IT's that drunk pinball guy again. This time- propane + vs hot and delicious potable water.

[pinballandvodka]

AFAIK my rig (2015 Thor ACE 29.2) has a 6 gallon ante-tank for providing hot water, well, 6 gallons at a time. My potable is 60gal and full. There is a warmer on the passenger side (looks like a mat) I i presume sits underneath the 6 gallon ...pot... The pilot light has been out on the "control panel" since day one. However, the propane fires up great and heats the thing. So THAT ignition works. I'm wondering if maybe the heated mat thing is all electrical? it's got a 2amp fuse that almost looked soldered in.

Ok so, it looks to me there is an upgraded electrical gas sensor in the door above the water tank (passenger's side) where there is a circuit board as well as a older school brass gas looking thinger. Maybe there's a wire/ sensor from the propane tank to send a message to the other side of the rig to get the hot water going. I dunno and wasn't able to find that detail in the manual.

Anyway, yeah, can't get hot water. To be clear because I can be pretty stupid, this is not from the city side water connection but from the 60 gallon tank filled with filtered water (I haven't done the permanent inline thinger yet). And again, propane light out since day one but been getting heat since day 1. So either a faulty led, unlikely, or that light is "legacy" because the system was upgraded to electrical or because in fact the pilot really is out! OTOH, I smell zerrooooooooo point 0..0.0.0.0 gas coming through this area where gas would be flowing through (there's even a window to peep the fires) and now I have handy dandy super orange gas detector detector it also agrees with me that no gas is crossing the rv to this area.

Thoughts, suspicions, admonitions?
Thanks as per usual.

 

[16ACE27]

I don't know what an ante-tank is.

You likely have an Atwood 6 gallon DSI propane/120 VAC Electric water heater.

You have no gas pilot light. That light indicates the water heater has tried to ignite the gas fired heater 3 times in a row and given up. You clear the light by turning the GAS ON/OFF switch OFF (it should go out). When you turn the switch back ON it starts the 3 try cycle all over again.

There is a separate switch for turning on the 120 VAC electric element which obviously, only works if you are connected to SP or running the generator.

It should not matter if you are using City water or the FW tank and on-board water pump.

 

[ghnl]

can't get hot water ... from the 60 gallon tank filled

I'm not sure if I am following your description correctly. It sounds like you're saying the water tank is heating up but you're not getting hot water from the faucets. Is that correct?!?

Are the bypass valves positioned properly to allow water in & out of the water heater?

Turning on the water heater with no water in the tank is not a Good Idea. It will burn out the electrical element quickly (not sure about the propane burner).

 

[pinballandvodka]

No sirs but I'm saying is the propane goes on and creates heat but the pilot light switch on the control panel is still off and I'm trying to connect that possibly erroneously to the water heating issue

 

[pinballandvodka]

Sorry answered a little hastily I'm getting cold water from the faucets.

 

[16ACE27]

Sorry answered a little hastily I'm getting cold water from the faucets.

The pilot light not being ON is normal.
The burner firing and heating the water is normal.
Getting cold water from the hot side of the faucet is abnormal and likely due to the water heater isolation and bypass valves being in the winterized position.

 

[Chateau_Nomad]

No sirs but I'm saying is the propane goes on and creates heat but the pilot light switch on the control panel is still off and I'm trying to connect that possibly erroneously to the water heating issue

As stated... there is no "pilot light". It uses an electronic spark ignitor.

If the burner stays lit, you should have reasonably hot water after 10 to 15 minutes. If the hot tap water is still cold, check the position of the winterization bypass valve on the back of the water heater. If the bypass valve is open you'll get lukewarm water at the hot taps.

 

[Bob Nodine]

AFAIK my rig (2015 Thor ACE 29.2) has a 6 gallon ante-tank for providing hot water, well, 6 gallons at a time. My potable is 60gal and full. There is a warmer on the passenger side (looks like a mat) I i presume sits underneath the 6 gallon ...pot... The pilot light has been out on the "control panel" since day one. However, the propane fires up great and heats the thing. So THAT ignition works. I'm wondering if maybe the heated mat thing is all electrical? it's got a 2amp fuse that almost looked soldered in.

Ok so, it looks to me there is an upgraded electrical gas sensor in the door above the water tank (passenger's side) where there is a circuit board as well as a older school brass gas looking thinger. Maybe there's a wire/ sensor from the propane tank to send a message to the other side of the rig to get the hot water going. I dunno and wasn't able to find that detail in the manual.

Anyway, yeah, can't get hot water. To be clear because I can be pretty stupid, this is not from the city side water connection but from the 60 gallon tank filled with filtered water (I haven't done the permanent inline thinger yet). And again, propane light out since day one but been getting heat since day 1. So either a faulty led, unlikely, or that light is "legacy" because the system was upgraded to electrical or because in fact the pilot really is out! OTOH, I smell zerrooooooooo point 0..0.0.0.0 gas coming through this area where gas would be flowing through (there's even a window to peep the fires) and now I have handy dandy super orange gas detector detector it also agrees with me that no gas is crossing the rv to this area.

Thoughts, suspicions, admonitions?
Thanks as per usual.

Very difficult to follow your description. I will say this: The most common problem when a DSI water heater does not light to heat the water is air in the propane line. If you have a propane stove light one of the burners and let it run for awhile to help bleed air from the system.

 

[pinballandvodka]

Very difficult to follow your description. I will say this: The most common problem when a DSI water heater does not light to heat the water is air in the propane line. If you have a propane stove light one of the burners and let it run for awhile to help bleed air from the system.

I do and I will.
Thanks!

 

[pinballandvodka]

As stated... there is no "pilot light". It uses an electronic spark ignitor.

If the burner stays lit, you should have reasonably hot water after 10 to 15 minutes. If the hot tap water is still cold, check the position of the winterization bypass valve on the back of the water heater. If the bypass valve is open you'll get lukewarm water at the hot taps.

Thanks. There is a shutoff on the rear passenger side (like a typical plumbing shutoff), but it's on (and was on). Maybe I'm not waiting long enough for it to get warm. That's a lot of water to run to see if it gets warm, isn't it?

 

[16ACE27]

Thanks. There is a shutoff on the rear passenger side (like a typical plumbing shutoff),

No clue what valve you are talking about from that description, but I suspect your water heater winterizing valves are accessible by removing this carpeted box next to the bed:

Depending on what was used, you may have two 3-way valves:

Or three, 2-way (ON/OFF) valves:

 

[JeffThor325]

I know this is an old thread, but I just saw it. I initially thought this was about trying to turn the entire fresh water tank into a giant tank of hot water.

While I thought that was slightly insane, I've done plenty of things to my rig that others would find insane so I was trying not to be quick to judge.

Although that's not what it was about, it never did become clear what the OP's problem was or the eventual solution. (There seem to be a lot of these threads that pose a problem but never come back around to the final resolution.)

 

[Chateau_Nomad]

I'm not surprised how many people find RV systems confusing... there's really no correlation to things in everyday life. Admit it... we were ALL there once!!

At home, just flush the toilet and done. Plug in to an outlet... endless electricity. No converter, inverter or associated complexity.

IMO successful RV ownership takes a mindset of willingness to learn your RV's systems, the unique maintenance required AND attention to detail. Ignoring those makes for a short-lived RV lifestyle.

Those who make it a hobby are most successful.

 

[16ACE27]

I'm not surprised how many people find RV systems confusing... there's really no correlation to things in everyday life.

Sure there is:

Your car has many systems: Fuel, 12 VDC Electrical, Cooling, HVAC, and in some today - 120 VAC and pressurized air.
Your house has various systems: 120/240 VAC, HVAC. Plumbing, CableTV, Internet, etc.

So you either have an inherent interest in how things work (alarm clock in pieces in a shoebox, Heath kits, RC model hobby) and learn the systems in your life, or pay somebody else to repair the systems as needed.

Some are forced to learn systems: In the Navy, to become Submarine or Surface or Air qualified you have to demonstrate a working knowledge of all systems on the Submarine, Ship, Aircraft. Other services have similar programs. This translates well to owning an RV.

The reason the non-system people have issues in the RV world is the increased frequencies of problems due to the poor QA/QC in the industry and the operation of the RV in a "rolling earthquake" environment. They are not used to that with their car or house. RVs don't break any more frequently than ships, submarines or aircraft. The difference is there are system experts on those vehicles to repair the issues. That is not the case with the non-system interested person.

 

[ghnl]

I'm not surprised how many people find RV systems confusing... there's really no correlation to things in everyday life.

Sure there is:

I guess I'm halfway between. While the RV systems are similar to 'everyday life', they seem to require more understanding of how they work, what service they require and what to do when they don't work.

Water heater for example. At home you turn the faucet and get all the hot water you need to take a long shower (assuming you pay the utility bills...). In the RV you have to know how to fill the system &/or turn the valves after winterization. Then you have to choose electric or propane to heat the water. Are you plugged in to shore power or running the generator? Do you have solar panels with an inverter and is that system capable of supplying the power needed? Plus you have to operate the pump (did you fill the fresh water tank?) or connect to city water (with perhaps a pressure regulator in line). If you're boondocking do you have enough capacity to store the drain water until you can find a place to dump the holding tanks?

 

[JeffThor325]

I guess I'm halfway between. While the RV systems are similar to 'everyday life', they seem to require more understanding of how they work, what service they require and what to do when they don't work.

You are correct that they are similar. Therein lies the problem, I think. Every complex field of endeavor requires some form of specialized knowledge. Let's say you were to take up golf, to give an arbitrary example. If you had never played before and haven't studied anything about it, you might know little more than that you whack a little white ball with a metal stick. It requires specialized knowledge to understand the rules of the game and to become any good at actually playing it.

In RV terms, the systems are familiar enough that people think they can skip over having to acquire that specialized knowledge. That's what gets them into trouble: assumptions.

 

[Chateau_Nomad]

Sure there is:

Your car has many systems: Fuel, 12 VDC Electrical, Cooling, HVAC, and in some today - 120 VAC and pressurized air.
Your house has various systems: 120/240 VAC, HVAC. Plumbing, CableTV, Internet, etc.

So you either have an inherent interest in how things work (alarm clock in pieces in a shoebox, Heath kits, RC model hobby) and learn the systems in your life, or pay somebody else to repair the systems as needed.

Some are forced to learn systems: In the Navy, to become Submarine or Surface or Air qualified you have to demonstrate a working knowledge of all systems on the Submarine, Ship, Aircraft. Other services have similar programs. This translates well to owning an RV.

The reason the non-system people have issues in the RV world is the increased frequencies of problems due to the poor QA/QC in the industry and the operation of the RV in a "rolling earthquake" environment. They are not used to that with their car or house. RVs don't break any more frequently than ships, submarines or aircraft. The difference is there are system experts on those vehicles to repair the issues. That is not the case with the non-system interested person.

"Inherent interest" and "forced to learn" are key. Some folks don't want any part of those. They either have the cash to hire all maintenance and repair, or (the other end of the spectrum) let the rig rot... and we've seen lots of those.

That's likely not the picture of a retired military with technical training... the mindset isn't compatible with the line of work.