preferred toad

[blw2]

Originally Posted by FW28z

I see your point. I kind of had my blinders on, and I was thinking of primarily the E450 which is what I have, and the CGWR is 22,500, and the GVWR is 14,500, so it does have a 8,000lb theoretical towing capacity.
....

Perhaps less, when you consider the axle ratings.
I haven't run the towing numbers for my coach yet, but I do know that my rear axle is pushing very close to its limit before i add the tongue of any trailer on it..... not an issue for flat towing, I know, but still something that needs to be considered for a trailer.....

[FW28z]

There are certainly a lot of issues to consider, aren't there.

Kind of makes me cringe when someone (like my brother) just hitches up a trailer without even being aware or caring about these things. But I guess I am more anal than he is.

On my coach, the Ford sticker has the Rear GAWR at 9,600lbs while the Thor sticker adjacent to it has it listed as 9,500lbs. The Front GAWR is the same (5,000lbs) for both the Ford and Thor stickers.

I wonder if the Thor spec is a mis-print, or if they did something to shave 100lbs off the capacity.

I have not weighed the individual axles though, so I don't know what the axle weights are or how close they are to the GAWR.

I do know the overall weight though, without any water or cargo; it is 11,559lbs. But that is before projects I have done, which probably adds a couple hundred pounds. Still, I have a 2,800lb margin for people, cargo, water, and trailer tongue.

Not sure what your 31L weighs, but probably it is a little bit heavier than mine.

If I were to haul a heavy trailer, I'd be sure to weigh the rear axle to make sure it was not overloaded.

[blw2]

Originally Posted by FW28z

There are certainly a lot of issues to consider, aren't there.

Kind of makes me cringe when someone (like my brother) just hitches up a trailer without even being aware or caring about these things. But I guess I am more anal than he is.

Yep, but it goes to show how much safety factor is built in, and also keep in mind that some times limits are somewhat arbitrary.... like perhaps based on a target life time. Well what if I'm willing to accept a slightly shorter life span?

I grew up loading and pulling and hauling all sorts of things, and day or me never know any of this stuff....... it's what I think of as "red neck windage"

Just as there are many mechanics that do quite well, and still never use or really even understand a torque wrench
and there are plenty of sharpshooter hunters out there, that know nothing of the theory behind it....
There are also folks that overload a pickup so the bumper is draggin', but they know to drive slow enough to not break something....

Sure, an engineer might be able to calculate that this "red neck's" truck might only last 223,000 miles vs 300,000 miles for an always properly loaded truck, but in the end who cares?

I'm not condoning it, don't get me wrong..... just pointing out that it's not the end of the world to push a limit....

[JamieGeek]

I'm ready to tow now:

Waiting for the snow to melt.

(Our toad is going to be a FWD 2014 Escape.)

[FW28z]

[Bruce]

Thor had the wheel base lengthened to 212 inches from 176 inches. I am surprised it didn't reduce the GAWR more.

There should be another sticker from the company that did the frame work.

Bruce

Originally Posted by FW28z

On my coach, the Ford sticker has the Rear GAWR at 9,600lbs while the Thor sticker adjacent to it has it listed as 9,500lbs. The Front GAWR is the same (5,000lbs) for both the Ford and Thor stickers.

I wonder if the Thor spec is a mis-print, or if they did something to shave 100lbs off the capacity.

[FW28z]

Nope. Just the two.

[Dwain65]

Originally Posted by JamieGeek

I'm ready to tow now:

Waiting for the snow to melt.

(Our toad is going to be a FWD 2014 Escape.)

Nice! I just traded my 2013 Escape for a Wrangler as I wasn't sure how well it would track on a dolly. Looking forward to hearing about your experience with dolly and Escape setup!

[EA37TS]

Originally Posted by FW28z

For 2015, Thor has increased the Class C towing specification to 8,000lbs. Not sure what they did differently other than perhaps installing a heavier duty hitch.

Not sure I would want to tow 8,000lbs on my coach though. I tend to be a bit conservative when it comes to towing.

Before buying the Challenger I had a 2014 Forest River class C and Ford had upgraded the towing capacity on the E450 from 5000 to 8000 pounds. After getting the word from Ford Forest River began installing the 8000 lb hitch and pitching it as a selling point.

The thing to keep in mind when towing anything the heavier the towed vehicle the less weight you can safely carry inside the coach because you still have the GCWR that you must be below for safe operation.

[FW28z]

Originally Posted by dstankov

The thing to keep in mind when towing anything the heavier the towed vehicle the less weight you can safely carry inside the coach because you still have the GCWR that you must be below for safe operation.

Yes, that is true. There is always the weak link you have to consider.

Actually though, there is an interesting story here. The GVWR of E450 chassis since 2011 ihas been 14,500lbs and the CGWR is 22,000lbs, so theoretically 7,500lbs. Of course, you have to account for any weak links such as GAWR, hitch capacity, etc.

In 2011, the CGWR for the E450 was 20,000lbs (5,500lb towing capacity). But if you installed a heat shield (essentially a piece of aluminum clad cardboard), under a connector under the chassis, you can increase the CGWR to 22,000lbs.

Ford published a service bulletin describing this:

https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas/non-html/Q-193.pdf

Ford indicated that the reason for the 2,000lb discrepancy is that the theory is when you tow an extra 2,000lbs, the engine works harder - hence the exhaust is at a higher temp. The heat shield protects a connector under the chassis from melting in this situation.

Funny how a piece of cardboard can make a 2,000lb difference.

In 2011, for the RV cutaway chassis, Ford cable-tied the heat shield to the chassis so the RV mfg could install it if they wish. Why Ford just didn't install them to begin with is a mystery to me (but they did install them in later model years).

I checked under my coach and sure enough, it has the heat shield installed.

When I asked Ford if that means my CGWR is 22,000lbs, they said (in lawyer fashion) to contact Thor.

The Thor documentation states for 2011, the CGWR is 20,000lbs, not 22,000lbs. I can only assume that since the print date on the documentation is 2010, they simply did not get the word in time to fix it. In 2012, the documentation states 22,000lbs.

So, since the service bulletin specifies 22,000lbs with the heat shield installed, notwithstanding Ford not wanting to be liable, and Thor's deer in the headlights look, I am going with 22,000lbs as the CGWR of my rig.

[Chart99]

Just a little curious about any if at all issues you have had towing your Fiat 500 as I just gor a 2014 500 manual trans for towing behind my 07 Hurricane 34' class A. I will use a blue ox base plate and tow bars for hookup and was thinking about the rvi2 brake system for aux braking.

[Bruce]

Guaranty RV Parts in Oregon (Jake, 541-234-0970) is closing out their RViBrake2 stock at $875 plus shipping.

I have one on the way.

Bruce

Originally Posted by Chart99

was thinking about the rvi2 brake system for aux braking.

[FW28z]

Originally Posted by Bruce

Guaranty RV Parts in Oregon (Jake, 541-234-0970) is closing out their RViBrake2 stock at $875 plus shipping.

I have one on the way.

Bruce

That is pretty cheap. I paid $1,200 for mine in September.

[FW28z]

I saw the re-designed 2015 Ford Focus today, and they improved on the front grille I think.

At any rate, I downloaded the 2015 owner's manual, and verified that the Focus remains 4 down towable, which is good news as the auto-transmission tow-capable vehicles are getting smaller. There had been some concern that the re-designed Focus might not be 4 down towable.

It looks like the transmission is the same as the owner's manual did state it was an adaptive transmission.

[JamieGeek]

I don't think they changed any of the mechanicals on the 2015 Focus (even the Focus Electric is mechanically identical to its 2014 cousin). Thus the transmission on the Titanium Focuses remains the dual clutch automatic manual. Since it is essentially a manual transmission inside you can pop it into neutral and drag it around all you want.

The big change for the Focus is supposed to be 2017 I believe.

[JDHoge]

Having towed a 2014 for many miles I have no complaints. I added a battery quick disconnect so hooking up with the Blue Ox system is the main time investment, which, seems to take me between 10 and 15 minutes. I use a 4 inch drop receiver from my 2013 Four Winds and then next in the system is the NSA ReadyBreak system and then the Blue Ox tow bar.
The 2014 Focus with 6 speed auto now has a new tranny program that the dealer can 'reflash" to end most of the clutch chatter (that was my main complaint about the car all along).

[FW28z]

The 2015 Motorhome Dinghy Tow guide did not list the Focus, but had a note that it was due to a re-design that they didn't know at press-time whether or not it would remain towable.

I did see in comparison in the specs that the 2015 Focus has 2" more leg-room than the 2014. All other "body" specs (hip room, shoulder room, head room, etc) remain the same, so whether there is really an increase or just a typo is something I am not sure of.

I am a tall guy, so the 2" extra leg room would be nice. But I have plenty of leg room in my mom's 2014 Focus.

We're thinking this might be the car of choice in a couple years as our 2002 Pontiac Toad isn't going to last forever.

I like the Focus as it has a huge amount of inside space for a small car, at least for the driver's seat. I am a tall guy, so I can't fit into cars like the Fiesta, but the Focus is amazingly tall person friendly, and with the small size and weight, it might be a great tow vehicle for our future.

[JamieGeek]

Originally Posted by FW28z

I like the Focus as it has a huge amount of inside space for a small car, at least for the driver's seat. I am a tall guy, so I can't fit into cars like the Fiesta, but the Focus is amazingly tall person friendly, and with the small size and weight, it might be a great tow vehicle for our future.

I think this is also due to it being designed in Europe: A small car for tall people that handles well...