Coach Battery Charging Issues

[mgmsilver]

I have a Class A 2018 Freedom Traveler A30 with two 12V batteries, a Furrion F50-ATS (recently replaced), a WF-9855 Converter/Charger (recently replaced), and a Precision Circuits BIM 225 Battery Isolation Manager. I'm having increasingly intermittent Shore/Generator charging issues, but the Alternator charges the coach batteries fine. First I thought it was the ATS, but replacing that didn't resolve the issue. Next I tried replacing the Converter/Charger, again without success.

I'm already $300 in, and while I don't mind having fresh components with the old ones to fall back on, and I have certainly learned a ton, I wanted to check with the forum before trying the BIM.

1) Could the BIM be bad, causing the batteries not to charge from Shore/Generator power? If not, what else am I missing?

2) Is the Chassis battery charged at all from Shore/Generator? Separate issue, just curious.

Thanks in advance for any insight.

Mark

 

[16ACE27]

The BIM has no bearing on charging from the converter.
What must work is the connection between the house DC buss and the house battery bank.
Besides the cables, the USE/STORE (Master Power) switch must be in USE (ON) and the 50 amp DC breaker near the battery bank must not be tripped.

The switch referenced above actually controls a latching relay usually located behind the power center and is usually the issue in this type of problem. Mine just went out in the last year.

You'll need a multimeter to help troubleshoot this issue.

 

[mgmsilver]

The BIM has no bearing on charging from the converter.
What must work is the connection between the house DC buss and the house battery bank.
Besides the cables, the USE/STORE (Master Power) switch must be in USE (ON) and the 50 amp DC breaker near the battery bank must not be tripped.

The switch referenced above actually controls a latching relay usually located behind the power center and is usually the issue in this type of problem. Mine just went out in the last year.

You'll need a multimeter to help troubleshoot this issue.

Thanks for the quick reply. I do have a multimeter.

I took a few photos here to identify some of the components. By Master Power, do you mean the Main Power button with the light in the first pic below?

I'm not sure where the 50 AMP DC breaker near the battery bank would be.

 

[16ACE27]

Thanks for the quick reply. I do have a multimeter.

I took a few photos here to identify some of the components. By Master Power, do you mean the Main Power button with the light in the first pic below?

I'm not sure where the 50 AMP DC breaker near the battery bank would be.

Your second picture shows the OEM 50 amp circuit breaker with no test button like the 100 amp breakers in picture 3.

Yes, MAIN POWER.

Realize that "indicating light" does not show the status of the switch/latching relay. It will always be lit when the house DC buss has power, even if the latching relay is open. So anytime you have SP or the generator is running that light will be on, but if the latching relay is open, the house batteries will not charge.

 

[mgmsilver]

Would that be this?

 

[16ACE27]

Would that be this?

Looks like it.

A replacement for it:

Amazon.com

 

[mgmsilver]

Hi Ace,

Thanks again for your help with my charging issue. I purchased the latching relay, but it's slightly different than the one I have, so installation isn't totally straight forward.

So a couple questions:

1) To start, I used my multimeter and touched both sides if the latch and it was 11.5. I also checked the coach batteries which were also 11.5; is that expected?

2) The old latch only has one fuse, though there are slots on either side. Why does the right side (labeled 1 on the photo below) not have a fuse?

3) The old latch has a circuit board that's attached on one of the inside screen (labeled 2 on the photo below). Does this need to be transferred over to the new latch when installed?

4) Any other pears of wisdom before I begin?

-Mark

 

[16ACE27]

That circuit board is a time delay module to protect the relay in case the controlling switch "gets stuck" and constantly supplies power to the control coil.

I would duplicate the installation of the old relay, including the circuit board and single fuse. If it doesn't work properly (or at all) install the second fuse.

 

[PS89]

1) To start, I used my multimeter and touched both sides if the latch and it was 11.5. I also checked the coach batteries which were also 11.5; is that expected?

That indicates that the latch is closed and the coach batteries are very discharged. This assumes your negative meter lead was properly connected to ground for all readings. If you were, however, measuring ACROSS the relay's big terminals with your two meter leads, then that reading means the latching relay was OPEN.

The second fuse protects the indicator light circuit up by the MAIN POWER switch. Other than that, it serves no operational purpose.

Last fall, I mapped out this circuit and drew a schematic for it. If it's needed, I can post it up.

 

[mgmsilver]

Should I be disconnecting the batteries first?

 

[16ACE27]

Should I be disconnecting the batteries first?

Open the converter breaker and the 50 amp DC breaker near the house batteries. That should kill all power to iy.

 

[mgmsilver]

OK, so I got the old one disconnected. The new one has a jumper to the fuse that I believe is equivalent to the short red wire in the first photo below. The second red wire goes to the time delay module, and I was able to

 

[mgmsilver]

Disregard the last post. I can’t figure out how to delete it.

I have the new relay installed but now the main power won’t stay on.

 

[16ACE27]

Disregard the last post. I can’t figure out how to delete it.

I have the new relay installed but now the main power won’t stay on.

Define "won't stay on".

 

[mgmsilver]

The Main Power switch wont stay on when I toggle it up, and the converter and DC system doesn’t have power.

 

[16ACE27]

The Main Power switch wont stay on when I toggle it up,

That's what I asked you define. Spring return switches don't stay on. Are you talking about the latching relay action? Are you saying the latching relay won't stay in the connected position?

the converter and DC system doesn’t have power.

The converter only has power when the MH is plugged into SP. It supplies power to the DC house system loads and to charge the house batteries. This describes a completely separate symptom.

 

[mgmsilver]

First, I want to say thank you again for helping me.

When I push the main power button, normal the light stays on and I have DC (for example, interior lights or the back up camera) for a moment until I let go and the light no longer stays on. This is regardless of whether I’m plugged into shore power or not. The blue light on the converter doesn’t come on when there’s shore power like it did before either. So it seems like you suggested, “the latching relay won't stay in the connected position.”

I replicated how the intellitec latch was connected and double checked. I had to change the terminals on the time delay model wire that went into the fuse connector with the attached.

I’m just not sure what to do. Maybe I should call a service, I was just hoping to avoid paying $300-$400, and I want to learn the details. I also have two brand new batteries I want to install once the charging issue is resolved.

 

[16ACE27]

First, I want to say thank you again for helping me.

When I push the main power button, normal the light stays on and I have DC (for example, interior lights or the back up camera) for a moment until I let go and the light no longer stays on. This is regardless of whether I’m plugged into shore power or not. The blue light on the converter doesn’t come on when there’s shore power like it did before either. So it seems like you suggested, “the latching relay won't stay in the connected position.”

I replicated how the intellitec latch was connected and double checked. I had to change the terminals on the time delay model wire that went into the fuse connector with the attached.

I’m just not sure what to do. Maybe I should call a service, I was just hoping to avoid paying $300-$400, and I want to learn the details. I also have two brand new batteries I want to install once the charging issue is resolved.

OK, let's back up and separate:
The light next to the main power switch is just an indicator that 12 VDC is being applied to the house DC load buss.
It should light when you are plugged into SP and the converter is supplying power to the house DC buss regardless of the position of the latching relay.
It should also light when NOT on SP and you close the latching relay by pushing the Main Power switch UP (ON) and releasing it so it spring returns to center. The latching relay should stay latched and the light should stay on.

"The blue light on the converter doesn’t come on when there’s shore power like it did before either."
I'm not sure what that blue light is supposed to indicate on your converter. Can you provide a link to the converter you installed?

 

[mgmsilver]

WF-9855 55 Amp RV Power Converter... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DFGSXR52?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share

 

[16ACE27]

WF-9855 55 Amp RV Power Converter... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DFGSXR52?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share

OK, where is the blue light on the converter? I don't see it referenced anywhere in the documentation or manual.


Back to the latching relay issue: Looking at your Master Power switch it appears to be resting in the OFF/Disconnect position. Does the switch operate the same in both the up and down direction? Is there any voltage across the control terminals on the latching relay immediately after pushing the switch to ON and letting it return to center?