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Old 09-30-2018, 12:21 AM   #1
Junior Member
 
Brand: Still Looking
State: Missouri
Posts: 4
THOR #13270
Maui Sunset says hello

Hello from Maui
We live on Maui and the RV we are interested in would be located in St. Louis
Here's what we are thinking

We lived in St. Louis for 40 years and retired to Maui
our son still lives in St. Louis and just got married
the day we get that phone call from him "Hi grandpa and grandma" we want to spend time near his family

we don't want to buy another house since his work might have him move in a few years
we don't want to rent a house since something near him would rent for $30k/year
so we are thinking that an RV might be a possible solution

We are thinking that we would get an RV slot about 30 minutes away
We would park the night there, probably hook up shore power
and drive to our sons home to help with the kids during the day
we would fill up with water and plug in during the day

The yearly RV slot would run about $8k per year
we are looking for an RV less than $150k
and it has to be 4-season (whatever that definition is)
St. Louis winters average about 20F with a low of 0F to a high of 32F

We have never owned an RV and we want one that sleeps 4 and has seatbelts for 4
On the weekends we would travel around the midwest and probably take a trip to Alaska at some point

The ability to do this from January to April in St. Louis seems to be questionable
since there is NO definition of "4-season" in the RV world

I'd appreciate any thoughts and I don't mind a brutally honest opinion
I've kind of narrowed the selection to Winnebago's View/Navion 24D
but I don't want an RV that will leave us stranded on the ALCAN highway.

Thanks and hello
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Old 09-30-2018, 01:06 AM   #2
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2016 Vegas 25.2
State: Florida
Posts: 2,222
THOR #1589
Welcome to the forum! You will get several opinions, and I'll start them off. Grandkids are a powerful draw, and one of the biggest reasons that folks who have moved to Florida move back. Probably the same with folks that move to Hawaii.

One factor you left out was how much of the year you intend to spend on the mainland. December thru February can be snowy, icy and cold in St Louis. Or, not so bad.

I would be concerned about storing an RV so far from my home. Your son won't have any time to be checking on it for you, with his new baby. Can you count on your RV to be ready to go when you want it? (That will make forum members laugh!)

Are you handy around the house? If the answer is no, then you will be relying on RV repair folks to repair your coach. Read some posts here about the trials that can bring.

My suggestion would be to check out short term rentals, such as Airbnb and VRBO. Then you can focus on your family and exploring. JMHO
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Old 09-30-2018, 01:54 AM   #3
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1
State: Michigan
Posts: 9,180
THOR #1150
Welcome Maui,
That is a very interesting idea.

I think I'm in the same camp as Mr Sunshine: RV's in general are made for the warmer months and climates. Most people either store them during the winter, or drive them south.

Granted its a bit extreme but you may want to browse this thread:
http://www.thorforums.com/forums/f17...her-14187.html
(extreme in that they mention camping in -20F, not 20F...that sign makes all the difference ! LOL)
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Old 09-30-2018, 06:05 AM   #4
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Brand: Still Looking
State: Missouri
Posts: 4
THOR #13270
+Mr Sunshine and JaamieGreek

thanks for the reply

I'm guessing that Dec - Mar will have us winterizing the RV
and either going back to Maui
or short-term renting

I started to investigate Thor products
but came across some god-awful YouTubes
on what Thor did to new owners

If I had invested $200K+ in a Thor product
and it was in such poor shape
I'd have my lawyer write a letter
call TV stations
and post endless blogs
until Thor gave me my money back

what I saw was not just shoddy workmanship
but the purposeful destruction of the coach by the factory

I'm posting here because of the destruction of the new coach
almost seems like a PR stunt
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Old 09-30-2018, 02:37 PM   #5
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1
State: Michigan
Posts: 9,180
THOR #1150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maui Sunset View Post
+Mr Sunshine and JaamieGreek

thanks for the reply

I'm guessing that Dec - Mar will have us winterizing the RV
and either going back to Maui
or short-term renting

I started to investigate Thor products
but came across some god-awful YouTubes
on what Thor did to new owners

If I had invested $200K+ in a Thor product
and it was in such poor shape
I'd have my lawyer write a letter
call TV stations
and post endless blogs
until Thor gave me my money back

what I saw was not just shoddy workmanship
but the purposeful destruction of the coach by the factory

I'm posting here because of the destruction of the new coach
almost seems like a PR stunt
Watch those videos carefully: Was it Thor or was it the dealer? I ask because there are many of us on here that have been treated fairly well by Thor (phone calls returned quickly, inquires answered, even parts sent for some minor warranty repairs). The dealers, on the other hand, have been just terrible--and don't even think about picking up a coach from Camping World.

In addition, if you can get to Wakarusa, IN to get the Thor Factory service to do your warranty repairs do it. They will fix it better than anyone else and even cover stuff you didn't even list (during the walk through casually mention..hey this door doesn't fit right either, etc.).
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Old 09-30-2018, 03:16 PM   #6
Junior Member
 
Brand: Still Looking
State: Missouri
Posts: 4
THOR #13270
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamieGeek View Post
Watch those videos carefully: Was it Thor or was it the dealer? I ask because there are many of us on here that have been treated fairly well by Thor (phone calls returned quickly, inquires answered, even parts sent for some minor warranty repairs). The dealers, on the other hand, have been just terrible--and don't even think about picking up a coach from Camping World.

In addition, if you can get to Wakarusa, IN to get the Thor Factory service to do your warranty repairs do it. They will fix it better than anyone else and even cover stuff you didn't even list (during the walk through casually mention..hey this door doesn't fit right either, etc.).
Thanks for the reply.

Here's one of the videos:


my god what that owner had to put up with was criminal
by Thor

that one video stopped me cold from considering Thor as a supplier of our RV

There are no "lemon laws" in the RV world
as opposed to cars which force a manufacturer to correct/replace the lemon car

Honestly, if this is a typical Thor product they sell
we don't want any part of it
but if this was a "lemon" I can understand it's 1 out of a 1,000
and we probably won't be treated the same

I guess that's why I joined this forum - to see if this is typical or just a lemon.
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Old 10-01-2018, 01:14 AM   #7
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2016 Vegas 25.2
State: Florida
Posts: 2,222
THOR #1589
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maui Sunset View Post
I started to investigate Thor products
but came across some god-awful YouTubes
on what Thor did to new owners

You asked for a brutally honest opinion. Step back from the videos for a moment...Yes, there are new coach problems, EVERY brand has that, even the million $ + units. The RVs are built on an assembly line, but that line has more in common with the Model T line than a modern auto line. Don't assume that you can fly in, turn the key on your RV, (new or used) and have everything work perfectly. Many RVers won't buy a new coach, preferring to let the first owner (hopefully) work the bugs out. Some problems at some dealers have taken months to get fixed.

If you are an experienced RVer, and if you are able to do some minor repairs yourself, your idea could work. Otherwise, I suggest you think long and hard before going down the RV road.

Maybe time and money aren't issues for you. I've seen too many RV owners lose a ton of money when they figured out what it really takes to keep an RV on the road. The depreciation was a real bite for every one of them.

Someone on the web suggested depreciation like this:
New 100%
1 year old 91%
2 years old 83%
3 years old 75%
4 years old 68%
5 years old 62%
6 years old 57%
7 years old 51%
8 years old 47%
9 years old 43%
10 years old 39%
11 years old 35%
12 years old 32%
13 years old 29%
14 years old 26%
15 years old 24%
16 years old 22%
17 years old 20%

Note that this wasn't a percentage of list price, but of the actual selling price of a new RV. It is common to buy a new coach for 30% off list price. Take a 20 year loan with a low downpayment, and you are upside down from day one. You owe more than it's worth, and it worsens each year! Use this as a rule of thumb, your results will vary.
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Old 10-01-2018, 02:13 AM   #8
Junior Member
 
Brand: Still Looking
State: Missouri
Posts: 4
THOR #13270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Sunshine View Post
You asked for a brutally honest opinion. Step back from the videos for a moment...Yes, there are new coach problems, EVERY brand has that, even the million $ + units. The RVs are built on an assembly line, but that line has more in common with the Model T line than a modern auto line. Don't assume that you can fly in, turn the key on your RV, (new or used) and have everything work perfectly. Many RVers won't buy a new coach, preferring to let the first owner (hopefully) work the bugs out. Some problems at some dealers have taken months to get fixed.

If you are an experienced RVer, and if you are able to do some minor repairs yourself, your idea could work. Otherwise, I suggest you think long and hard before going down the RV road.

Maybe time and money aren't issues for you. I've seen too many RV owners lose a ton of money when they figured out what it really takes to keep an RV on the road. The depreciation was a real bite for every one of them.

Someone on the web suggested depreciation like this:
New 100%
1 year old 91%
2 years old 83%
3 years old 75%
4 years old 68%
5 years old 62%
6 years old 57%
7 years old 51%
8 years old 47%
9 years old 43%
10 years old 39%
11 years old 35%
12 years old 32%
13 years old 29%
14 years old 26%
15 years old 24%
16 years old 22%
17 years old 20%

Note that this wasn't a percentage of list price, but of the actual selling price of a new RV. It is common to buy a new coach for 30% off list price. Take a 20 year loan with a low downpayment, and you are upside down from day one. You owe more than it's worth, and it worsens each year! Use this as a rule of thumb, your results will vary.
Thanks for the info - I appreciate it!

Because of our age, I am looking at owning the rig 7 years
and I had guessed getting back 25% of the MSRP.
We will pay cash

So on a $150k MSRP rig that I can probably get for $110k
I'd look at getting back $37k ($150k * 25%)
or 34% of the actual purchase price ($37k/$110k)

our cost is $73k ($110k - $37k) for 7 years
throw in $8k/yr for the RV park = $56k for 7 years ($8k/yr * 7)
a total cost to us of $129k over 7 years
That's an average cost of $19k per year without fuel or maintenance

We are fine with that since renting a house will cost way more than that
or buying a house and selling it maybe 2 times will cost much more than that

The only fly in the ointment seems to be winter months
Dec - Mar in St. Louis and what to do

thanks again
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Old 10-01-2018, 03:27 AM   #9
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Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2016 Vegas 25.2
State: Florida
Posts: 2,222
THOR #1589
Kudos to you for doing the math. Far too many people miss doing that part. Suggest you add in an amount for insurance. Add in RV park costs for your travels, besides gas and maintenance/repairs.
Then factor in the fun and the learning you will gain. The equation is different for everyone. If you get down to specific models you are looking at, you'll get lots of suggestions here.
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