Battery Replacement Gone Bad

[lbcox11]

AGM battery needed replacing; confirmed DOA at auto store. After taking the cables off, I told myself I'd remeber which cable went to the positive & negative terminals. My new LiFePO4 battery didn't come in for about a week. When I installed the new battery, I got confused as to which cable went where. I've tried a couple of different configurations, but nothing seems to come on. There are a couple of configs that are obviously wrong because the BMS kicks it off & I have to wake it back up connecting my Vair compressor directly to the battery. The battery is sitting at 98% charged & when I at least dont' connect it up wrong, the GoPower panel does show somewhere in the range of 13.3v. This battery does not drive any 120v outlets, just 12v stuff; the most obvious being the 12v fridge. Currently I can't figure out why nothing is coming on. What I believe the config should be is the most obvious cable on the attached pic's left goes straight to the battery carrier housing. You can physically follow it to that point in the upper left & it Ohms out just fine. The other 2 large cables and the fuses get bundled and run up into the chasis under the floor. I've checked all the fuses in the ckt breaker box & all are OK. Anybody have any ideas. "IF" I could find another Geneva somewhere in the big city, I'd ask them to let me take a look at their battery bank, but my dealer says I'm one of a kind.

 

[ducksface]

Forensically,
Hold the wires and see where they naturally land.
This the likely place they lived on the old batteries.

For others:
It is said here at least weekly by someone or another:
Take too many pictures before removing any electrical of any sort, then take more pictures.

Buy and liberally use the linked item below.

Amazon.com

 

[16ACE27]

This is a 2024 Geneva 31VT for those playing along.
Major lesson learned is: label all cables connected to the battery(s) and take pictures BEFORE disconnecting everything.
Second lesson maybe learned is: locate all DC breakers and remove all external power to the battery(s) before replacing.

I doubt your Geneva is "one of a kind".
This looks like a single house battery installation?
There should only be one ground cable that goes directly to the metal chassis.
It looks like you have a + cable distribution point in the upper left in the picture?
All other cables should go to the + post.
You should have:
A cable that goes to a 100 amp DC breaker for starting the generator
A cable that goes to a 50 amp DC breaker that goes to the house battery disconnect from the house load buss and converter/charger
Make sure those breakers have not tripped.
Make sure the two large fuses in the Power Center DC fuse side are not blown - they are 30 or 40 amp and may be labeled "Reverse Polarity" fuses.
If you have an Inverter it will have it's own + and maybe - cable. The + will go to an inline DC breaker or fuse near the battery.
Your DC fridge will probably have it's own wire to the + side of the battery - maybe that 25 amp fused wire.
The 5 amp fused wire also looks like a + but I don't know what that is for.

 

[lbcox11]

By one of a kind I meant the dealer hasn't seen any of these in the Albuquerque area.
Thanks Duckface..both suggestions immediately came to mind when things didn't come together quickly. Egg all over my RED face; mad at myself!
Thanks ACE...great explanation. I'm going to print that out to start the troubleshooting. The 2 fuses in the pic are good, so I suspected other fuses "somewhere" might be in play, other than the main circuit breaker box at the end of the bed which doesn't show any signs of blown fuses, wasn't sure where to check.
I'll report back in when I have something new.
Thanks again for the quick reply.

 

[PS89]

Per factory schematic:

#2 RED cable from Batt+ to the terminal block in the upper left corner of photo
#2 RED cable from Batt+ to your chassis isolator solenoid.
#10 ORANGE wire with 20A fuse from Batt+to the solar prep.
#16 RED wire with 5A fuse from Batt+ to AGS

#2 BLACK from BATT- to chassis ground

If built as a rental unit, there will be an additional pair of #6 cables that feed the 300W inverter. Non-rental units will not have these.

Good luck!

 

[lbcox11]

Thanks PS...I'll add this to my notepad file/troubleshooting doc.
I'll assume that all cables but the #2 BLACK wire running to chassis ground will connect to the positive post.
After that, I'll be hunting down a blown fuse somewhere.
BTW, we bought this brand new & also...it does have 200W solar panel on the roof.

 

[PS89]

I'll assume that all cables but the #2 BLACK wire running to chassis ground will connect to the positive post.

Correct.

 

[lbcox11]

Reporting back....2 blown 40a fuses...yep...both of them. I thought when fuses from the 12v side blew, they would give a light indication; they did with my Montana 5th wheel anyway. So, I'm off to the store to get a variety pack. Still learning the differences between my 5'ver and this Class C.
BTW, I did connect the cables up as we had assumed. Smoke Check was negative. The GoPower panel is giving me a b01 battery error (in other words...no battery detected or below perceivable levels).

 

[ghnl]

 

[16ACE27]

Reporting back....2 blown 40a fuses...yep...both of them. I thought when fuses from the 12v side blew, they would give a light indication; they did with my Montana 5th wheel anyway. So, I'm off to the store to get a variety pack. Still learning the differences between my 5'ver and this Class C.
BTW, I did connect the cables up as we had assumed. Smoke Check was negative. The GoPower panel is giving me a b01 battery error (in other words...no battery detected or below perceivable levels).

The distribution fuses do light a LED when the fuse is blown, same as your fiver. But the Reverse Polarity fuses do not. On your fiver they may have been located on the converter itself if it was stand alone.

 

[Jimbo57]

View attachment 1314985

But this way you’ll never get that corrosion build up, isn’t that the trade off( no power)

 

[lbcox11]

Reporting back..Day 2 - Summary...not working; popped fuses multiple times.

Bought a 25pk of 40a fuses and a roll of multi-colored electrical tape. Replaced fuses and labeled cables; leaving the direct to chassis ground cable as Black; middle cable is now yellow and right cable is blue (I'll label them properly once this gets ironed out) I left the 2 red cables with fuses alone.

Behind the power distribution box at the end and under the bed is a rat's nest of cables seriously crammed together. I can make out an automatic transfer switch and that's about it. Can't identify an inverter or any other magic black box, so if there's a fuse in there, wouldn't know what to look for.

Results:
Black to (-) Bat and Red 5a fuse to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect Off = GoPower b01 error
Black to (-) Bat and Red 5a fuse to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect On = GoPower b01 error
*** So, still don't know what function/appliance that goes to. EDIT EDIT - Just remembered from post above, that this goes to the AGS...apologize.

Black to (-) Bat and Red 20a fuse to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect Off = GoPower Solar Bars Cycling, 11.4V, and Battery Charge level indicator is at the bottom (dead).
Black to (-) Bat and Red 20a fuse to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect On = GoPower Solar Bars Steady, 14.3V, and Battery Charge level indicator is at the top (Full).
*** So, I'll assume at this point, this is connected to the roof solar panel (not sure where the charge controller is).

Black to (-) Bat and Blue, Yellow, and 2 Red fused cables to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect Off = ??
Black to (-) Bat and only Blue taped cable to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect On = popped both 40a fuses immediately

*** Back to the drawing board & going to test each "presumably positive" cables separately.

Black to (-) Bat and only Blue taped cable to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect Off = ??
Black to (-) Bat and Blue, Yellow, and 2 Red fused cables to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect On = popped both 40a fuses immediately.

Black to (-) Bat and only Yellow taped cable to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect Off = ??
Black to (-) Bat and only Yellow taped cable to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect On = popped both 40a fuses immediately

That's it for the day...confused, frustrated. BTW, I'm home so I have a 30a feed for shore power. I have had it hooked up in the middle of this...with no battery connected even. The TV, microwave come to life, but no 12v lights, water pump, tank indicators, fridge work. I don't know if this helps or not. Was not connected during yesterday or today's troubleshooting.

 

[ducksface]

Pokes small self-healing size hole in any wire insulation anywhere.
No ground cable needed.

Buy a small 12volt battery and some alligator clips to use for tracing.


Just a note.
Nothing else.

And
You didn't say you took too many pictures while doing this today....

 

[Gus52]

I see most folks have provided the connections, here is a way you can determine them too:
1) any wire or lead or node that is fused is a (+) connection (note your image has it marked negative).

2) get your VOM (volt ohm meter) out and with the shore power disconnected. Set it to volts and measure every cable to chassis ground. They should all be zero volts. The measure for ground using the ohm setting. First connect the two probes together and note the reading then measure the cables to chassis ground. You are looking for a very similar reading. That will be ground.

3) Observe the third cable length can it reach the same as the 12 VDC? or did it also have the same low resistance to ground? It is common to have multiple connection to the (+) terminal the ground or negative terminal tends to have one. You can also follow the ground cable it will be bolted to the metal frame and only be about 2' long (a good way to double check your work).

 

[ducksface]

While you're in there and involved with all of this get those leads off of the battery terminal.
It'll make life easier now and later.

 

[lbcox11]

Here's the rest of my configuration that I will continue to test tomorrow.
Since the LiFePO4 battery is a 12v/314ah battery, it fits just fine, but I could see it was going to be a tight cumbersome fit if I had to connect/reconnect the cables, so I have been leaving it out of the battery bay until I was sure which cable went to which battery post, connecting it to the various RV cables via fairly thick jumper cables. I don't know if that is causing issues or not. I've got a normal 12v lead acid battery that is fully charged that I will NOT be using the jumper cables to see if that makes a difference tomorrow.

 

[16ACE27]

Reporting back..Day 2 - Summary...not working; popped fuses multiple times.

Bought a 25pk of 40a fuses and a roll of multi-colored electrical tape. Replaced fuses and labeled cables; leaving the direct to chassis ground cable as Black; middle cable is now yellow and right cable is blue (I'll label them properly once this gets ironed out) I left the 2 red cables with fuses alone.

Behind the power distribution box at the end and under the bed is a rat's nest of cables seriously crammed together. I can make out an automatic transfer switch and that's about it. Can't identify an inverter or any other magic black box, so if there's a fuse in there, wouldn't know what to look for.

Results:
Black to (-) Bat and Red 5a fuse to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect Off = GoPower b01 error
Black to (-) Bat and Red 5a fuse to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect On = GoPower b01 error
*** So, still don't know what function/appliance that goes to. EDIT EDIT - Just remembered from post above, that this goes to the AGS...apologize.

Black to (-) Bat and Red 20a fuse to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect Off = GoPower Solar Bars Cycling, 11.4V, and Battery Charge level indicator is at the bottom (dead).
Black to (-) Bat and Red 20a fuse to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect On = GoPower Solar Bars Steady, 14.3V, and Battery Charge level indicator is at the top (Full).
*** So, I'll assume at this point, this is connected to the roof solar panel (not sure where the charge controller is).

Black to (-) Bat and Blue, Yellow, and 2 Red fused cables to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect Off = ??
Black to (-) Bat and only Blue taped cable to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect On = popped both 40a fuses immediately

*** Back to the drawing board & going to test each "presumably positive" cables separately.

Black to (-) Bat and only Blue taped cable to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect Off = ??
Black to (-) Bat and Blue, Yellow, and 2 Red fused cables to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect On = popped both 40a fuses immediately.

Black to (-) Bat and only Yellow taped cable to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect Off = ??
Black to (-) Bat and only Yellow taped cable to (+) Bat with Battery Disconnect On = popped both 40a fuses immediately

That's it for the day...confused, frustrated. BTW, I'm home so I have a 30a feed for shore power. I have had it hooked up in the middle of this...with no battery connected even. The TV, microwave come to life, but no 12v lights, water pump, tank indicators, fridge work. I don't know if this helps or not. Was not connected during yesterday or today's troubleshooting.

In your picture; what is the thing circled in yellow?
It looks like a + power post from the quality of the picture but it may be a ground point.
How have you verified your determined - cable is actually a - cable?

 

[lbcox11]

The yellow circle was to identify what I think is the chassis ground. It was an unlit corner, so I used a bright color. The far-left cable goes directly to it & the mounting block (circled in yellow) is bolted to the battery bay frame...that's why I'm assuming it is chassis ground. Could I be wrong? Now you've got me wondering if that block is actually insulated from the battery bay. Since it was so dark, I assumed everything was metal. I guess the first I'll do is double-check chassis ground by selecting a different part of the RV chassis to this same spot & then work from there.
So far, logic says that I have reversed one (or maybe 2) battery cables.

 

[Jimbo57]

It would help if we had a picture of where the cables terminate at top of picture guessing the negative ground may be there

 

[PS89]

If the two 40A fuses blow, you have a reversed polarity problem.

Just a reminder to peel back the wire loom to see the cable colors.

Also a reminder to download the schematics from your Thor Owner's account if you have not done so. See page 19 for the battery wiring schematic.