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Old 05-10-2018, 01:22 AM   #1
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THOR #9037
Newbie Shore power / House Battery questions

I have a new Four Winds 24F, which I've had on the drive way for a couple of weeks. Its connected to Shore power, and everything was going fine. Then today I went in and could not get the radio to play.

All the other 12V stuff was working.

I disconnected Shore power, and then none of the 12V stuff worked.

I check the house battery and it was down to 4 V.

Put an auto battery charger on the house battery, and it's taking a charge, and with the charger connected, the radio works fine.

So,

1. Shouldn't shore power charge the house battery?
2. Should the radio only be connected to the house battery, and not the 12V system off the converter?
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Old 05-10-2018, 01:57 AM   #2
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First check that the store/use switch is on when ever you are plugged in to shore power, even though you are not using the coach. Unless the converter circuit breaker is off, the converter will keep the house batteries charged. Usually there is a relay that passes converter power to the chassis battery when the house batteries are sufficiently charged (the BIRD). There is also a converter circuit breaker in the battery compartment. It could be tripped.
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Old 05-10-2018, 02:20 AM   #3
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THOR #10225
I believe the Four Winds 24F is the same MH as our Freedom Elite 24HE. There isn’t a Use/Store switch like there is in older models. There is only a rocker switch. The power is automatically put in use mode when plugged into shore power. It cannot be turned off. When not plugged in, the DC power can be turned off and on.

For some reason, the radio is dependent on the chassis battery and house batteries. The DC house power must be turned on.

If your battery is not charged after being plugged in for a period of time, there’s something wrong with the converter/charger.
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Old 05-10-2018, 02:23 AM   #4
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THOR #1589
[I]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hickorybill View Post
1. Shouldn't shore power charge the house battery?
2. Should the radio only be connected to the house battery, and not the 12V system off the converter?
[/I

1. As was said, only if the USE/STORE buttton is set to USE.
2. The radio on our Vegas shuts off with the USE/STORE button, so it runs off the house battery, not the chassis battery.

I have a small inverter added to our coach, connected to the house batteries. For the first time ever, we left it on in storage, and it drained them in about 3 weeks. So far down that the USE/STORE button wouldn't open. No power where I store my coach., so I pulled them out and they both charged up just fine.
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Old 05-10-2018, 02:38 AM   #5
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THOR #9037
Ok,

So the radio is only hooked up to the house battery, and not the converted 12V system.

The converter is working because all the 12 V stuff works when hooked to shore power.

The house battery however is not getting charged by the converter.

I opened the corner of the bed, and I see the back of the fuse box, and the transfer switch, but I don't see the converter.
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Old 05-10-2018, 02:55 AM   #6
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THOR #7035
The converter is integrated into the breaker/fuse box.
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Old 05-10-2018, 03:03 AM   #7
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Thanks, that's very helpful.
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Old 05-10-2018, 10:37 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Hickorybill View Post
Ok,

So the radio is only hooked up to the house battery, and not the converted 12V system.
Our chassis battery runs down after sitting so I installed a switch on the battery. The radio won't work when the battery is switched off. For some reason, the radio is dependent to both house and chassis.
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Old 05-10-2018, 12:17 PM   #9
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THOR #9037
Checked with a meter this morning, and the house battery does charge when the engine is running (14.4 V), but does not charge when shore power is connected (12.2V or the same as when shore power is disconnected)
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Old 05-10-2018, 06:10 PM   #10
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THOR #9037
I have isolated the problem to the battery disconnect relay.

One side is showing 13V (Converter) the other 12.2V (house battery)

Fuses are good, so next check is the wiring.
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Old 05-10-2018, 06:51 PM   #11
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THOR #2601
Bill:

Don't know if the Four Winds has the BIRD/Trombetta like is in the Vegas/Axis but here is the schematic showing how the isolator relay and the chassis & house battery disconnects are wired. There have been a lot of Vegas/axis folks whose components were not wired as indicated in the schematic from the factory.

Also, on my Vegas the radio gets DC voltage from BOTH battery groups. House batteries are connected to the radio for normal operation and for the outside cameras. The chassis battery is connected to the radio for the station presets and clock. This way when the USE/STORE is in STORE and the house batteries are electrically disconnected, the clock and station presets do not have to reset when the house batteries are reconnected.

And also on the Vegas/Axis the house batteries will not charge if the USE/STORE switch is in STORE. You may not have a USE/STORE but you surely have some kind of battery disconnect switch that goes to a latching relay to electrically connect and disconnect the house batteries to the converter.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf BIRD & Trombetta.pdf (273.5 KB, 46 views)
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Old 05-10-2018, 08:17 PM   #12
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THOR #9037
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SOLVED

Undocumented Feature

The Battery Disconnect is a momentary switch with a lamp next to it.

The lamp is lit whenever there is 12V power, whether from the Converter (Shore Power) or from the battery.

The Switch toggles whether the battery is connected to the 12V system.

Since the lamp is lit whenever there is Shore Power, there is no visual indication if the house battery is connected to the 12 V system or not. With Shore Power Connected, all the 12V systems work, so the lights do not provide a clue if the house battery is connected either.

As the switch is momentary, there is no visual "Off" position for the switch.

The only way to know if the house battery is connected to the Converter is to listen quietly for the converter fan which only runs when the house battery is being charged.



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Old 05-10-2018, 08:35 PM   #13
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THOR #2601
That's what we were calling the USE/STORE switch that is in our Vegas/Axis. We don't have a light though to indicate when it is ON or in USE.
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Old 05-10-2018, 09:43 PM   #14
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THOR #9037
Quote:
Originally Posted by bevedfelker View Post
That's what we were calling the USE/STORE switch that is in our Vegas/Axis. We don't have a light though to indicate when it is ON or in USE.

The problem is the light only indicates if there is 12V power, and not whether the battery is connected or not.
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Old 05-23-2018, 02:11 AM   #15
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THOR #11687
[QUOTE=Hickorybill;119447]SOLVED


"Since the lamp is lit whenever there is Shore Power, there is no visual indication if the house battery is connected to the 12 V system or not. With Shore Power Connected, all the 12V systems work, so the lights do not provide a clue if the house battery is connected either.

As the switch is momentary, there is no visual "Off" position for the switch.

The only way to know if the house battery is connected to the Converter is to listen quietly for the converter fan which only runs when the house battery is being charged."


Thank you for this!! We just purchased our Quantum LF31 and we are learning as we go (with each "issue" we are encountering). The dealer walkthrough was not very helpful as they just didn't really know that much. Thankful for this forum is all I can say!!

Debi
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Old 05-24-2018, 01:53 AM   #16
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THOR #9537
Hello fro Miami, Fl
My control switch light is always green, even when not on shore power. When I park my rig and I make sure my batteries are charged before turning the switch to the disconnect. It make such a loud click like someone hitting the floor with a small hammer. This yesterday I tried to warm up the generator and found both batteries completely dead. When I checked had no power to anything, so I checked the switch nothing. So I plugged it back up and made sure switch was turn up. This morning nothing shore power did not charge. So off to auto parts to charge.
I have my 24 C plugged all the time at home, i unplug to check the control panel and check my batteries. When they are full turn off switch. Am I doing this right?
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Old 05-24-2018, 07:46 PM   #17
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THOR #11657
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hickorybill View Post
SOLVED

Undocumented Feature

The Battery Disconnect is a momentary switch with a lamp next to it.

The lamp is lit whenever there is 12V power, whether from the Converter (Shore Power) or from the battery.

The Switch toggles whether the battery is connected to the 12V system.

Since the lamp is lit whenever there is Shore Power, there is no visual indication if the house battery is connected to the 12 V system or not. With Shore Power Connected, all the 12V systems work, so the lights do not provide a clue if the house battery is connected either.

As the switch is momentary, there is no visual "Off" position for the switch.

The only way to know if the house battery is connected to the Converter is to listen quietly for the converter fan which only runs when the house battery is being charged.



So I have the Freedom Elite 22 with the same switch. So let me get this correct. If I am plugged into the external power supply I need to push the switch in (rocker) like I would if I was turning on the house power without external power? Is that correct?
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