House Batteries and Generator Running By themselves!

[AAL787]

Originally Posted by eenie34@hotmail.com

I have a Fourwinds 23U that is acting very strange. When I drive down the road the generator comes on all by itself. When it is parked at my storage unit I keep getting calls that my generator is running. When I get there the house batteries are in use(radio is on) and the generator is running. This has happened at least 6 times in the last month. Service company doesn't really know what to do - they want to replace a wire in the generator( at least 4 hours labor) thinking this will take care of it. My question is how are the house batteries turning on by themselves? i figure the generator is turning on when the house batteries get too low. Does anybody have any ideas? HELP!

I had the same problem and Cummins had to repair it. Apparently the rocker switch on the unit itself was malfunctioning. The issue was traced back to the PCB control board. Both had to be replaced. All good now - glad it was under warranty.

[cavie]

Originally Posted by eenie34@hotmail.com

The radio is on every time I go to turn the generator off. How could the house batteries turn the radio on without me leaving the batteries in Use mode?

The radio is NOT turned off by the battery disconect in use mode. neither is the co and lP detectors. Install a disconnect directly on the battery and all will be good.
https://www.harborfreight.com/batter...RoCECoQAvD_BwE

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by eenie34@hotmail.com

I always store my RV with the house batteries in the storage mode it is popping on by itself.

If this is true, you must have two problems

If you leave switch in STORE mode then there is no power, so Genset cannot possible start.

If you claim that the switch somehow changes by itself from Store to Use yiu must have defective switch.

That was problem #1


Problem #2 is for Genset to turn on by itself. You are not clear on whether you have AGS controller or not... ?

Lets assume you do. Mine is will turn on generator by itself if House or Chassis batteries hits 12.2vDC or if the Thermostats makes a call to turn on the AC based on set temperature. Bu the AGS need to be in Auto Mode to do that. Place AGS in Manual mode and this issue is resolved with the auto start

If you do not have AGS, the wiring from inside is wrong. I would have them verify the right leads are connected as you may have wires crossed that is sending signal to generator calling for it to Start.

The suggestion you got for disconnect switch is the simplest cheapest way to to stop for sure.

On a side note, is another dealer an option? This should be easy fix for qualified RV tech.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by AAL787

I had the same problem and Cummins had to repair it. Apparently the rocker switch on the unit itself was malfunctioning. The issue was traced back to the PCB control board. Both had to be replaced. All good now - glad it was under warranty.

Are you saying that even if the disconnect switch was in STORE mode, the problem with Cummins could still start the generator?

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by dkoldman

Are you saying that even if the disconnect switch was in STORE mode, the problem with Cummins could still start the generator?

The generator connection to the house batteries is separate from the DC buss connection through the USE/STORE switch. It goes through a separate 100 amp DC breaker.

[eenie34@hotmail.com]

Originally Posted by 16ACE27

The generator connection to the house batteries is separate from the DC buss connection through the USE/STORE switch. It goes through a separate 100 amp DC breaker.

Well, they have now had it two weeks and still can't find the issue. Only dealer in the area. I contacted THOR and they said they would have their electrical engineer contact them to help. I am going to print out all of your replies and give them to the dealer - maybe it will give them a budge to look out of the box. Thanks everyone.

[eenie34@hotmail.com]

Originally Posted by eenie34@hotmail.com

Well, they have now had it two weeks and still can't find the issue. Only dealer in the area. I contacted THOR and they said they would have their electrical engineer contact them to help. I am going to print out all of your replies and give them to the dealer - maybe it will give them a budge to look out of the box. Thanks everyone.

By the way - according to THOR this unit definitely does not have an AGS switch.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by 16ACE27

The generator connection to the house batteries is separate from the DC buss connection through the USE/STORE switch. It goes through a separate 100 amp DC breaker.

Wow ah man!!!!! I guess I can add that as another difference with the electrical wiring of the two manufacturers?

I have 3 ways to start my Generator

1. Factory inside wall switch
2. Start/Off button on the 5500 itself
3. Factory Installed Option EC-30 AGS that also has the prime feature.

Based on what I just learned, I ....
1. Disconnected Shore power
2. Turned my Disconnect Switch to off
3. No Power Could not start with Factory inside wall switch
4. No Power Could not start with EC-30 AGS Controller Switch
5. No Power Could not start at the 5500 itself

So I conclude on my coach if that Disconnect Switch is OFF, then my Generator ain't starting no matter what, which I see as a good thing. As Stop mean Stop, Off should mean Off When I turn OFF ain't nothing happening off the House batteries.

So for OP his best case immediate fix is what Cavie suggested; which is put Disconnect Switch on House batteries. From what I have learned for a Thor you will need that ANYWAY even if his Genset was not acting erratic.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by eenie34@hotmail.com

Well, they have now had it two weeks and still can't find the issue. Only dealer in the area. I contacted THOR and they said they would have their electrical engineer contact them to help. I am going to print out all of your replies and give them to the dealer - maybe it will give them a budge to look out of the box. Thanks everyone.

Good luck. I can't wait to see what you learn. It is great that Thor will have someone work with your dealer. You have to have some faulty control board or some wires that shorted and sending false call signal to the board to request to it to start. You don't see any chewed up wires by mice or anything?

Calling Cummings directly is also an option in the event Thor does not work out with Dealer.

[Bob Denman]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSospSmAGL4

[EA37TS]

Put the use store switch in the store position and then check for voltage at the 12VDC input lug on the generator. That lug is. easy to get to and checking with a multimeter will confirm whether or not the generator is getting voltage with the switch in store. If 12VDC is present then install a battery disconnect.

[javelin]

Interesting problem. If there is no AGS in your coach then the Gen computer is getting a start signal from somewhere......possibly as AAL787 suggested a bad start switch (either in the coach or on the Gen itself); intermittent short in the start circuit or perhaps a flaky Gen computer. It would not be the first time on this forum that folks have found a staple through the Gen control cable coming from the inside control panel Gen start switch (with intermittent start/stop problems resulting). Typically there is a cable connection at the Gen where the inside switch cable connects to the Gen computer.....you could try to disconnect that temporarily to see if problem goes away. If it does, then you know it could be a damaged cable (staple) or bad start switch inside the coach. Try isolating the problem.


Just to clarify, “on many coaches” the Use/Store switch does not necessarily prevent the Gen from starting (typically off House batteries). As 16ACE27 says, the 100Amp breaker directly connected to the house batteries in many coaches, is typically the protection/disconnect device for the Gen starter (and for the hydraulic pump jack motor too); not the use/store latching relay. That is not to say that all coaches are wired this way (evidenced by dkoldman’s coach testing). This would probably mean though that the use/store latching relay and related wiring in his coach would have to rated for both Gen start current as well as regular coach DC charging and other loads current. (not impossible to do by design).


Last comment (FWIW) is that my radio (2013 ACE) is turned off by turning off the coach battery disconnect latching relay......but my coach has separate latching relays (one for coach batteries and one for chassis battery) from the factory. Again depending on how your coach is wired, the use/store may not in fact disconnect all DC powered items. That is why it is important for all RVers to learn their coach systems and what they control (or not).

[Capt.Tom]

Originally Posted by dkoldman

Wow ah man!!!!! I guess I can add that as another difference with the electrical wiring of the two manufacturers?

I have 3 ways to start my Generator

1. Factory inside wall switch
2. Start/Off button on the 5500 itself
3. Factory Installed Option EC-30 AGS that also has the prime feature.

Based on what I just learned, I ....
1. Disconnected Shore power
2. Turned my Disconnect Switch to off
3. No Power Could not start with Factory inside wall switch
4. No Power Could not start with EC-30 AGS Controller Switch
5. No Power Could not start at the 5500 itself

So I conclude on my coach if that Disconnect Switch is OFF, then my Generator ain't starting no matter what, which I see as a good thing. As Stop mean Stop, Off should mean Off When I turn OFF ain't nothing happening off the House batteries.

So for OP his best case immediate fix is what Cavie suggested; which is put Disconnect Switch on House batteries. From what I have learned for a Thor you will need that ANYWAY even if his Genset was not acting erratic.

I purchased a disconnect switch to install because of parasitic draining of my house batteries. The 1st set didn't last a year. They are very common on boats, i don't know why not on motorhomes.

[Calico]

Did you check under the bed for any hobos that may be using the unit in your absence?

[musicflog]

I've got a 2015 Axis and the generator would sometimes kick on. I took off the cover to get to the radio and discovered the wire to the switch that turns the generator on from the front panel was loose. Whenever this wire touched any metal, it would start the generator. It was an easy fix--at first I just put electrical tape around the bare wire and then had my brother-in-law-the-electrician reconnect the wire to the switch from which it had come off.

I'm the last person who would ever be a mechanic or an electrician, but this is what happened to me.

[aa0ri]

I had a Tiffin Phaeton pusher that I bought in 2004 and full timed in it for 12 years. Occasionally the generator would start and there would be no apparent reason for it. My Phaeton did not have auto start on it. The factory service facility in Red Bay, AL thought I was kidding them or making it up but low and behold it started while they were talking with me about it. Their best electrical tech worked on it for a whole day and fixed it. They never would tell me what he found, I'm guessing a mistake in the wiring, loose connection or intermitent short but it CAN AND DOES HAPPEN for some reason. Nothing else came on as we were living in it and would have known.



We lived in that rig for 10 years after that and it never happened again.


Good luck finding and fixing your problem.

[Dls100]

I had the same problem

Could not find problem but mine would even start setting in drive way

My wiring under middle of motorhome had dropped down and was touching
drive shaft and ware thur the wiring and was shorting with the power for the step wire.

Thor had not supported the wires under

[The_Breeze]

Originally Posted by Bob Denman

Hmm inspired by Alan Parsons maybe?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3YZgQvzofE

[HarryP]

I have a 2016 Thor Tuscany with the AGS...after we bought it we discovered 1,776 hours on the generator...the generator would go on when we were driving down the freeway and it would go on when the coach was parked, (not stored). After working with a number of techs, checking out what we thought was a generator problem, we discovered two of the four coach batteries were shot. Unfortunately, it is recommended you replace all four batteries together. Here I am, four batteries later and the generator has not been triggered by the AGS.
I always disconnect the batteries when the coach is in storage.
Good luck.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by HarryP

I have a 2016 Thor Tuscany with the AGS...after we bought it we discovered 1,776 hours on the generator...the generator would go on when we were driving down the freeway and it would go on when the coach was parked, (not stored). After working with a number of techs, checking out what we thought was a generator problem, we discovered two of the four coach batteries were shot. Unfortunately, it is recommended you replace all four batteries together. Here I am, four batteries later and the generator has not been triggered by the AGS.
I always disconnect the batteries when the coach is in storage.
Good luck.

How did they tell you two bad batteries were causing the generator to start?

Only connection would be for your AGS to read the batteries voltage, and if voltage kept dropping erratically due to bad batteries, the only reason the AGS would start if it were in AGS Auto mode. That would be by design. Did they show you have to switch AGS to Manual vs Auto and vice versa. Think about it, the AGS (if it the Auto position) may have been trying to charge those bad batteries.

What am I missing?