven them enough to know they are VERY thirsty. Also have added so called performance enhancements to other vehicles & have never realized enough improvement in driving or economy to ever spend the $$$ again. Just my .02 cents.
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Old 05-10-2018, 09:18 PM   #9
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If you'ved installed the 5star tune, uninstall before you go for official Ford maintenance, the box saves your old factory tune if needed. Then you can reinstall the 5star when you get it back ready to travel. It's about a 15min process.
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Old 05-11-2018, 12:08 AM   #10
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Love the way the 5 Star made driving our Quantum WS31 so much less hassle. Would do it again in a minuite.

The cost is well worth the easier and quieter driving.
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Old 05-11-2018, 12:51 AM   #11
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Guess it would depend on what your warranty issue is. Unless there is a specific reason Ford would not look to see if a Tune was installed, it’s just not something they routinely look for. If there was a problem Ford would have to PROVE the Tune caused the problem, very hard to do!
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Old 05-11-2018, 01:55 PM   #12
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Love the way the 5 Star made driving our Quantum WS31 so much less hassle. Would do it again in a minuite.

The cost is well worth the easier and quieter driving.
What year is your Quantum? I've heard that 5 Star works well for the older units, but for the newer ones with the 6-speed trans it doesn't do much.
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Old 05-11-2018, 02:07 PM   #13
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What year is your Quantum? I've heard that 5 Star works well for the older units, but for the newer ones with the 6-speed trans it doesn't do much.
Ours is a 2017, with the 6 speed. It works supurbly
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Old 07-16-2018, 01:53 PM   #14
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This is hands down the best upgrade you can do for your v10 mh. If gas mileage is what you are worried about than donít buy a mh. It seems like it actually made my engine noise quieter. If you havenít bought 5 star tune yet, go get it and you will be amazed at the difference in drivability.
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Old 07-16-2018, 05:50 PM   #15
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I can tell you guys from my actually looking at the engine and trans calibrations in some of these late model Ford's, there is a TON of potential for increased efficiency, power and a little bit of light load gas mileage increase. The stock "tune" is extremely conservative to say the least.

The two biggest factors hindering the performance, engine safety and efficiency are PE (Power Enrichment) fueling and ignition timing. Power enrichment is when the fuel mixtures go from stoich to the richer mixtures that are needed for maximum power. Ford, like several other manufacturers, delays the switch into PE. The difference with Ford is they delay it for 60 SECONDS!!! That means when you go WOT to pull that grade, your engine is running dangerously lean for a full minute until it starts getting the proper amount of fuel. They basically depend on Cat Converter overtemp and a few other strategies to keep the pistons from melting. This is done for emission and mileage reasons. It's basically the worst thing you can do to an engine if you want it to run properly.

Secondly is ignition timing. These late model Ford V10's DO NOT HAVE KNOCK SENSORS!!! (Shocking if you know anything about modern engine management.) What that means is they have no way of knowing or protecting themselves from piston damaging engine knock. So how do they spec cheap 87 octane gas in these engines and still keep them from blowing up under all the different conditions everything from trucks and vans to loaded box vans or huge Class A motorhomes will encounter? They keep the ignition timing WAAAAAYYYY retarded. That way even in the worst conditions, like in Death Valley, pulling a toad with a 30' Class A, in 110 degree heat at sea level, it still won't knock.

The problem with that is for the guy in the little 23' RV, not towing anything, at 2000' and nice 72 degree weather, his ignition timing is anywhere from 10 to even 20 DEGREES away from optimum. That could be costing him a ton of power and efficiency, not to mention being much harder on the engine itself running overly retarded ignition timing.

I've personally tuned my V10. I've been "tuning" engines for a living since the '70's. I've taught guys on the tuning forums how to read their engine calibrations, what the tables mean in the tuning programs and how to interpret all the information in log files. I know what I'm looking at when I look at one of these engine calibration files. I can guaranty you there is room for improved engine efficiency in most all of these late model Ford engine calibrations. The trans calibrations are much better since '16 or so, there's not a ton that can be gained there imho. Personally, I'd MUCH rather have a GM 6 speed in my RV than the Ford 6 speed, but that's another subject. lol. The Ford 6 speed and it's calibrations are "OK" stock.

This is me trying to "tone down" the hit of the power in the engine I built for this Pirelli World Challenge GTS car. The test driver we had in the car that day kept coming back in saying "This thing is TOO strong, it's hard for me to control it in the turns". lol. He's a world class pro driver. I was able to smooth out the power delivery but maintain the peak power for the straights. He was thrilled with the car and wanted to race it after that, but the car owner/driver wanted that privilege. Unfortunately he was a little too aggressive on the clutch and exploded the rear dif on the standing start of the Long Beach Grand Prix shortly after that track tuning session.
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Old 07-16-2018, 08:52 PM   #16
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Diagnostics?

Is there a counterpart to the tuning upload that lets you download current state profiles so you can compare it to altered states or is that different/separate software? I believe someone may have referred to them as 'logs' so it would be something that could parse the logs into human-readable data points.
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Old 07-16-2018, 09:01 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmtech16450yz View Post
...

I've personally tuned my V10. I've been "tuning" engines for a living since the '70's.
What software do you use/recommend for evaluating and modifying ROM files?
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Old 07-17-2018, 10:54 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by RvEd View Post
Is there a counterpart to the tuning upload that lets you download current state profiles so you can compare it to altered states or is that different/separate software? I believe someone may have referred to them as 'logs' so it would be something that could parse the logs into human-readable data points.
I use Motec, EFILive and HPTuners. Mostly HPTuners, and that's what I'm using on the Ford E450. 5 Star uses SCT, more of a "baby" program and hardware but easier for inexperienced users.

You can do pretty much whatever you want as far as comparing calibration file differences and logging lots of data. Comparing one file to another that I've made changes to is something I do all the time, it's a valuable tool. I have thousands of calibration files, often a couple thousand on one particular vehicle alone. Same with log files, hundreds or thousands of logs on any particular engine isn't uncommon for me. I've barely touched on the tuning and logging in my Vegas and I think I already have 80 or 90 tunes and logs. A log file can be anything from 10 seconds to 3 hours, you just start and stop logging whenever you want. A tune file usually takes about 3 minutes to do a full read and 30 seconds to do a re-write. It's all done through USB, an interface and the OBDII terminal.

On the Ford I'm currently logging 46 PID's or parameters at one time, other engines are more or less. You pick which data you want to log and look at. You can control the frequency of the data streams, value ranges, min and max ranges, sensitivity, etc, etc. The log files can look pretty intimidating but if you know what you're looking at they're amazingly useful. As far as the calibration editing software, there are hundreds, sometimes thousands of tables, values, lookup charts, and controls that can be changed. You can REALLY f-up an engine fast if you don't know what you're doing! If you know what you're doing, you can make an engine run pretty much anyway you'd like it. I had a little roadster with an 800+hp supercharged E85 burning V8 engine in it and I could put anyone from a new driver to somebodies grandma in that car and it was so smooth and controllable they'd be totally safe with all that power. It's all in the engine calibration.

Here's a few random screenshots I had online that show some of the editing and logging software... All those squiggly lines tell a story. Sometimes it's just a tiny little blip in the trace that tells you why the engine is doing something that the driver can feel. If any of you want to understand what any of it means, I'm happy to explain. One of those logs is actually from my Vegas.


(Hey, my video finally works in my signature! I tried adding it when I first joined on here but it wouldn't let me add the hyperlink for some reason. If any of you guys are even slightly into cars, watch my video.)
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Old 07-17-2018, 11:00 PM   #19
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There's a whole lot of meat in that sandwich!
Thanks for posting it!
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Old 07-18-2018, 01:39 PM   #20
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Thanks for all the info and what Bob said and...


Ohhhh HONEY! I KNOW WHAT I WANT FOR CHRISTMAS THIS YEAR!

Seriously - if I read things right, you can get started for around $300? It looks like the editor download (VCM Suite) is free and the MPVI2 is $300 (plus shipping)? That seems awfully reasonable. What am I missing?



Your 3rd paragraph description sounds very much like server performance counters and the graphs mimic that to a degree as well. Performance counters measure processes. PIDs in my old world are Process IDs; unique numbers to identify a process running on the machine. They do change depending on when the were started. I sense your acronym stands for something different?

I obviously have to save this for another day but hmmmm...one can certainly dream. Being a 50yr old gearhead and 35yr computer geek, this brings both my worlds together in one place. And I get to learn something new, which really cranks me up. I saved their link and will read more as I can. Time to go check on the RV. https://www.hptuners.com


Thanks again.
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