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Old 01-10-2019, 12:23 AM   #1
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110V for the heat pump

Have a 30 amp service and a 13.5 ac with heat pump. The heats pump works off 110v but is doing that causing damage to it?
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Old 01-10-2019, 12:56 AM   #2
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Have a 30 amp service and a 13.5 ac with heat pump. The heats pump works off 110v but is doing that causing damage to it?
What else would it run off? Your coach (and your Air Conditioner) requires 120 VAC to run whether it's cooling, running as a heat pump, or even if it just has an electric heating element in it.
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Old 01-10-2019, 01:35 AM   #3
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Any voltage above 104 is considered safe. That is the shut off voltage for most EMS systems. If you are worried, I suggest you purchase an EMS or a Hughes voltage booster
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Old 01-10-2019, 12:43 PM   #4
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what else would you expect it to work from? why would you think that using it would somehow do some 'harm' to it? : /

it's there - use it.
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Old 01-30-2019, 02:22 PM   #5
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All coaches except the very high end operate off 12v or 120 volt even when the 50 amp are connected to 220v service.
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Old 01-30-2019, 02:50 PM   #6
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I think I see your point, and you are correct, though the statement can be a little misleading or confusing to those new to rving, or those with 30amp Rvs...

most RVs with a single air conditioner are the more 'normal' 30amp variety, meaning that their Main electric panel and Shore power Cord are for a 'single' hot wire of 120v service, usually plugged into a '30amp' RV outlet - which is simply an outlet specially designed for only this 30amp plug, and the outlet has it's own 30amp BREAKER. The maximum 'amps' the RV can then make use of is 30amps. Enough to do most anything and everything in the RV, at the same time even.

but, some of the larger coaches, and/or those RVs with two roof air conditioners, and other additional electrical needs, will have a 50amp RV service - a larger Main electrical panel, a 50amp Shore power Cord(4 prongs instead of three), and will normally plug into a 50amp '4 prong' RV Outlet, which has a 50amp 'double pole' BREAKER set. The breaker is different because it is TWO breaker, with a common trip handle attached to both. This is actually two lines of 120v power, with each line having a limit of 50amps, or 100amps between both. This is MUCH greater than the 30amp service - more than 3 times as much.
This type of service is actually much closer to what you have in your home's Main electrical panel - TWO main hot wires coming in, splitting to two 'sides' of the breaker panel, with different sized breakers along each side for each circuit of outlets, or to a roof air conditioner, water heater, microwave, etc.
The electrical panel is designed differently in a 50amp coach versus a 30amp one.

Can a 50amp coach use a 30amp Shore Power outlet? YES, they do it all the time, as many campgrounds only have a 30amp outlet - but they use an ADAPTER to make this happen. The adapter simply uses the power from the outlet and 'shares' it to either side of the 50amp Shore Power cord's two HOT lines, so the coach can use any of the items in the coach, no matter which 'side' they are on, as long, of course, as no more than 30amps is used - otherwise the Shore Power breaker will trip, just as it would for any RV.

Can a 30amp RV use a 50amp Outlet? YES, with the correct adapter.
The adapter simply makes use of only one 'side' of the 50amp service, giving the RV the normal 120v power it would see at any 30amp outlet. The RV's own Electrical panel's Main 30amp Breaker would then be the safety mechanism, tripping if the RV tries to use more than 30amps. Simple.

Can any RV use a regular household outlet, or the ones you might even see at a campground or rv park? YES, with an adapter. It's done all the time.

My 50amp coach has made use of almost any conceivable power OUTLET you can think of. If you have the right adapter, 120v power to your RV is possible in so many situations where you might otherwise not consider. We've plugged into a regular household outlet many, many times when that was the only available shore power option. It's still 120v power, so everything works just as it would otherwise, but you have to monitor your AMPS - which is the combination of things you want to do, all at the same time.
You may can power all your device chargers, computers, water heater, and TVs while only on a household outlet. You might have a problem when you want to then add a large item like the roof air conditioner - more than likely your Shore Power outlet would trip. Does that mean you CAN'T run your roof air conditioner on a regular household outlet? NO - it simply means that you might have to turn off the water heater, and maybe unplug some devices that are being power, WHILE you run the air conditioner.

RVs are an education in Electrical knowledge, engineering, and management.

Once you can envision how 'amps' are important within your RV, you'll start to easily understand how to manage your electrical usage for your enjoyment. : )


travel, plug in, have fun ! : )
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Old 01-30-2019, 02:53 PM   #7
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I think I see your point, and you are correct, though the statement can be a little misleading or confusing to those new to rving, or those with 30amp Rvs...

most RVs with a single air conditioner are the more 'normal' 30amp variety, meaning that their Main electric panel and Shore power Cord are for a 'single' hot wire of 120v service, usually plugged into a '30amp' RV outlet - which is simply an outlet specially designed for only this 30amp plug, and the outlet has it's own 30amp BREAKER. The maximum 'amps' the RV can then make use of is 30amps. Enough to do most anything and everything in the RV, at the same time even.

but, some of the larger coaches, and/or those RVs with two roof air conditioners, and other additional electrical needs, will have a 50amp RV service - a larger Main electrical panel, a 50amp Shore power Cord(4 prongs instead of three), and will normally plug into a 50amp '4 prong' RV Outlet, which has a 50amp 'double pole' BREAKER set. The breaker is different because it is TWO breaker, with a common trip handle attached to both. This is actually two lines of 120v power, with each line having a limit of 50amps, or 100amps between both. This is MUCH greater than the 30amp service - more than 3 times as much.
This type of service is actually much closer to what you have in your home's Main electrical panel - TWO main hot wires coming in, splitting to two 'sides' of the breaker panel, with different sized breakers along each side for each circuit of outlets, or to a roof air conditioner, water heater, microwave, etc.
The electrical panel is designed differently in a 50amp coach versus a 30amp one.

Can a 50amp coach use a 30amp Shore Power outlet? YES, they do it all the time, as many campgrounds only have a 30amp outlet - but they use an ADAPTER to make this happen. The adapter simply uses the power from the outlet and 'shares' it to either side of the 50amp Shore Power cord's two HOT lines, so the coach can use any of the items in the coach, no matter which 'side' they are on, as long, of course, as no more than 30amps is used - otherwise the Shore Power breaker will trip, just as it would for any RV.

Can a 30amp RV use a 50amp Outlet? YES, with the correct adapter.
The adapter simply makes use of only one 'side' of the 50amp service, giving the RV the normal 120v power it would see at any 30amp outlet. The RV's own Electrical panel's Main 30amp Breaker would then be the safety mechanism, tripping if the RV tries to use more than 30amps. Simple.

Can any RV use a regular household outlet, or the ones you might even see at a campground or rv park? YES, with an adapter. It's done all the time.

My 50amp coach has made use of almost any conceivable power OUTLET you can think of. If you have the right adapter, 120v power to your RV is possible in so many situations where you might otherwise not consider. We've plugged into a regular household outlet many, many times when that was the only available shore power option. It's still 120v power, so everything works just as it would otherwise, but you have to monitor your AMPS - which is the combination of things you want to do, all at the same time.
You may can power all your device chargers, computers, water heater, and TVs while only on a household outlet. You might have a problem when you want to then add a large item like the roof air conditioner - more than likely your Shore Power outlet would trip. Does that mean you CAN'T run your roof air conditioner on a regular household outlet? NO - it simply means that you might have to turn off the water heater, and maybe unplug some devices that are being power, WHILE you run the air conditioner.

RVs are an education in Electrical knowledge, engineering, and management.

Once you can envision how 'amps' are important within your RV, you'll start to easily understand how to manage your electrical usage for your enjoyment. : )


travel, plug in, have fun ! : )
Great overview and well written

Tuscany has the load management system that shuts down the circuits as needed to avoid a brown out, most of the newer coaches now have that as standard equipment on 8K and above generator systems
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Old 01-30-2019, 03:04 PM   #8
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thanks, and you're right about the newer 'EMS' electrical management systems, but that only adds more confusion to those 'new' to RVing, or with only 30amp RVs, as they sometimes don't understand why you'd ever want a system to automatically 'shut off' things...

the EMS is designed to help the owner more easily 'manage' the amperage usage - and I certainly understand the desire, especially if you are 'less than' full 50amp RV service, or your generator is not the size to provide a full 100amps of power - though it seems as though some motorcoaches now have generators than can provide MORE than 100amps, especially at the high end, like Prevost and Newell - those that might be actually more apt to use the generator, even if 50amp service is available - ala, band tour buses with 6 air conditioners, etc.

throw in the discussion of HYBRID inverters, too, and you can have a whole good discussion about 'managing' power.... it's fun! : )


(did I just say 'fun'? oh well)
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Old 01-30-2019, 03:40 PM   #9
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Prevost and Newell have 100 amp power centers. High end RV resorts and entertainment venues have pedestals with 100 amp service. With five roof-top 15,000 btu A/Cs, you need all the power you can get. We have six 100 pedestals at the ATT center here. For the rodeo, we could probably use a another 50.
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Old 01-30-2019, 03:44 PM   #10
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Thanks for the great explanation. Someone had told me I shouldn’t run the heat pump unless I had the full 30 amp in use. Wasn’t sure if running it with just 110 was wearing it or shortening its life.

Ed
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Old 01-30-2019, 03:49 PM   #11
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Prevost and Newell have 100 amp power centers. High end RV resorts and entertainment venues have pedestals with 100 amp service...

hmm.... you might need to explain more what you mean by '100amp' service, as I'm not aware of anything different than the 'normal' 50amp RV Service outlet, which IS 100amps of service, 50amps from both 'sides', but I'm not aware of any 'special' 100amp RV service...
From my understanding, the power cord for a Prevost or Newell is the same as any other 50amp motorhome/motorcoach/RV.
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Old 01-30-2019, 04:03 PM   #12
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Thanks for the great explanation. Someone had told me I shouldn’t run the heat pump unless I had the full 30 amp in use. Wasn’t sure if running it with just 110 was wearing it or shortening its life.

that's why the 'someone had told me...' can be misleading. Many folks in rving have 'heard' things that may be true, and many that may just be false.

120v power is 120v power...it simply is not true that just because you are on a 30amp outlet versus a 50amp outlet that somehow your 'power' is less.
It is EXACTLY the same, and will power any device or appliance that uses 120v power - anything in your RV.

The only 'question' is of how MUCH this device or appliance demands, as far as AMPS go.
120v power is what is coming 'into' your RV, period. It doesn't change just because you are plugged into a 50amp outlet, a 30amp outlet, or a regular household outlet.

the ONLY difference is the AMPS your device or appliance NEEDS while it is running. Larger appliances have motors that require more of the 120v power than smaller lights and fans do, so the 'amps' they are needing creates a much larger DRAW on the wires within your RV, creating HEAT.
HEAT is what determines when a breaker trips, which is it's safety design.

A circuit breaker is sized for the appliance or device or outlets that are wired to it. So, your air conditioner is probably on a 20amp circuit breaker, whereas your outlets are only on a 15amp breaker - they may be on a thinner/smaller wire and cannot handle the amount of heat that a larger wire, like to your air conditioner, are designed for.

AMPS are the only difference in your power needs, limited by the size of the Shore Power breaker - the size or configuration of the outlet matters very little to most any RV or motorhome. While a 50amp RV service outlet is truly 240v service, each 'hot wire' going to your RV is only 120v, and your electrical panel only uses these 120v wires to each 'side' of your circuit breaker panel, almost like two separate panels, just integrated into a single box.
A very few motorcoaches DO use 240v service for a household Dryer or other appliance, but the vast majority of any and all RVs and motorhomes only use 120v power.
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Old 01-30-2019, 04:10 PM   #13
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I wonder how many amps does the heat pump need?
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Old 01-30-2019, 04:19 PM   #14
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no more than the circuit breaker that it's attached to, probably less than 20, but maybe only 12-14 depending on the model... typically a small electric heater, similar to what's in the 'heat pump', runs at either 750w to 1500w, either work on a 15amp circuit breaker, even along with other items at the same time.

I would think you'd have little issues with running the heat pump and most other items while on 30amp service.
If you find you have only 15amp service, or a regular household outlet, then you'd have to limit your usage to only the heat pump, and a few smaller draws at the same time - but the tripping of a breaker usually is a quick education in what you 'can' power, at the same time, on a certain sized breaker, or shore outlet.

and, YES, a 120v outlet, whether 30amp or 15amp, has the same power to run your heat pump, air conditioner, or anything else that is '120v' powered. The outlet 'type' is of no concern.
Some folks will say that you should always 'check' your 120v output for any outlet you plug into, or use an 'ems' external device between your RV and the Outlet, but that's rarely any issue.
We've traveled over 90,000 miles over 4 years all over this country, including Alaska, and Canada and have never used or needed any 'external' device to monitor or confirm our 120v power.
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Old 01-30-2019, 04:33 PM   #15
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that's why the 'someone had told me...' can be misleading. Many folks in rving have 'heard' things that may be true, and many that may just be false.
and is EXACTLY why I posted my question. Thanks for the info. Ed
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Old 01-30-2019, 05:49 PM   #16
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Thanks for the great explanation. Someone had told me I shouldn’t run the heat pump unless I had the full 30 amp in use. Wasn’t sure if running it with just 110 was wearing it or shortening its life.

Ed
As explained in great detail 110 (or 120) applies to the voltage. 30 (or 50) applies to the current.

You have multiple 120 Volt AC service plugs:

15 Amp


20 Amp


30 AMP RV


But the "50 Amp RV" outlet is really a standard 240 VAC outlet. It's rated at 50 Amps at 240 VAC but most RVs just use the 2 hot legs independently so each leg uses up to 50 Amps at 120 VAC for a "total" of 100 Amps at 120 VAC.
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Old 01-30-2019, 05:52 PM   #17
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I always wondered what those 20 amp outlets were supposed to look like: Thanks!
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Old 01-30-2019, 05:59 PM   #18
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thanks all.
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Old 01-30-2019, 06:16 PM   #19
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hmm.... you might need to explain more what you mean by '100amp' service, as I'm not aware of anything different than the 'normal' 50amp RV Service outlet, which IS 100amps of service, 50amps from both 'sides', but I'm not aware of any 'special' 100amp RV service...
From my understanding, the power cord for a Prevost or Newell is the same as any other 50amp motorhome/motorcoach/RV.
Sure - the pedestal has a dual NEMA14-50 receptacles with four 50 amp circuit breakers. These coaches carry two 50 foot ft electric cord reels. To be clear, there is no single 200 amp NEMA receptacle; although, there are 200 amp pedestals. The typical RV pedestal is 125 amp with three receptacles,: 50 amp (split phase). 30 amp & 20 amp GFCI (single phase),
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Old 01-30-2019, 09:37 PM   #20
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I wonder how many amps does the heat pump need?
Mine all have amps on the control panel
All are 1500 wars and draw bets 12 and 13 typically, on higher voltage pedestal then 10 to 11
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