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Old 07-21-2021, 04:37 AM   #1
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State: Alabama
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THOR #24254
Replacing emergency start solenoid

Hello :-). I have a parasitic drain on my chassis battery when I am hooked up to shore power or even with just the coach batteries turned on. It is pulling 7 milliamps all the time if hooked up to shore power or the batteries in the coach or turned on. If not hooked to shore power or the coach batteries on it is pulling 2.5 milliamps which I don't think is that bad but may be a problem to fix down the road. I really want to test the emergency start solenoid as I think that might be the problem also it does not make any clicking sounds when I depress it which I think it should. That was a lot of words just to ask where on a 2017 Thor Ace the emergency start solenoid is located so I can test it? Thank you so much :-)

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Old 07-21-2021, 04:47 AM   #2
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Hi and welcome! your parasitic drain is really nothing to worry about. You have several devices in the rig that are on all the time, such as the propane detector.
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Old 07-21-2021, 04:50 AM   #3
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THOR #7035
Well, you don't have an "Emergency Start Solenoid"; the emergency start switch just energizes the device that ties the house and chassis batteries together. That device may be a:
Trombetta Solenoid
A solenoid in the Battery Control Center (unlikely - superseded by the BIRD and Trombetta in 2015 or 2016 in the ACE line)).
A Battery Isolation Manager (BIM)

The BIRD and Trombetta solenoid are normally located in the battery compartment.
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Old 07-21-2021, 05:22 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by HarryS View Post
Hi and welcome! your parasitic drain is really nothing to worry about. You have several devices in the rig that are on all the time, such as the propane detector.
Harry is right. In the RV you have lots of little Amp Eaters that are sucking from the battery 7*24.

Just too clarify, I think you said Chassis battery? You also have Amp Eaters sucking on you chassis battery even when you think the vehicle is 'off'. Typically this can be as high as 50Milliapms so you sound like you doing really well. The radio memory for example pulls some current even when the radio is off. You have others too. If you want to test the emergency start function that joins the house and chassis battery together (I think this is what you are asking to do) then get the house fully charged. Measure the volts on each battery set and note the voltages. Keep your ignition off or in just the auxiliary position and turn your head lights on to pull the chassis battery voltage down below the house battery by a few tenths of a volt. Not so low you can start the engine! Now, press the emergency start and if the two battery systems join together to 'jump the chassis battery' you will see a jump in the chassis battery voltage. If it stays the same, your not getting the circuits bridged. May need somebody to help you so you can stay 'eyes on' the volt meter while a helping hand flicks switches. Personally I try to not leave home without a volt meter and the DW!
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Old 07-21-2021, 05:42 AM   #5
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Thank you all so much! :-) what a great response. I hope to be more involved with this community! The thing that was throwing me was that I thought the chassis battery and the coach batteries for the most part don't talk to each other. So I thought it was strange that if plugged into Shore power or if I have the batteries turned on in the coach the parasitic Pole from my chassis battery goes from 2.5 milliamps to 7 Miller amps. But if that does not sound strange to the rest of you than I will roll with it :-). Do you think there should be a clicking sound of a solenoid when I depress the emergency start button? I really would like to find the bird. I will look again when the sun comes up :-)
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Old 07-21-2021, 06:23 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Boise Jamo View Post
Thank you all so much! :-) what a great response. I hope to be more involved with this community! The thing that was throwing me was that I thought the chassis battery and the coach batteries for the most part don't talk to each other. So I thought it was strange that if plugged into Shore power or if I have the batteries turned on in the coach the parasitic Pole from my chassis battery goes from 2.5 milliamps to 7 Miller amps. But if that does not sound strange to the rest of you than I will roll with it :-). Do you think there should be a clicking sound of a solenoid when I depress the emergency start button? I really would like to find the bird. I will look again when the sun comes up :-)
If you are plugged into SP there should be no draw on either the house or the chassis batteries as the converter should be charging the house batteries at 13.1+ VDC and the Trombetta should be closed to also allow the converter to charge the chassis battery at the same voltage.

If you are not plugged into SP the Trombetta should be open (de-energized) and the batteries isolated from each other.

You will only here the Trombetta close and open when using the Emergency Start switch if NOT plugged into SP. When plugged into SP the Trombetta is closed most of the time.
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Old 07-21-2021, 06:31 AM   #7
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THOR #24254
Thank you that is what I thought and why I am trying to research this. I have a pole from my chassis battery when plugged into Shore power. And when not plugged into SP and hitting the emergency start switch I hear no clicks. So back to the same situation I think I need to find solenoid and test it. Is that harder than it sounds or a non-professional?
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Old 07-21-2021, 11:52 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by 16ACE27 View Post
If you are plugged into SP there should be no draw on either the house or the chassis batteries as the converter should be charging the house batteries at 13.1+ VDC and the Trombetta should be closed to also allow the converter to charge the chassis battery at the same voltage.

If you are not plugged into SP the Trombetta should be open (de-energized) and the batteries isolated from each other.

You will only here the Trombetta close and open when using the Emergency Start switch if NOT plugged into SP. When plugged into SP the Trombetta is closed most of the time.

I didn't think shore power charged the chassis battery. On my 2018 Chateau it doesn't seem to.


On a class C E450 the Trombetta is located under the coolant reservoir in the driver's side rear of the engine compartment. I'm not sure if it's in a similar location on the ACE.


When I push the Emergency Start switch I do hear the click of the Trombetta energizing. It also energizes a few seconds after starting the engine so that the alternator charges the house batteries.


My Trombetta failed and was not allowing the alternator to charge the house batteries. The symptoms were that the house batteries were not charging and I was getting a low voltage error on the levelers. I thought the batteries were going bad, but new batteries didn't fix the low voltage error. The Trombetta was energizing, but there was a voltage difference between the input and output terminals. This difference shouldn't be more than about 0.2 volts.


I'm not sure how much of this info is relevant to your problem, but hopefully some of the infowill help you troubleshoot your issue.
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Old 07-21-2021, 02:56 PM   #9
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I didn't think shore power charged the chassis battery. On my 2018 Chateau it doesn't seem to.


On a class C E450 the Trombetta is located under the coolant reservoir in the driver's side rear of the engine compartment. I'm not sure if it's in a similar location on the ACE.


When I push the Emergency Start switch I do hear the click of the Trombetta energizing. It also energizes a few seconds after starting the engine so that the alternator charges the house batteries.


My Trombetta failed and was not allowing the alternator to charge the house batteries. The symptoms were that the house batteries were not charging and I was getting a low voltage error on the levelers. I thought the batteries were going bad, but new batteries didn't fix the low voltage error. The Trombetta was energizing, but there was a voltage difference between the input and output terminals. This difference shouldn't be more than about 0.2 volts.


I'm not sure how much of this info is relevant to your problem, but hopefully some of the infowill help you troubleshoot your issue.
All this information is great thank you so much! :-) I just need to find my solenoid and test it. Thank you
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Old 07-21-2021, 03:26 PM   #10
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THOR #7035
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boise Jamo View Post
Thank you that is what I thought and why I am trying to research this. I have a pole from my chassis battery when plugged into Shore power. And when not plugged into SP and hitting the emergency start switch I hear no clicks. So back to the same situation I think I need to find solenoid and test it. Is that harder than it sounds or a non-professional?
Sounds like your Trombetta solenoid may have failed - common issue. An ACE will charge both house AND chassis batteries when plugged into SP if the BIRD/Trombetta are working correctly. As I said, it should be in your battery compartment and is easy to replace. They look pretty much like the old Ford starter relays. This is what I replaced mine with several years ago - remember, Trombetta is a brand name - you just need a continuous duty, low draw solenoid that can handle the main current when closed:



https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B072MZHK48/
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Old 07-22-2021, 01:06 PM   #11
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Model: Hurricane 31D
State: Virginia
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THOR #5638
Easy to test. Disconnect the chassis battery negative terminal and ground wire (simulating a dead battery), press and hold the Emergency Start switch and try and start the engine. If the dash gauges all cycle when you turn the key to run good probability everything is OK but try and start the engine to give the circuit a high power demand test. No start you'll need to dig deeper. Could be the solenoid or could be something else.

Amp loading in the range of 2 or 7 milliamps (could also be written as .002 and .007 amps) could be anything from radio memory, engine ECO memory, a slight ground in an engine sensor to even a false reading on a basic multimeter. In other words it's very, very small.

And lastly, go here - https://www.thormotorcoach.com/owner-resource/ and first create an account then register your Ace. Thor will then build you a package that is specific to your coach regarding all the systems installed. Attached is an example for a 2018 model year coach and on page 13 it shows the solenoid for cross connecting the battery banks.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Hurricane-Windsport 35M, 2018, Schematics (1).pdf (2.94 MB, 24 views)
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Old 07-22-2021, 04:07 PM   #12
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THOR #24254
Awesome thank you!
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