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Old 05-03-2016, 01:53 AM   #61
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We've got the 5 speed and it does a very steady and deliberate job of braking going done steep inclines. After going through the Rockies to include Ten Sleep, Wyoming - I came to love the engine braking. Pulling a 4500 lb Explorer behind a 12 ton Challenger - I really came to depend on it.

Reading some of the forums (specifically the IRV F53 forum), the 6 speed for whatever reason doesn't seem to do as well.

On the flat and small hills, the 6 speed far outshines the 5 speed but gotta say - I needs the help stopping this 13 ton monster on 6 degree downhill.
Then stay off west bound Vail Pass til you get it figured out. Up here in Colorado we call it the bone yard. West bound Vail Pass 1-70 has 6% grade for 12 miles straight with two runaway strips for the big rigs. with regular use. lol. It would be interesting to hear how the 5 speed and the 6 speed performed on that hellish strip of asphalt if anyone's done it this year.
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Old 05-03-2016, 02:33 AM   #62
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Teeitup26 - I don't think I was clear. I have figured it out on the 5 speed and rely heavily on the use. My point was that the 6 speed owners relate issues with engine braking and the lack there of.

I was on that stretch of road (I-70) about 2 years ago and found it breathtakingly beautiful. The idea with engine braking is don't get in a hurry and don't overcook either the brakes or the engine whether it is 1, 2, 6 or 12 miles.

Our trip through Ten Sleep was difficult because it isn't straight, lots of switch backs with 20 MPH tops. Gotta constantly be aware of braking - both engine and wheels.

Hope that makes it clearer.
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Old 05-03-2016, 02:48 AM   #63
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Teeitup26 - I don't think I was clear. I have figured it out on the 5 speed and rely heavily on the use. My point was that the 6 speed owners relate issues with engine braking and the lack there of.

I was on that stretch of road (I-70) about 2 years ago and found it breathtakingly beautiful. The idea with engine braking is don't get in a hurry and don't overcook either the brakes or the engine whether it is 1, 2, 6 or 12 miles.

Our trip through Ten Sleep was difficult because it isn't straight, lots of switch backs with 20 MPH tops. Gotta constantly be aware of braking - both engine and wheels.

Hope that makes it clearer.
Ok, great you're clear. Thanks.
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Old 05-03-2016, 02:55 AM   #64
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Teeitup26 - I am also curious about how the 6 speed will navigate the long, steep slopes.

Also, how do you like the V10 gasser vs the DP - especially on the mountains?
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Old 05-03-2016, 03:14 AM   #65
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Teeitup26 - I am also curious about how the 6 speed will navigate the long, steep slopes.

Also, how do you like the V10 gasser vs the DP - especially on the mountains?
Ben, i'm still looking which is why i'm on this site. I love the Axis but i think i'm going to wait for a good used one with a couple of years on it. All my oil field buddies over here in western colorado have the V10 on their 450 pickups pulling heavy loads of pipe and such. They say you don't even notice whatever you're pulling is behind you with the V10. I would never own a diesel of any kind. They are great with the torque you need of course, but the expense of diesel new motors cancels the mileage they get in my opinion. And diesel mechanics bill at over $150 a hour these days if you can find one. Plus i hate the stink. But that's just me. I'm sure diesel is great for most big bucks people. I was looking at Class Bs last week in Grand Junction and all the Navions and such were $135,000 new and the Ford Chassis Class C's were $40,000 less. It's the diesel and the tranny to handle that torgue. Tons of money.
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Old 05-03-2016, 04:21 AM   #66
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....cut.... I was looking at Class Bs last week in Grand Junction and all the Navions and such were $135,000 new and the Ford Chassis Class C's were $40,000 less. It's the diesel and the tranny to handle that torgue. Tons of money.
No doubt M-B Sprinter-based motorhomes are more expensive than similar Ford-based V10 Class Cs, but it's not due to all that diesel torque. The Sprinter's 3.0L V6 is rated significantly lower in maximum torque than the Ford V10. I think it's around 325 lb-ft whereas the V10 is north of 400.

Anything Mercedes will likely cost more. And in fairness, most compact motorhomes built on Sprinter chassis seem to be built a little more upscale.
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Old 05-03-2016, 04:41 AM   #67
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No doubt M-B Sprinter-based motorhomes are more expensive than similar Ford-based V10 Class Cs, but it's not due to all that diesel torque. The Sprinter's 3.0L V6 is rated significantly lower in maximum torque than the Ford V10. I think it's around 325 lb-ft whereas the V10 is north of 400.

Anything Mercedes will likely cost more. And in fairness, most compact motorhomes built on Sprinter chassis seem to be built a little more upscale.
If what you say is true, and i'm sure it is, even more reason not to own a diesel. The room in these Class B's is small. Can't even imagine taking off for the winter and traveling in one. Seems to me what those units are for is for people who just want to travel a bunch; cover a bunch of miles and have a bed to flop in at the end of the day rather than a motel. . I'd rather have a Axis where you have the slide and some room to at least turn around. Put your feet up, watch TV, have dinner. And as far as the Sprinter chassis being built better hell it'd better be for $135,000 for 20 feet. I've looked at the Roadtrek units, but heck it's the same problem. There's no real room like an Axis. But i will give them one thing: you can park them like a car anywhere, close the shades and stay for a few days, and no one really would say anything unless you start setting out chairs and grills like you're staying a spell. No RV park fees. With stuff like the Axis and on up in size, you are guaranteed to spend $2500 a month if you're traveling, buying gas, staying in RV parks and all that. The cheapest part of the RV thing is buying the rig it seems like.
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Old 05-03-2016, 04:51 AM   #68
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Teeitup26 - I am also curious about how the 6 speed will navigate the long, steep slopes.

Also, how do you like the V10 gasser vs the DP - especially on the mountains?
Regarding the 6 speed. I have done extensive reading on the Ford site among others, and the whole idea behind the new transmission seems to be the control of speed and engine braking with it. You have the ability to hold the transmission in all the gears or not. It's not a tow/haul function. Tow/haul delays the shift up to a higher gear so that the engine is revving high enough to handle the load without lugging. I've probably misunderstood the Ford information which is why people are saying the 6 speed is harder to use for braking control.
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Old 05-03-2016, 05:12 AM   #69
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If what you say is true, and i'm sure it is, even more reason not to own a diesel. The room in these Class B's is small. Can't even imagine taking off for the winter and traveling in one. Seems to me what those units are for is for people who just want to travel a bunch; cover a bunch of miles and have a bed to flop in at the end of the day rather than a motel. . I'd rather have a Axis where you have the slide and some room to at least turn around. Put your feet up, watch TV, have dinner. And as far as the Sprinter chassis being built better hell it'd better be for $135,000 for 20 feet. I've looked at the Roadtrek units, but heck it's the same problem. There's no real room like an Axis. But i will give them one thing: you can park them like a car anywhere, close the shades and stay for a few days, and no one really would say anything unless you start setting out chairs and grills like you're staying a spell. No RV park fees. With stuff like the Axis and on up in size, you are guaranteed to spend $2500 a month if you're traveling, buying gas, staying in RV parks and all that. The cheapest part of the RV thing is buying the rig it seems like.
Yes, the V10 is rated at 420 lb-ft whereas the Sprinter V6 is 325 lb-ft -- at sea level of course. At high elevations the difference is less due to Sprinter being turbocharged.

Vans are great for people like us that travel more than camp. It also helps not to be a large person when stuck in tight spaces.

Sprinters come in lengths up to 24-feet, and Iveco has a van in Europe that is 25-feet long. Both have plenty of standup room. But they are only 80 inches wide, making it the biggest problem.

What's missing in my opinion to make Class Bs much better is for some company to come out with a large van that is also much wider. A van in the 86- to 90-inch width range could still be parked in standard parking places just like dually pickups are, yet living space would feel much larger.
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Old 05-03-2016, 09:27 AM   #70
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Teeirtup26 - I believe after reading some threads on the IRV2 sites that some of the 2016s with 6 speed trannies are not engine braking when headed done steep slopes. I would also assume by extension that the same motor homes would similarly lose the engine braking in stop and go traffic.

A number of peeps over on the IRV2 - F53 Chassis forum are discussing this failure at great length.

IMO engine braking is must have - especially for the areas of the country that you and I discussed earlier.

I am retired Army and spend a far amount of time (especially in the winter months) in warmer climates. One of the things I noticed about the "traveling van/mini motorhome" is that a fair number of them are owned by retirees not capable of driving a larger motorhome. It isn't what I would chose but it opens up traveling with an RV rather looking at places on a television. And that is great for all of us.
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Old 05-03-2016, 01:20 PM   #71
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There are a lot of great reasons for preferring a smaller motorhome even if you can drive a 40-foot rig.
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