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Old 06-03-2024, 05:31 PM   #1
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THOR #10717
Snowflake button on dashboard function for 2018 Thor Vegas 24.1 Ford E450

Hi,
I am trying to figure out what the Snowflake button on dashboard does for 2018 Thor Vegas 24.1 Ford E450. I read through a bunch of various discussions and I am not sure if the snowflake button engages the clutch for the compressor. There is a seperate "recirculate" button which i assume closes off the external air intake from the chasis.
I am concerned that somehow my AC compressor is always on/engaged without the snowflake button being pressed/illuminated. I figured this out when in noticed that the vent air was fairly cold and dry even during a 80F degree day when the snowflake button was not pressed/illuminated. I also noticed condensate dripping from the right/front tire well.

Thanks-
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Old 06-03-2024, 05:49 PM   #2
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That is your A/C ON button. I don't know for sure in your RV but on a lot of vehicles it is over-ridden when you turn the circulation knob to a defrost position.
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Old 06-03-2024, 06:51 PM   #3
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Every vehicle I have owned in the last 20 years turns on the A/C compressor when ever the vent selector is positioned on the defroster setting. Every Ford vehicle I have owned in the last 40 years with a vacuum controlled vent selector has defaulted to defroster when the selector looses vacuum.
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Old 06-04-2024, 02:44 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gte534j View Post
Hi,
I am trying to figure out what the Snowflake button on dashboard does for 2018 Thor Vegas 24.1 Ford E450. I read through a bunch of various discussions and I am not sure if the snowflake button engages the clutch for the compressor. There is a seperate "recirculate" button which i assume closes off the external air intake from the chasis.
I am concerned that somehow my AC compressor is always on/engaged without the snowflake button being pressed/illuminated. I figured this out when in noticed that the vent air was fairly cold and dry even during a 80F degree day when the snowflake button was not pressed/illuminated. I also noticed condensate dripping from the right/front tire well.

Thanks-
I have a newer Axis and my snowflake button turns the AC compressor on and off and the recirculation button opens and closes the outside air vents. The snowflake button has a light on it that comes on when the compressor is on and the recirculate button has a light when the outside vents are closed I believe.

If you feel cold air when the snowflake light is off it sounds like the compressor is on full time when the engines is running.

The button sounds like it went out and maybe is stuck in a closed contact position. You can probably get to the back of that button and try disconnecting the wires and see if the compressor stops. The switch may need to be replaced. Is the light on the switch permanently on?
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Old 06-07-2024, 04:31 PM   #5
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I did some more testing yesterday and confirmed that the compressor is always on. the outside ambient air was 80F and i had the vent fan on max (4), temperatuere set to blue/cold, and right selector to vent only, no recirculation button and no snowflake button pressed (not illuminated) and the air coming out of the vent was around 50F. The snowflake button was not illuminated.

I then pressed the snowflake button (illuminated) and the temperature of the vent exit air stayed the same at about 50F (measured w/ kitchen thermometer).

I was thinking that the snowflake button could be stuck but if the snowflake button is not illuminated the i would not think the button is stuck.

I am thinking there might be a bad relay that is keeping the compressor always engaged?

Any other ideas? I think this is not normal operation for the 2018 vegas 24.1 to always have the compressor running in this configuration. this seems to have occured over the winter as i dont remember the system functioning this way for the last 5 years.

Thanks for the help and trouble shooting-
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Old 06-07-2024, 05:43 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gte534j View Post
I did some more testing yesterday and confirmed that the compressor is always on. the outside ambient air was 80F and i had the vent fan on max (4), temperatuere set to blue/cold, and right selector to vent only, no recirculation button and no snowflake button pressed (not illuminated) and the air coming out of the vent was around 50F. The snowflake button was not illuminated.

I then pressed the snowflake button (illuminated) and the temperature of the vent exit air stayed the same at about 50F (measured w/ kitchen thermometer).

I was thinking that the snowflake button could be stuck but if the snowflake button is not illuminated the i would not think the button is stuck.

I am thinking there might be a bad relay that is keeping the compressor always engaged?

Any other ideas? I think this is not normal operation for the 2018 vegas 24.1 to always have the compressor running in this configuration. this seems to have occured over the winter as i dont remember the system functioning this way for the last 5 years.

Thanks for the help and trouble shooting-
I think I'd agree with your "relay" supposition - that'd be the next thing I'd check
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Old 06-10-2024, 08:14 PM   #7
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Update- I was actually able to get a hold of someone who answered the phone at ProAir LLC Phone: 800-338-8544 even though the company is out of business. The person was super helpful and figured that the snowflake button the dash was not dis-engaging even thought the light would illuminuate when pressed and not illuminate when depressed. he sent me the part number Control Panel (EVANS) RV219537 RV202146 and RV202024. I ordered one so will just swap it out. Hopefully this fixes it. Expensive part but way faster/cheaper than asking someone else to help.
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Old 06-11-2024, 01:37 AM   #8
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Please let us know if the control panel resolves the issue... or not.
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Old 06-17-2024, 07:55 PM   #9
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I replaced the control panel with a new one and that did not fix the issue. I also tested the continuity of the switches on the old control panel (i unscrewed and disassembled it) and the switches were fine. So the new panel is going back to comfort air.
The next option is that the thermostat is broken-
https://www.comfortairgr.com/product...oair-01001351/
Does anyone know where this is located? I didnt see it in the dashboard so it must be hidden inside the engine compartment?
Attached is the AC wiring diagram that i found on another post/thread here-
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Old 06-17-2024, 09:38 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gte534j View Post
I replaced the control panel with a new one and that did not fix the issue. I also tested the continuity of the switches on the old control panel (i unscrewed and disassembled it) and the switches were fine. So the new panel is going back to comfort air.
The next option is that the thermostat is broken-
https://www.comfortairgr.com/product...oair-01001351/
Does anyone know where this is located? I didnt see it in the dashboard so it must be hidden inside the engine compartment?
Attached is the AC wiring diagram that i found on another post/thread here-
The thermostat can not turn the compressor on by itself - it is in series with the A/C switch which provides the +12 VDC to the control side of the relay. Did you find and check the relay? A sticking relay would seem far more logical than a malfunctioning switch.
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Old 06-17-2024, 09:44 PM   #11
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That makes sense on what you said- thanks for the help. I agree, if the thermostat is broken closed, then you would still be able to turn on/off the AC since the AC button is in series.
So you think that the AC relay 01-000-136 might be stuck engaged? that makes a lot of sense to me-
https://www.comfortairgr.com/product...oair-01000136/
Does anyone know where this is located? If i can find it i can then test it with my multimeter.
Would be nice to just have to replace a $20 part!
Thanks for the help!
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Old 06-17-2024, 10:23 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gte534j View Post
That makes sense on what you said- thanks for the help. I agree, if the thermostat is broken closed, then you would still be able to turn on/off the AC since the AC button is in series.
So you think that the AC relay 01-000-136 might be stuck engaged? that makes a lot of sense to me-
https://www.comfortairgr.com/product...oair-01000136/
Does anyone know where this is located? If i can find it i can then test it with my multimeter.
Would be nice to just have to replace a $20 part!
Thanks for the help!
Well, per the diagram it is in the "HVAC assembly". But if so it has to be external to it for maintenance/troubleshooting. It looks like a standard 4 pin 30 amp automotive relay:

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Old 06-18-2024, 12:28 AM   #13
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Ok- i tested the relay and it worked fine (normally open, closed when applied + 12 across the relay coil).
I then tracked the relay wiring to the top of the compressor (compressor top.jpg). The black harness attaches here (harness to top compressor.jpg). I think the problem is that the relay is not turning off the compressor. I cant find a diagram or any info on how this component works. I have attached a few photos of it. I tried hooking up a +12V battery to the top of it to turn off the compressor but it didnt seem to work.
I also tried a continuity check on the wiring harness coming from the relay and that didnt seem to help.
I am a bit stuck on what to do- any suggestions?
I attached a few photos-
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Old 06-18-2024, 12:34 AM   #14
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The second and third photos appear to be the connector for the pressure switch on the accumulator, not the compressor.

Does the compressor clutch remain engaged when that connector is disconnected?


Note: The compressor clutch is driven by the serpentine belt which, when the clutch is engaged, causes the compressor's shaft to rotate (it's a pump). It's down low on the passenger side.
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Old 06-18-2024, 12:40 AM   #15
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Old 06-18-2024, 01:47 AM   #16
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The second and third photos appear to be the connector for the pressure switch on the accumulator, not the compressor.

Does the compressor clutch remain engaged when that connector is disconnected?


Note: The compressor clutch is driven by the serpentine belt which, when the clutch is engaged, causes the compressor's shaft to rotate (it's a pump). It's down low on the passenger side.
The compressor requires 12 VDC to the clutch to engage and pump.
The 12 VDC is supplied by the power contacts on the relay.
The 12 VDC to the compressor will be interrupted and the clutch released if any of the following occurs:
The A/C ON/OFF switch removes the relay control power
The thermostat senses a freezing condition on the evaporator
The low side pressure is too low (evaporator)
The high side pressure is too high (condenser)

The 3 conditions above will either interrupt control power or the main power from the relay to the compressor.

Any interruption will STOP the compressor from running. Your problem is the opposite of that - 12 VDC is being applied when it shouldn't be. Since you have tested the relay and it is operating correctly the issue has to be on the control side. +12 VDC is being shorted to the control line. You can verify this by measuring voltage to ground on pin 85 on the control relay. Then you just have to figure out where the short is.
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Old 06-18-2024, 10:51 AM   #17
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In addition to the possibility that power is being continuously applied to the clutch coil, it must also be considered that the clutch is mechanically jammed in the engaged position and that the problem is not electrical. That is why I asked about clutch engagement with the low pressure cycling switch disconnected.


The answer to that question will guide further troubleshooting.
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Old 06-18-2024, 07:31 PM   #18
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Thanks so much for all your help- this has been truley challenging for me.

I slightly removed the relay (about 1mm gap) to test the pins with the relay connected. This is so i could test everything as functional.

With the snowflake button OFF- there is NO+12 acros the T-stat switch.
With the snowflake button ON- there is +12 acros the T-stat switch.
This leads me to believe the snowflake switch on the dash and the T-stat are working properly.

The 85 pin is connected from the output of the T-stat on the relay.

With the snowflake button OFF- there is NO+12 on the 85 PIN
With the snowflake button ON- there is NO+12 on the 85 PIN
So i think there is a broken wire between the T-stat out and the 85 PIN.

Does this make sense? Should i try to trace the wire between the T-stat and the 85 pin? I can also just jumper the wire with quick clips/connects to try to see if this fixes the connection?
I am thinking i should probably do that next with jumper wires?
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Old 06-18-2024, 08:00 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gte534j View Post
Thanks so much for all your help- this has been truley challenging for me.

I slightly removed the relay (about 1mm gap) to test the pins with the relay connected. This is so i could test everything as functional.

With the snowflake button OFF- there is NO+12 acros the T-stat switch.
With the snowflake button ON- there is +12 acros the T-stat switch.
This leads me to believe the snowflake switch on the dash and the T-stat are working properly.

The 85 pin is connected from the output of the T-stat on the relay.

With the snowflake button OFF- there is NO+12 on the 85 PIN
With the snowflake button ON- there is NO+12 on the 85 PIN
So i think there is a broken wire between the T-stat out and the 85 PIN.

Does this make sense? Should i try to trace the wire between the T-stat and the 85 pin? I can also just jumper the wire with quick clips/connects to try to see if this fixes the connection?
I am thinking i should probably do that next with jumper wires?
That's not right, but that is not the issue you are troubleshooting. A broken wire (open circuit) will not cause the A/C compressor to run continuously.
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Old 06-18-2024, 08:48 PM   #20
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Thanks- that makes sense what you are saying. I am having a problem with the AC always on which means either there is a stuck clutch or the +12V switch is not being de-energized.
I found a pic of a Ford V10 engine. What should i be looking for in the photo to see that the AC clutch is dis-engaged? Will i see something move or the pully just stop spinning? this is a very hard area to get into/see so i want to make sure i understand what i am looking for/at.
Is there a way to test to see if the clutch is stuck?
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