Advanced troubleshooting, Lippert slideout controller

[natemoore]

Starcraft Launch RLS24 Arctic

Lippert 13398-C2 dual motor slide controller

1,9 or 1,8 are the codes as indicated by the blinking LEDs.

Trying to troubleshoot it. I pulled both motors out and both bench test fine with a 12V battery. I have no way of testing the Hall effect sensor, but they're simple, so I am assuming they're good. I placed the motors where I could see them during these procedures. I labeled the motors 'A' and 'B'. Here's what I've got so far:



Rear Position---------Slide Toggle Button/---------Front Position
---------------------------Code Indicated

Motor B-------------------------IN--------------------Motor A
---------------------------------1,9

---------------------------------OUT
---------------------------------1,8

Next, I switched the motors to see if the code would follow the motor.

Motor A-------------------------IN---------------------Motor B
----------------------------------1,9

---------------------------------OUT
----------------------------------1,8

Then, I switched the motor 1 & motor 2 wiring harnesses at the controller to see if the code would follow the harness.

Motor B--------------------------IN---------------------Motor A
----------------------------------1,8

----------------------------------OUT
-----------------------------------1,9

Motor A--------------------------IN---------------------Motor B
----------------------------------1,8

----------------------------------OUT
-----------------------------------1,9

Notes: '1' means one green LED flash indicating motor 1. '8' is a wire short between controller and motor. '9' is a Hall power short to ground.

It looks like the motors are not the problem, and the faults changed with the wiring harnesses, but only in as much as the position of the IN/OUT toggle switch makes the code change from an 8 to a 9 and vice versa.

But the motor code always stayed 'motor 1,' one green LED flash. You'd think switching around the motor harnesses would throw a 'motor 2' code.

I'm going to painstakingly do a continuity and short-to-ground test of the harnesses. I wish there were a self-test for the controller. It's $312 on Amazon. I'll throw cheap parts at a problem to save time, but I don't want to throw $312 at a problem without knowing for certain that the controller is bad.

Any advanced troubleshooters want to give their opinion?

[Beau388]

It is possible the Hall effect sensor in the motor is shorted. Hall effect fault will always show up as motor one as that is the way the controller chip is designed. Generally the fault will be in the five wire cable and usually at a wear point (at the ends of the wall chaise).

[natemoore]

Originally Posted by Beau388

It is possible the Hall effect sensor in the motor is shorted. Hall effect fault will always show up as motor one as that is the way the controller chip is designed. Generally the fault will be in the five wire cable and usually at a wear point (at the ends of the wall chaise).

That's good information to know! I visually inspected the wires. Didn't see anything unusual. Wish I had a wiring diagram for the motor.

At least a motor is cheaper than a controller.

Thanks.

[TurnerFam]

My experience with several times and issues with our slides is this:

- no matter what 'codes' I've ever seen, two things solved any of my issues, bar only 1...
A) running the slide FULLY in or out, and HOLDING the switch for several seconds after
B) replacing the motor

- I've seen my controller 'blinking' on several occasions, while parked long-term, and even after having the slides out for weeks. Any 'issue' that the codes might be alluding to had NO effect of the operation, or since.

- back in late 2015, right as our warranty was coming to an end, we arrived at a SC rv park, parked as we normally would, and ran out the slides. This time, though, the main slide 'POPPED!' about 1/2 way out... it was loud, and not 'normal' for all of the miles of travel and times we had operated it, probably hundreds.
While I finally got the slide back in, the rear bottom still hung out about 2", although the top was flush... that's not good. Having a different front to back is one thing, as the 'syncing' of the motors can solve that, but a difference top to bottom ultimately means that the main GEAR has jumped several of the 'tracks', in this case, on the bottom rail, and even though I have one of the original '3trax' rail installations, mid 2014 build.
Even though the slide was not fully seated against the side wall, we could still continue our trip to California, and we did with no issues, and could still get the slide 'out' somewhat, for use when parked along the way. The factory originally was going to send out a mobile rv repair to replace the whole 'column' that sits in the wall, and holds the gears, top to bottom gear rod, etc., but I decided that I didn't like the idea and wanted Wakarusa and the factory Service Center to take on this task.
We arrived, after a snowstorm, in early February 2016 for our scheduled appointment day. They took care of the whole replacement in a single day, and we've had not a single issue since.

: )

[natemoore]

I tested the continuity of the wires between the harness connectors and the soldered connections at the motors' circuit boards. They're all good. Also, there is no cross continuity between the brown, green, or blue wires. I do have continuity between the black and red wires on both motors, but I'm assuming it's because they're DC motors with commutators and brushings.

If I don't find as issues with the wiring harnesses in the wall, I'm going to have to order a new motor and a new controller from Amazon, and see which one corrects the problem, then return the other.

[natemoore]

Great!!!!! I put the controller into bypass mode, i.e., six presses of the button then holding on the seventh. LEDs do their thing, but **POOF** a puff of smoke and that familiar smell from when I used to smoke 741s as an engineering student 35 years ago.

It still operated like it should, running the motors for as long as I held in the IN or OUT button, then it reset normally, and then popped the same codes as before. I wonder what fizzled? I can't really read the chip number anymore because of the blister.

Dang it! I just know I'm going to have to drop $500 for a new controller and two new motors. Maybe I can install a dual IN-OUT toggle so that each motor is manually controlled by the operator, just press to apply voltage to the motor. Tweak one motor or the other as needed to fully open or close the slideout?Simplify the whole operation? If I were keeping it, I would almost certainly do that given that these Lippert parts are so unreliable and need to be replaced often.

I'm glad we're selling it.

[Beau388]

Originally Posted by natemoore

That's good information to know! I visually inspected the wires. Didn't see anything unusual. Wish I had a wiring diagram for the motor.

At least a motor is cheaper than a controller.

Thanks.

Here is the instructing, installation and trouble shooting manual - <https://lci-support-doc.s3.amazonaws.com/manuals/slideouts/ccd_0001602.pdf>

[natemoore]

Turner, that's an interesting story, but not really applicable to my situation. You did give me an idea, though. Maybe I could put it in bypass mode permanently. I think leaving the toggle switch depressed for a few seconds after opening or closing would correct any gap issues?

[natemoore]

Beau, that manual is better than the one I've already downloaded and read, but the actual troubleshooting steps are pretty much the same.

However, you did save me from buying the latest -D0 revision on the controller. I don't really want to run new harnesses and run a new 12V wire from the toggle switch over to where the controller is housed on the opposite side. So thanks for saving me from that. I almost bought a -D0 controller on eBay today.

In the absence of a definitive way to test the Hall Effect sensors, and now that some chip on the controller bit the dust, I think I'm going to have to buy two new motors and a new -C2 controller. I wouldn't want to risk damaging the new controller with a bad motor, hence replacing both.

Bummer.

[powerboatr]

last year we had a weird one with our lippert controllers for the BAL cable slides. I talked to a guy at BAL directly and he walked me through a fantastic procedure to check and get us moving. He even called me back a few hours later (when he was off work) to make sure i was all good. If you have a BAL slide room cable set up. its worth call. He was over the top knowledgeable,

[natemoore]

The controller was telling the truth, at least in part. When I checked continuity for the forward motor harness, probing the two ends of each color wire, then touching the others while one lead stayed in place, I found a short between the red wire and the brown wire. I crawled under the wheel well and found a whole bunch of little wires with their insulation worn off. It's way up in the corner, so I wonder how this happened. The rubber is even worn off the edge of the wire retainer. I could see the bare red wire touching the bare brown wire.

Anyway, it's in a difficult spot to get to, but once I repair it, it should solve my problems, assuming that little IC chip that smoked isn't that critical to its operation. I will test everything out after I fix the wiring. Hopefully, it won't cost me anything else.

If there ever is a next time, I'll know to check the wiring harness first, but I think we're going to go back to a simple popup. We had some good times in 'Ol Sweet Pea, our first camper.

[powerboatr]

ooooh thats a problem with insulation gone, i found 4 controllers on ebay back then and ordered all four for under 20. They go with us every trip now, they are the older one, as in the exact same one as installed. great to see you found the culprit

[D and C Kincaid]

We had the same problem on our ACE 29.3 with it throwing the 1-8 and 1-9 codes, but never any problem as far as running the slide in and out. So, I would reset it, and it would behave for a period of time, then do it again. I read a number of comments on this forum about not running the slider in or out on less than full power, and a writer or two indicated that meant not ever just using battery power. So we started doing that. If we were not first plugged in to full 30 amp power, we would run the generator to power the slider. That actually stopped the controller from throwing any codes for quite a while, so I figured "problem fixed". Then in January of this year, while on a trip, the slider stopped mid extension, and we had the 1-8 code, which was consistent this time instead of changing. We were thankfully able to get a mobile repair the next day, and he determined that the front motor was toast. After parts ordering, both motors were replaced. But then the bottom of the slide was much further in than the top, which may or may not have been a problem before the motor failure, but was very noticeable now. The repairman determined that the slide rack assembly was going to need changing, but it is a special order part, takes at least 10 days to come in, and was safe to use carefully to finish our trip. When we got home we took it to our local shop and had the replacement effected. There were some munched teeth in the gears and some twisting in the slide rack itself at that time. All told several thousand dollars. Thankful for our extended warranty!! No one seems to be sure how the slide got out of alignment. We always, from day one, held in the in or out button for the 3 - 5 seconds recommended in the owner's manual, so syncing should have always been taken care of. Hope yours doesn't go to this point, and that replacing the parts you have replaced will save it from any more problems.

[duncii]

To cure my 2" gap at the bottom of the slide I cut an appliance dolley in half and liquid nailed each half to the interior underside of the slide. Been in and out a 100+ times with no problems. It keeps the slide from dipping as it comes in. Cost $20, cut and glue about 20 minutes. Let cure overnight

[JohnK]

I bought and keep a spare 30 foot wiring harness, I had the “hall sensor” code problem. Used the 30 foot wire to run it from the basement outside and then through window, sure enough bad wiring harness, replace wiring harness and problem solved. Then two months later on a different trip same problem different slide, used my spare when setup and rolled it up in basement, at each setup or takedown it was simple to roll out and moved the slides, repair broken wear point when I finished the trip.

[Sonny]

Originally Posted by natemoore

The controller was telling the truth, at least in part. When I checked continuity for the forward motor harness, probing the two ends of each color wire, then touching the others while one lead stayed in place, I found a short between the red wire and the brown wire. I crawled under the wheel well and found a whole bunch of little wires with their insulation worn off. It's way up in the corner, so I wonder how this happened. The rubber is even worn off the edge of the wire retainer. I could see the bare red wire touching the bare brown wire.

Anyway, it's in a difficult spot to get to, but once I repair it, it should solve my problems, assuming that little IC chip that smoked isn't that critical to its operation. I will test everything out after I fix the wiring. Hopefully, it won't cost me anything else.

If there ever is a next time, I'll know to check the wiring harness first, but I think we're going to go back to a simple popup. We had some good times in 'Ol Sweet Pea, our first camper.

You have probably read my posts awile back. I have the 1-9 blinking lights in both the bed slide and wall slide. I have talked to Thor and LCI. I performed continuity tests of the Hall Effect wires to see if they were shorted thus giving me the 9 blinks. All checked good. They then had me check all grounds. There i found loose grounds. Tightened no change. Thor sent two new controllers no help. This is what I have found;

1. Start the engine and let idle for 10 minutes activate house power no flashing
lights appears to function normal. ( most of the time)
2. Press the extend/retract sw to retract twice and the slid will move in slightly lights go on steady momentarily then go out as they should then as long as i dont turn off the house power the slid can go in and out no lights all same for the bed
Controller.

Im still looking for any advice. I have read everything from controller changes to motor and harnesses changes. It appears when i turn off house power the motor brakes relaxes and the slid motors move. One owner said he would put a slide brace in to stop the slid from moving when turning off power. I never heard back.

[Sonny]

Originally Posted by natemoore

The controller was telling the truth, at least in part. When I checked continuity for the forward motor harness, probing the two ends of each color wire, then touching the others while one lead stayed in place, I found a short between the red wire and the brown wire. I crawled under the wheel well and found a whole bunch of little wires with their insulation worn off. It's way up in the corner, so I wonder how this happened. The rubber is even worn off the edge of the wire retainer. I could see the bare red wire touching the bare brown wire.

Anyway, it's in a difficult spot to get to, but once I repair it, it should solve my problems, assuming that little IC chip that smoked isn't that critical to its operation. I will test everything out after I fix the wiring. Hopefully, it won't cost me anything else.

If there ever is a next time, I'll know to check the wiring harness first, but I think we're going to go back to a simple popup. We had some good times in 'Ol Sweet Pea, our first camper.

Where is this wiring located?
Thanks

[Rickc]

Sorry guys but I don’t understand most of the “testing” that you are doing. I have an ACE full slide that will not retract. Everything was fine,then all of a sudden nothing. Did the 6button controller thing...nothing. The drivers side seems to work but not the rear one. How do I manually push it back so I can get repaired. Thanks.

[gmc]

Originally Posted by Rickc

Sorry guys but I don’t understand most of the “testing” that you are doing. I have an ACE full slide that will not retract. Everything was fine,then all of a sudden nothing. Did the 6button controller thing...nothing. The drivers side seems to work but not the rear one. How do I manually push it back so I can get repaired. Thanks.

You mention ‘full slide’ and then ‘rear one’... so not sure how big a slide you are dealing with...
In theory, unplugging the motors removes the ‘brake’ holding the slide in place and it can be manually pushed in with suitable ‘people power’. Plug in motors again to hold it there.

Was able to do bedroom slide with 3-4 people.. Not a chance for my living room slide with 6 people. Never tried a full slide.
I’ve seem comments that physically disengaging the motors makes it easier.

[natemoore]

Go to youtube. You will find several videos on the subject.