Free 7 Day Trial RV GPS App RV Trip Planner Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Free 7 Day Trial ×
 

Go Back   Thor Forums > Thor Tech Forums > Maintenance and Repair
Click Here to Login
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 05-16-2021, 08:14 PM   #1
Junior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: New Mexico
Posts: 3
THOR #23448
Girard Tankless Water Heater Trouble

Hi. I need a little help. I have 2019 Thor Vegas. It has a Girard Tankless Water Heater. The control panel has power and I have propane. The exterior faucet lights the unit and I have hot water. The interior faucets will not trigger the heater to kick on? Thoughts?

__________________
DNR65 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2021, 10:40 PM   #2
Junior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Outlaw 29H
State: Ontario
Posts: 24
THOR #4874
That's a head scratcher... I have same issue but no hot water...not even from outside taps
__________________
RV_Envy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2021, 12:01 AM   #3
Junior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: New Mexico
Posts: 3
THOR #23448
Quote:
Originally Posted by RV_Envy View Post
That's a head scratcher... I have same issue but no hot water...not even from outside taps
I figured mine out, low water pressure. Strange it worked outside but not in???? I wish I could help with yours
__________________
DNR65 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2021, 12:16 AM   #4
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2013 ACE 30.1
State: Alberta
Posts: 1,272
THOR #2631
Always turn off the hot and cold taps on the outside (dog wash) faucet, not just the spray head valve. This is a known cause for allowing hot and cold water lines to mix and possibly reduce the water pressure flowing from only hot faucets. The other thing to check is make sure your winter bypass valves are fully in their Summer positions.



We need more information on the other poster's Girard problem. Did it just start having a problem; does it try to fire but fails to light etc.
__________________
javelin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2021, 12:43 AM   #5
Junior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
State: New Mexico
Posts: 3
THOR #23448
Thank you for the info
__________________
DNR65 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2021, 12:53 AM   #6
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2013 ACE 30.1
State: Alberta
Posts: 1,272
THOR #2631
I guess regular bypass valves don't necessarily apply to RV instant water heaters unless they are add ons for maintenance or some sort of backflush setup.
__________________
javelin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2021, 02:03 AM   #7
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1
State: Connecticut
Posts: 548
THOR #20289
Quote:
Originally Posted by javelin View Post
I guess regular bypass valves don't necessarily apply to RV instant water heaters unless they are add ons for maintenance or some sort of backflush setup.
Thor installed the three way valves on my Girard water heater on my new Axis. Old habits die slowly.

David
__________________
DavidEM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2021, 03:28 AM   #8
Junior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Outlaw 29H
State: Ontario
Posts: 24
THOR #4874
Yeah, I have 4 valves ( I think)

1 is the big PVC drain
1 is a cold water supply to the water pump
1 is cold water bypass
1 is hot water bypass

I didn't winterize so I closed the PVC drain. Opened the supply and closed both the hot and cold bypass. (Assuming bypass)

Cold Water strong from both city and water pump to all faucets.
Hot Water, nada. Not even a drip.
No sound from Tankless water heater. Doesn't hum. Power and temp set but no activity. Lots of propane.

It's a 2020 Thor Gemini.

Gotta be something small but what da heck I am missing...no idea? Am I missing another valve? But shouldn't the system still hum or light?

Appreciate responses...4th motorhome but first time with tankless..
__________________
RV_Envy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2021, 10:08 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
Judge's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2020 Magnitude SV34
State: Florida
Posts: 2,106
THOR #12751
There must be 100 posts on here about the Girard Tankless Water Heater and recommendations on how to use them properly. The "search" function can be your friend.

Here are the primary issues causing hot water problem in order of most common occurence.

50% of the time the issue is related not enough water flow do to poor water pressure. You need at least 45PSI of water pressure coming into the tank.

30% of the time the issue is people mixing cold water with the hot like they do at home and not setting the thermostat to the desired temperature and then only opening the hot valve for water.

10% of the time the issue is related to construction debris in the water line cause the strainers (screens on the faucets and shower) to become blocked and restrict the flow. There is also a strainer / screen at the water inlet to the back of the unit. This can also become blocked with debris. Thor does recommend removing this strainer in cases where people are having flow issues. The house water system filter is before the tankless so assuming there is no construction debris in the water line coming into the tankless, the strainer should not be be needed.

5% of the time the incoming water flow valve on the back of the unit needs adjusted. When the incoming water temp is very cold, then slowing the flow will allow the water to spend more time in the heat exchanger to heat up enough.

5% of the time it could be one of several other issues such as.... there is an actual problem with the tankless unit.... there is a bad faucet cartridge and it is allowing cold water to leak and mix in with the hot water.... there is a kink or some other blockage in the plumbing restricting flow.
__________________
Judge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2021, 10:18 AM   #10
Senior Member
 
Judge's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2020 Magnitude SV34
State: Florida
Posts: 2,106
THOR #12751
Quote:
Originally Posted by RV_Envy View Post
Yeah, I have 4 valves ( I think)

1 is the big PVC drain
1 is a cold water supply to the water pump
1 is cold water bypass
1 is hot water bypass

I didn't winterize so I closed the PVC drain. Opened the supply and closed both the hot and cold bypass. (Assuming bypass)

Cold Water strong from both city and water pump to all faucets.
Hot Water, nada. Not even a drip.
No sound from Tankless water heater. Doesn't hum. Power and temp set but no activity. Lots of propane.

It's a 2020 Thor Gemini.

Gotta be something small but what da heck I am missing...no idea? Am I missing another valve? But shouldn't the system still hum or light?

Appreciate responses...4th motorhome but first time with tankless..

I have had two coaches with the Girard Tankless Water Heater and neither of them had a hot water tank bypass.... even though the schematics showed it. I think someone back at HQ is just lazy and reuses one set of schematics whether it is a tank or tankless water heater in a coach.

Anyway..... you said "Hot Water, nada. Not even a drip."

I take it to mean if you open the hot water on any faucet, there is no flow since you say "not even a drip."

If that is in fact the case, you need to check a couple items.

1) Check to make sure the inlet flow valve on the back of the unit is open and allowing water to flow into the tankless.

2) Remove the incoming water line at the back of the unit and check to see of the strainer / screen is plugged with construction debris. While you have it off you might want to make sure you have water coming through that line and into the tankless.

If you don't have a drip of water coming out the hot anywhere then that means there is no water getting into the tankless.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Screen Shot 2021-05-17 at 6.16.01 AM.png
Views:	37
Size:	382.7 KB
ID:	30572   Click image for larger version

Name:	Screen Shot 2021-05-17 at 6.16.37 AM.png
Views:	37
Size:	448.3 KB
ID:	30573  

__________________
Judge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2021, 12:16 PM   #11
I Think We're Lost!
 
Bob Denman's Avatar
 
Brand: Still Looking
Model: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
State: New York
Posts: 20,560
THOR #8860
I'd follow the Judge's lead on this...
Once you get the idiosyncrasies figured out: Girards actually work pretty well...
__________________
"Klaatu barada nikto"
Good Sam Member 843599689
Current coach: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
Bob Denman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2021, 11:07 PM   #12
Junior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Outlaw 29H
State: Ontario
Posts: 24
THOR #4874
Wow, thanks for your time! Not sure I have that version. I looked and either don't have that flow valve or if I do, can't be reached.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Judge View Post
I have had two coaches with the Girard Tankless Water Heater and neither of them had a hot water tank bypass.... even though the schematics showed it. I think someone back at HQ is just lazy and reuses one set of schematics whether it is a tank or tankless water heater in a coach.

Anyway..... you said "Hot Water, nada. Not even a drip."

I take it to mean if you open the hot water on any faucet, there is no flow since you say "not even a drip."

If that is in fact the case, you need to check a couple items.

1) Check to make sure the inlet flow valve on the back of the unit is open and allowing water to flow into the tankless.

2) Remove the incoming water line at the back of the unit and check to see of the strainer / screen is plugged with construction debris. While you have it off you might want to make sure you have water coming through that line and into the tankless.

If you don't have a drip of water coming out the hot anywhere then that means there is no water getting into the tankless.
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_20210517_155033048_HDR.jpeg
Views:	40
Size:	102.8 KB
ID:	30591
__________________
RV_Envy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2021, 12:04 AM   #13
Senior Member
 
Judge's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2020 Magnitude SV34
State: Florida
Posts: 2,106
THOR #12751
Quote:
Originally Posted by RV_Envy View Post
Wow, thanks for your time! Not sure I have that version. I looked and either don't have that flow valve or if I do, can't be reached.

Attachment 30591
This is the same Girard Tankless I have..... as a matter of fact my previsous coach was an Outlaw 29H.

You need to be inside the coach to see the back of the unit. The flow control and water hookups will be underneath the kitchen counter. Try taking out the trash can under the sink and looking behind there.
__________________
Judge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2021, 11:20 PM   #14
Junior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Outlaw 29H
State: Ontario
Posts: 24
THOR #4874
BINGO !!!

Pulled out a drawer in the kitchen and sure enough, there was the valve in the off position. Working perfect, thanks to you!

Appreciated!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Judge View Post
This is the same Girard Tankless I have..... as a matter of fact my previsous coach was an Outlaw 29H.

You need to be inside the coach to see the back of the unit. The flow control and water hookups will be underneath the kitchen counter. Try taking out the trash can under the sink and looking behind there.
__________________
RV_Envy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2021, 12:46 PM   #15
Junior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Quantum WS31
State: Massachusetts
Posts: 16
THOR #16115
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Denman View Post
I'd follow the Judge's lead on this...
Once you get the idiosyncrasies figured out: Girards actually work pretty well...



Got to disagree with this statement, they do not belong in an RV. Requiring 45psi is just unacceptable, many many older or smaller campgrounds are hard pressed to supply that pressure. If you're trying to conserve water while showering and shut off the shower head expect a nice cold run of water for about a 1 minute or so when you turn it back on. If you're trying to do dishes and don't want to keep the water running forget about having hot water.
__________________
Quint is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2021, 01:51 PM   #16
I Think We're Lost!
 
Bob Denman's Avatar
 
Brand: Still Looking
Model: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
State: New York
Posts: 20,560
THOR #8860
Quote:
Originally Posted by RV_Envy View Post
BINGO !!!
Pulled out a drawer in the kitchen and sure enough, there was the valve in the off position. Working perfect, thanks to you!
Appreciated!!!
Glad to see thuis post: congratulations!
__________________
"Klaatu barada nikto"
Good Sam Member 843599689
Current coach: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
Bob Denman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2021, 03:03 PM   #17
Senior Member
 
Judge's Avatar
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: 2020 Magnitude SV34
State: Florida
Posts: 2,106
THOR #12751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quint View Post
Got to disagree with this statement, they do not belong in an RV. Requiring 45psi is just unacceptable, many many older or smaller campgrounds are hard pressed to supply that pressure. If you're trying to conserve water while showering and shut off the shower head expect a nice cold run of water for about a 1 minute or so when you turn it back on. If you're trying to do dishes and don't want to keep the water running forget about having hot water.

And I'll politely disagree with your statement. It all depends on the type of camping you are doing.

If you are not doing a lot of boondocking and trying to conserve water (which is my case), the Girard Tankless is great. You can set a temperature, turn on the hot water and you can take a 30 minute shower if you want.

Yes.... some campgrounds have water pressure issues but many do not. If I do come across a campground where I can't get enough pressure, then I will switch over to my fresh water tank for showers.

I've had two coaches with the Girard and I have been very happy with its performance.
__________________
Judge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2021, 03:15 PM   #18
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Axis 24.1
State: Connecticut
Posts: 548
THOR #20289
Let's talk technical for a bit about water hydraulics:

Yes you may need 45 psi to push at least 0.8 gpm (Girrard's spec) through the water heater and outlet fixture, but I will bet the restriction is caused by the fixture not the Girrard.

For example my shower head would sort of dribble either hot or cold and was just on the border of meeting the 0.8 psi spec, sometimes the Girrard would turn on, sometimes it wouldn't. So the first thing that came to mind was trash in the shower head. So I unscrewed the hose from the shower head and found a 3/8" diameter white plastic "button" with three tiny holes in it. I removed the button and the shower head flowed like crazy. This was with the water pump, btw.

So look at your fixtures. Maybe trash has built up in them and requires 45 psi to get enough flow, but if you remove the trash you will get the flow even at much lower pump or shore power pressure.

David
__________________
DavidEM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2021, 03:35 PM   #19
I Think We're Lost!
 
Bob Denman's Avatar
 
Brand: Still Looking
Model: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
State: New York
Posts: 20,560
THOR #8860
The Truma systems only need .4 gal/min in order to work properly.
__________________
"Klaatu barada nikto"
Good Sam Member 843599689
Current coach: Tiffin Wayfarer 24 BW
Bob Denman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2021, 01:43 AM   #20
Senior Member
 
Brand: Thor Motor Coach
Model: Windsport 29m
State: North Carolina
Posts: 344
THOR #9553
Quote:
Originally Posted by Judge View Post
There must be 100 posts on here about the Girard Tankless Water Heater and recommendations on how to use them properly. The "search" function can be your friend.

Here are the primary issues causing hot water problem in order of most common occurence.

50% of the time the issue is related not enough water flow do to poor water pressure. You need at least 45PSI of water pressure coming into the tank.

30% of the time the issue is people mixing cold water with the hot like they do at home and not setting the thermostat to the desired temperature and then only opening the hot valve for water.

10% of the time the issue is related to construction debris in the water line cause the strainers (screens on the faucets and shower) to become blocked and restrict the flow. There is also a strainer / screen at the water inlet to the back of the unit. This can also become blocked with debris. Thor does recommend removing this strainer in cases where people are having flow issues. The house water system filter is before the tankless so assuming there is no construction debris in the water line coming into the tankless, the strainer should not be be needed.

5% of the time the incoming water flow valve on the back of the unit needs adjusted. When the incoming water temp is very cold, then slowing the flow will allow the water to spend more time in the heat exchanger to heat up enough.

5% of the time it could be one of several other issues such as.... there is an actual problem with the tankless unit.... there is a bad faucet cartridge and it is allowing cold water to leak and mix in with the hot water.... there is a kink or some other blockage in the plumbing restricting flow.
We had a 2017 Thor Axis 25.2 with the tankless water heater. I LOVED IT and wish I had one on our 2018 Windsport. I figured out like the other guy said, the best thing to do is adjust the temp. on the control panel to what is comfortable and only open the hot water valve.
__________________
knucklehead is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
troubleshooting, water heater

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Thor Industries or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.




All times are GMT. The time now is 08:19 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2