New Owner Knowledge

[Campnjoe]

Originally Posted by Lt Keefer

I know we all had to start somewhere, but I have noticed a total lack of RV knowledge in a lot of questions being posted in the last couple of months. It is if RV dealers are selling them and just sending the new owners on their way with no basic RV system knowledge.

At least they found this forum and have started the long journey. I remember vividly our first trip out and hoping we did everything right.

If you ask me, what's scary is the fact that a lot of the new travel trailer owners seem to have no idea what their tow limit is or even how to figure it out.

[Driveby_Tourists]

Originally Posted by Campnjoe

At least they found this forum and have started the long journey. I remember vividly our first trip out and hoping we did everything right.

If you ask me, what's scary is the fact that a lot of the new travel trailer owners seem to have no idea what their tow limit is or even how to figure it out.

The one piece of advice I didn't heed was those that said, "don't buy all those toys and doo-dads for the RV until you go camping and figure out what you really need". Instead, I read through these forums and learned about TPMS and dually steel valves and Viair compressors and NRVIA inspectors and everything else I could well ahead of my first outing.
I don't need to subject myself to a blowout as a learning tool, if the correct answer is available right here.

[Party of 5]

As a newbie, I too appreciate all of your knowledge and experience you have shared. I have had experience with a truck and camper, but recently purchased our first rig. We are taking it out on our first journey this week. Fortunately, we were able to get into a campsite 5 minutes from home. Due to your information sharing, I feel confident we’ll have no issues setting up and breaking it down, although I expect we’ll have unexpected rig issues.

The RV employee that conducted our walk-thru was patient and knowledgeable. However, when he recommended I sanitize my grey tank and water lines, he was unfamiliar with the instructions for my rig. I was able to accomplish it without issues mostly based on the information I learned on this site. Again, thanks again for all of your assistance.

[GVP-The Boxcar Children]

As an experienced RV family I can share that our best sources of information have been corresponding directly with Thor, and this forum, in no particular order. Our delivering dealer on our Aria was an absolute disaster so we no longer contact them for anything at all.

I will also offer that the great majority of us veteran RVers here are more than willing to offer our expertise freely and with no strings if the subject is something we know about. The search engine up top is also invaluable.

In closing, let's not judge too harshly someone just getting into our hobby for their elementary questions. Offering our support is a great comfort to someone stuck with a broken slide in a campground and no idea where to turn-they turn to US!
Gary

GVP

[Judge]

I have noticed the same thing on the site. I have also noticed it out on the roads as well.

I can't blame all tne newbies..... I was one too once. Dealers are just useless when it comes down to educating the consumer. They just want your money and want you out the door in most cases. The poor training and information they provide is an injustice to then industry and the person getting into RV'ing. In some cases it is even dangerous.

I told my wife just last week that I have actually thought about starting an online RV Introductry Training Service based on what I have been seeing on the forums the last few months. I would go over all of the general information as well the importabt "need-to-know" stuff. Then if they have an iPhone or iPad, I could have them walk through their coach and I could explain the operation an function of the items in their specific coach.

It would be far better than anything they get from the dealer most of the time.

That being said.... I'm not sure how my online training service would ne needed. I think for as many people are getting into RV'ing now, more than 50% of the newbies will be getting out in 12 -18 months because they will realize its just not for them. Eventually most people will go back to their old lives.

[TurnerFam]

I think that there is no straightforward 'perfect' answer to what some feel is a 'lack' of education from dealers: dealers are there for one reason, to sell a product, not as an educational source for owners who think that for some reason all that education comes 'free' just because they purchased a product there. When you buy a home, it also does not come with an 'owners manual' and there is also no one there to 'educate' you how to operate it.

What people complain about really is a lack of educating themselves, but passing the buck to someone else who 'should have' told them this, or that. All of that is slightly ridiculous, though, as you don't know what you don't know until you know it: meaning that a dealer can 'tell' you about the dual water heater and how it works, in general, but until YOU get in the rv, travel, plug in, and start using it, you're not going to 'know' what the dealer was talking about until you actually have some REAL WORLD usage that then makes sense for the operation. Even then, when dealers DO go thru 'all the details', people will complain that they were told 'too much' and had no idea of how to process all that information when they have never used an RV before.

Of course it's aggravating when you don't know what a switch is for. Of course it's annoying when you think you should have hot water even though you didn't know that there was an additional switch on the water heater itself. Of course you're going to want to 'blame someone' when you didn't 'know' that you couldn't operate the roof air conditioner without running the generator. Of course you might have second thoughts when you find that you can't do 'everything' electrical at the same time without tripping a breaker. Of course..........

If you want RVs to be affordable, then yes, you're going to have some 'learning curve' to take on YOURSELF in order to keep it that way. If you want RV manufacturers to 'customer build' every unit, include a 'manual',
include full 'education', and charge you accordingly, you might NOT be on this forum in the first place: you would have bought a timeshare instead.

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by Party of 5

The RV employee that conducted our walk-thru was patient and knowledgeable. However, when he recommended I sanitize my grey tank and water lines, he was unfamiliar with the instructions for my rig. I was able to accomplish it without issues mostly based on the information I learned on this site. Again, thanks again for all of your assistance.

People sanitize grey tanks? Never heard of such a thing.

[EA37TS]

Originally Posted by TurnerFam

I think that there is no straightforward 'perfect' answer to what some feel is a 'lack' of education from dealers: dealers are there for one reason, to sell a product, not as an educational source for owners who think that for some reason all that education comes 'free' just because they purchased a product there. When you buy a home, it also does not come with an 'owners manual' and there is also no one there to 'educate' you how to operate it.
...

Bravo, well said!!!

[Bob Denman]

The Dealerships should (or at least could...); be a good source of information
for prospective buyers.
Unfortunately: the sales-goobers seem to barely know as much as the typical newbies.

[EA37TS]

Originally Posted by Bob Denman

The Dealerships should (or at least could...); be a good source of information
for prospective buyers.
Unfortunately: the sales-goobers seem to barely know as much as the typical newbies.

Devils advocate: why should the salesperson know as much as the person buying? They sell quite a few brands and most are different. Their occupation is salesperson, not trainer. The DOL has a separate job classification for trainers.

[Bob Denman]

That's a fair question...
The salesforce should always be able to answer questions accurately. They should also be able to tell when a customer is overwhelmed by all of the information that they are desperately trying to understand, and offer better explanations.
It all comes down to building Good-Will through better service.

[atreis]

The sales person should always have pretty good basic familiarity with the product they're selling, regardless of industry. Knowing the answer to every question right off the top of their head isn't necessarily reasonable, but they should know where to find out and have no problem saying, "I'm not sure, but I'll find out and get back to you," and then actually do it, rather than making stuff up that's just wrong.

FWIW, the person that did delivery for my RV was very willing to spend as much time with me as I wanted. Because there was a winter storm headed in and I wanted to get home before it hit, I didn't want as much. I did ask him about a couple things though that he wasn't sure about. He let me continue my inspection while he went off and got the answer, came back, and gave me the answer. All in all, it was a good experience, and I felt sure that if I had been a newb (and not trying to avoid a storm) I could have spent as much time as I wanted. The dealer should be willing to do this, and the customer that needs it should be willing to take the time and ask anything and everything that comes to mind.

BTW, one of mine: How do I adjust the mirrors? He and I started messing around with them trying to figure it out (and utterly failing). He then went off and got the answer.

I also asked the tech some things while he worked on fixing a rattle in the furnace (the only thing I had them fix). He was also very helpful and willing to take the time to answer questions even though he was there to do a job.

[MJC62]

I was fortunate to grow up in a camping family. My folks bought their first TT in 1965 and we kids all had tasks when we arrived to help set up camp. It is easy to forget how overwhelmed my father must have been when moving from a tent to a travel trailer with five kids in tow as well. I remember the RV "dealer" also ran the local grain elevator.
Today with the web all those questions dad had to figure out for himself are available on the phone in your hand!
Of course back then dad's knew everything! At least us kids thought so .
For the "newbie" get as much info as you can from the selling dealer, read the manuals, then sign up for the mfgrs owners links, most of the basic information is out there along with a boat load of how to videos. The guys and gals on this and other forums will be here as well. Living in the age of the internet is amazing. I can still remember dad reading a manual by the light of a white gas lantern!

[Hooligan2]

That information does not come for FREE...
Your purchase invoice has a serious 'preparation charge' which includes a "Pre-delivery Inspection". You pay for that inspection which is to show you not only that everything works but how to work it. Most new buyers are not aware they paid for this and many dealers make short shift of it, if they can.
It's not buying a house or an automobile... which most new buyers assume it is. Totally different relationship..
My 4th RV (3 different dealers) and each time it was a service tech, not the salesman that did the PDI. It was as thorough as I wanted it to be.
(PIA is a complement)

[16ACE27]

Originally Posted by TurnerFam

When you buy a home, it also does not come with an 'owners manual' and there is also no one there to 'educate' you how to operate it.

That is not a fair comparison with someone buying their first RV................





Unless they had grown up in and lived all their life in an RV - in which case they probably don't need an "owners manual" or someone to 'educate' them on how the RV systems work as they are already intimately familiar with all the systems.

[Aria-3601]

Originally Posted by Scubawise

Motor Home specialists spent detailed time with my wife and I.
Great place. And us newbies appreciate all you !

We had the same experience in Alvarado Tx. Our first purchase from them was a Class A, Mirada, and we traded it in for a diesel pusher, Aria 3601, a couple years back. we were comfortable enough with our salesman to be able purchase the Aria from their website and it was just as nice in real life.

[Judge]

Originally Posted by EA37TS

Devils advocate: why should the salesperson know as much as the person buying? They sell quite a few brands and most are different. Their occupation is salesperson, not trainer. The DOL has a separate job classification for trainers.

So I will take the other side of the argument.....

I've been in sales for over 20 years. It is incumbant upon me to be the subject matter expert and explain the differences between the solutions I sell and competitor XYZ as well as the benefits of dealing with me and my organization. The bottom line is I need to know more than the customer and I need to be credible.

Now we have trainers and technical experts who can get into the weeds at the appropriate time... but that is after the sale more often than not.

If the customer knew more than I did, there would be no need for a sales rep. They could just place an order and be on their way. That is just not the bulk of the customers who are buying.

In very rare cases, customers do know a lot and as much as a well informed sales rep because..

- They did their homework
- They have many years of hands on experience
- They know the right questions to ask

But that as a very small percentage of the consumer base and the exception... not the rule.

There is a rule in sales.... regardless of the product, solution or service being sold..... It is easier to get repeat business from an existing customer than it is to get business from a new customer.

A knowledgeable and well-informed sales rep has a much better opportunity to have a customer come back in a few years to buy another coach from that sales rep because of their knowledge and making the sales process easy for the customer (even making sure that items uncovered in a PDI get resolved to their customer's satisfaction).

RV's are not rocket science. A sales rep who doesn't invest the time and effort to learn about the products they sell (regardless of the numbe of modesl they sell), how they work and the differences is just lazy and akin to a used sales guy that just wants to sell a box on wheels... collect their paycheck.... and go home.

There are plenty of sales reps out there that fall into the lazy category.... but that is as much an issue with people's work ethic today than it is about RV's.

[Bob Denman]

Amen...

[EA37TS]

Originally Posted by Judge

...

There is a rule in sales.... regardless of the product, solution or service being sold..... It is easier to get repeat business from an existing customer than it is to get business from a new customer.

...

A very wise dealership owner once told me that his uneducated, undertrained sales force sells the first unit while his highly qualified service department sells the second and third. He also stated that repeat business is generated by the repeated contact with service (warranty and routine) and not the one time contact with sales. He realized a price cut is often the most compelling sales factor and often makes up for sales force deficiencies.

[Judge]

Originally Posted by EA37TS

A very wise dealership owner once told me that his uneducated, undertrained sales force sells the first unit while his highly qualified service department sells the second and third. He also stated that repeat business is generated by the repeated contact with service (warranty and routine) and not the one time contact with sales. He realized a price cut is often the most compelling sales factor and often makes up for sales force deficiencies.

To me that is the difference between a lazy sales rep and a good sales rep. My rep from General RV has contacted me twice since selling me my Magnitude. He was a fairly young guy.... probably late 20's or early 30's.

I never heard from the sales rep who sold me my Outlaw 29H at another dealership. He was probably in his early 40's.

Which dealership and / or sales rep do you think I would purchase from again with service being relatively equal?

I even paid a little more for my Magnitude versus flying down to MHSRV in Texas because the sales guy positioned the General RV "Keep You Camping Guarantee" and same day service for critical issues and the fact that General RV had over 12 locations in 6 states.

The sales guy convinced me it was worth paying $2K - 3$K more by positiong the value of GenerL RV. I appreciate that and consider him a good sales person as a result. I myself have sold systems to customers when I was the most expensive because I positioned value in addition to price and I spent time to build a relationship.

To me you only have one chance to make a good first impression. If a dealership chooses to value my business so little that they don't give me their best right out of the gate, I have no interest in doing business with them.... whether they are the cheapest price or have the best service this side if the Mississipi.

I've been successful in sales because of relationship building and supporting the customer after the sale. But that's just me and my view of it......