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Old 04-12-2018, 05:20 PM   #1
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Challenger 37 GT
State: North Carolina
Posts: 54
THOR #7843
No DC power without Tshore power

Hi, Trying to figure out the latest trouble with my Challenger MH.

The only time I have DC power for lights, slides, anything DC is when I'm on shore power and it runs off the Converter. The Inverter and everything it powers runs and always has AC power just no DC.

I have traced the trouble down to this box under the hood. The lugs on the side of the box are The top lug goes to the Chassis battery and is connected to the 2nd lug through a relay which goes to the Coach batteries and there is power to both lugs 1 and 2 all the time. The 3rd lug goes to the house Panel - DC fuse panel inside the coach and is tied with the wire coming from the Converter. When shore power is on, the converter sends DC power to all and I have power at the box under the hood on the 3rd lug. When shore power is disconnected I have no power on the 3rd lug. I do still have DC power on lugs 1 and 2 constantly. Off hand Iím not sure it should have power on both lugs, I mean what is the point of the relay? Could this be back fed somehow? Not sure that is a problem but just seems odd.

Iím not sure which one in this box is the switch, relay, or fuse that is giving me the trouble. The diagram on the panel door is not very helpful and the box is really hard to get access to tell what is what.

Any suggestions for what I do next, I have eaten and entire bag of Smarties and I still canít seem to figure out the trouble! (I think my bag was defective!)

Thanks
Don
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Old 04-12-2018, 05:37 PM   #2
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Model: Axis 24.1
State: Michigan
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THOR #1150
You have an RV Custom Products board which means you have a use/store switch. Are you sure your use/store switch is not on use? (Simple question: "Is it turned on?")
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Old 04-12-2018, 05:57 PM   #3
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THOR #8860
If that is set to the "Store" position: wouldn't that keep him from seeing any DC power?

Or am I forgetting something? (AGAIN! )
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Old 04-12-2018, 05:58 PM   #4
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Challenger 37 GT
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THOR #7843
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamieGeek View Post
You have an RV Custom Products board which means you have a use/store switch. Are you sure your use/store switch is not on use? (Simple question: "Is it turned on?")
The use/store switch does activate the relay in the box however it has power on both sides of the relay at all times even with no shore power and if it is on or off and doesn't turn the power off. That is why I'm thinking feed back somewhere but doesn't explain the no DC part. I have checked and rechecked all connections and I'm going to retrace the wires again (you know what they say the 1348th time is the charm!).
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Old 04-12-2018, 06:19 PM   #5
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THOR #8860
The best of luck to you!!
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Old 04-12-2018, 10:39 PM   #6
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2013 ACE 30.1
State: Alberta
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THOR #2631
Hi, my 2013 ACE 30.1 has a BCC box in the engine compartment. Inside this BCC is a circuit board and the chassis and coach battery latching relays. It also has a resettable 50 Amp circuit breaker (CB5) mounted on the cct board which can trip under some circumstances. This is the grey thing shown in your picture |I think. It should have a reset button on it if it is the same as my rig. You might just need to reset this cct breaker. On my coach it is a bear to get into the BCC and care must be taken to ensure safe electrical practise is used (you dont want any 12v welding to occur). There is a PDF document link on the internet to this BCC with a schematic and full operational description. Search Google "FW221 BCC" for the pdf. I think it is labelled pdf "untitled" now. Hope this helps you out.
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Old 04-12-2018, 11:34 PM   #7
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Challenger 37 GT
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THOR #7843
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Originally Posted by javelin View Post
Hi, my 2013 ACE 30.1 has a BCC box in the engine compartment. Inside this BCC is a circuit board and the chassis and coach battery latching relays. It also has a resettable 50 Amp circuit breaker (CB5) mounted on the cct board which can trip under some circumstances. This is the grey thing shown in your picture |I think. It should have a reset button on it if it is the same as my rig. You might just need to reset this cct breaker. On my coach it is a bear to get into the BCC and care must be taken to ensure safe electrical practise is used (you dont want any 12v welding to occur). There is a PDF document link on the internet to this BCC with a schematic and full operational description. Search Google "FW221 BCC" for the pdf. I think it is labelled pdf "untitled" now. Hope this helps you out.
Thank you, I just looked at the PDF and it looks the same as mine, it is a wealth of info! I will check out the reset button tomorrow .

I rechecked all wiring and traced out where each positive wire went, I know know for sure how and where every wire goes! lol Still lead me back to the same place which is the relay. Now I can trouble shoot that (and by trouble shoot I mean press the reset button and cross my fingers!)

Thanks
Don
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Old 04-13-2018, 12:51 AM   #8
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2013 ACE 30.1
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THOR #2631
Hi Don, I will be surprised if this CB5 reset does not fix your issue. You may also note from the BCC circuit/info on line that the charging current from the converter to the Coach battery passes through this CB5 cct breaker I think. So when its tripped you are not charging batteries either (unless your version BCC is different than mine). You might have some slight changes from my 2013 BCC. The interconnect relay that you can see in your picture connects the Coach and Chassis Battery together under certain charging or Aux start button conditions. I am sure you will find that on line FW221 BCC document very enlightening.....a missing link to a good portion of your electrical system.

I guess the other question (if resetting CB5 is your issue) is.....why did it trip?
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Old 04-13-2018, 12:05 PM   #9
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Challenger 37 GT
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THOR #7843
Quote:
Originally Posted by javelin View Post
Hi Don, I will be surprised if this CB5 reset does not fix your issue. You may also note from the BCC circuit/info on line that the charging current from the converter to the Coach battery passes through this CB5 cct breaker I think. So when its tripped you are not charging batteries either (unless your version BCC is different than mine). You might have some slight changes from my 2013 BCC. The interconnect relay that you can see in your picture connects the Coach and Chassis Battery together under certain charging or Aux start button conditions. I am sure you will find that on line FW221 BCC document very enlightening.....a missing link to a good portion of your electrical system.

I guess the other question (if resetting CB5 is your issue) is.....why did it trip?
The CB5 reset did the trick! As hard as I looked I didn't see that little button! LOL so thanks a lot for that schematic.

I just finished installing 400 watts of solar, and with connecting and disconnecting the batteries it is entirely possible I popped the reset when wiring the solar in, that is why I checked all the wiring 1000 times to make sure everything was done correctly, (it was). I will keep an eye on it just to make sure there is not a problem.

Thanks again for the help.
Don
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